Debates of February 9, 2005 (day 32)

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 345-15(3): Cruel Treatment Of NWT Dogs

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am looking forward to hearing from the Minister when the investigations are concluded. I’m not sure if this will result in someone being charged or anything like that, but just to get an update on the case. But, Mr. Speaker, I don’t believe that this issue only has to do with those six dogs that were found. I had made a reference to those two puppies that were found frozen to death in a dump in Hay River. We’ve also had a report in Tuktoyaktuk where there were some animals frozen in the ice storm. I think really there is a role for the government to play in terms of just making aware and there’s the NWT Dog Act that speaks to how to treat dogs and the inhumane ways. So I would like to know from the Minister what if anything he has done with his Cabinet colleagues to have people more aware of this issue. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 345-15(3): Cruel Treatment Of NWT Dogs

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the NWT Dog Act says that no person shall punish or abuse a dog in a manner or to an extent that is cruel or unnecessary. So we have legislation in place that is intended to ensure that dogs are treated humanely. It is an issue that under this law is administered by Municipal and Community Affairs, because of their relationship with municipalities. The municipalities can pass bylaws respecting the care and control of dogs, as well. So in terms of what Cabinet has done to change our approach, the Cabinet hasn’t, at this point, done anything. I think we are expecting to hear further from the RCMP. The carcasses from the incident in Yellowknife have been sent to the University of Saskatchewan to be autopsied by specialists there to determine whether or not the method of disposal was inhumane, and if so then there is the likelihood or possibility of charges if a suspect could be identified. However, we’re at a very initial stage in that investigation. I think that the events that the Member spoke about in Hay River and in Tuk and Yellowknife have certainly led to a heightened awareness. It’s an issue that MACA and the municipalities will have to also take some interest in in making sure that municipalities follow up on their responsibility as well. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 345-15(3): Cruel Treatment Of NWT Dogs

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I believe municipalities have jurisdiction over this area within their own jurisdiction, but there is a little bit of a gap in situations where these situations happen outside of the municipality, which is the case with the latest six dogs that were found. Mr. Speaker, I understand that there is overlap of jurisdiction not only between these two administrators, but between the levels of government as well, but I don’t think there have been strong statements from the government as a government to say that this is not acceptable. What sort of resources are there, even to the municipalities, to make sure that the legislation in the books is being enforced? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 345-15(3): Cruel Treatment Of NWT Dogs

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the government hasn’t taken a formal position. I can say personally I was certainly supportive of the federal legislation that was proposed before the last election, and I personally would enjoy seeing the federal government bring that legislation back onto the table. But our government can’t create a criminal offence and that is what I think is necessary in order to properly protect animals in our jurisdiction and across Canada. In terms of what we can do further, I expect that my colleague, the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, and myself will examine the current legislation and discuss whether there are ways that we need to take a look at modifying the legislation or bring forward proposals for change to strengthen it. At this point though we haven’t had time to follow up on that concern. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Final supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 345-15(3): Cruel Treatment Of NWT Dogs

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Minister for what he’s suggesting. Mr. Speaker, the Minister has indicated that autopsies are being done, but the final reports are not out. It is encouraging to hear that the RCMP has decided, after a few moments of hesitation, to work with the SPCA and such. Would the Minister commit to work with Minister McLeod and with these two agencies to see how we can tighten up what we have and how to improve what we have? Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 345-15(3): Cruel Treatment Of NWT Dogs

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I will certainly discuss with Mr. McLeod what the options might be for us to examine our legislation. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, with the ongoing exploration and the pipeline preparation work, we are seeing more and more joint ventures between northern and southern businesses. Many people in my region are concerned that our people are not receiving meaningful participation benefits in these joint ventures. Because of this concern, there is no regional strategy in place to look at the type of guidelines these joint ventures are all about and sometimes we don’t know what a genuine Sahtu business is and sometimes we’re even competing against ourselves. So my question today is for the Minister of RWED. Will the Government of the Northwest Territories consider funding a regional workshop or business conference for the Sahtu to discuss this experience to date and the possibility of developing a strategic work plan for joint ventures and other business opportunities? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, Mr. Bell.

Return To Question 346-15(3): Strategy Workshop On Pipeline Development

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and I’d like to thank the Member for the question. The Member knows and I thank him for his interest, but the Member will remember the meeting that we had in my office with some conference organizers who were proposing to do and put on just the type of conference that the Member is speaking of. That was back, I believe, Mr. Speaker, last October. We did have some discussion about what their plans were. I thought it was a very worthwhile initiative and agreed to help them in planning the conference and had provided them some funds to do so. We are waiting on an update to understand better where they are proposing to go and when the time frame would be. I would certainly offer my support and participation in such a conference, especially after having come back just recently from Norman Wells and understanding exactly how important this will be to the region. I think the Member is right; we do have to make every effort to ensure that meaningful, tangible benefits stay in the North and do accrue from these business opportunities that are coming the region’s way. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 346-15(3): Strategy Workshop On Pipeline Development

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, Mr. Minister, for the reminder. I want to ask the Minister of RWED, in light of the support you have given our region in terms of allocating your resources in the region of RWED to assist with this planning, I know the dates have been moved around. I want to ask if the Minister would commit to his department sitting down with our planners and look at some dates that we could actually have a conference. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 346-15(3): Strategy Workshop On Pipeline Development

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Absolutely. It would be my pleasure to do so. I expect that our Sahtu regional staff are in current discussions with the planners of the conference. I know that we have a Sahtu regional petroleum advisor who was working on this initiative, as well. I will certainly ask them for an update. If there is anything I can do personally to lend my support, I am more than happy to do that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question this afternoon is directed to the Honourable Michael McLeod in his capacity as Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs. It relates to the whole issue of being able to provide affordable housing, Mr. Speaker. One of the biggest barriers, the first barrier that communities and developers experience is the lack of access to affordable land for building and development. I wanted to see if the Minister could advise the Assembly what ways he has looked at to make land more affordable and available to community governments. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. The honourable Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, Mr. McLeod.

Return To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we had a number of discussions over the last while with the City of Yellowknife. We have also had a number of discussions as recently as this week with the Yellowknives Dene on the issue of land. Land issues are a big issue in the city of Yellowknife. Affordability is one issue and availability is another. There are, right now, discussions with the aboriginal governments on a process of making land available. We have signed an agreement with the Yellowknives Dene to be able to identify some lands that we could identify in terms of making available in the future. There have also been meetings set up with the Yellowknives and the city to talk about issues that are preventing some of the land acquisition. I have not seen a document yet, but we understand the city is coming forward with a land acquisition request that we will be reviewing very shortly as soon as we see it. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Supplementary To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the information there. I guess I would like to ask the Minister for some more clarification with regard to the status or the position of the Yellowknives Dene or other aboriginal organizations in terms of how land is disposed of or delegated. What is the role there? How does this process work? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. McLeod.

Further Return To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, right now there are two ways to make land available. First of all, it would be through an application through the city, which would then come to us. Under our Interim Measures Agreement with the Yellowknives or the Akaitcho, we would then go through a consultation period of 60 days and have feedback from the aboriginal governments in the area. There is also a mechanism that allows the aboriginal governments to come forward with a request that they would bring to the negotiating table for the requested land through their land claims discussions. Those are the two mechanisms that we have in front of us. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Supplementary To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is useful information. I guess I would like to return to my original theme though, which is how are we making land available that is affordable to build on? We are discussing here a bit of the process of making land available at least around Yellowknife, but I would like to look at what steps we are doing on a territorial basis, Mr. Speaker, to make land for housing more affordable and available in our communities. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. McLeod.

Further Return To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the biggest cost for land and the biggest cost driver for land in Yellowknife is the availability of services, the construction of roads, sewer services, power and water. Right now our focus has been on trying to look at the issue of availability of lands at the city level. We are reviewing the plans that have been put forward by the City of Yellowknife. We are also looking and talking with the Yellowknives Dene in terms of what they plan and what they have plans for their future land requirements. There are also departments that are coming forward with development plans that require land. We are trying to put all of those together. We are not doing anything in terms of looking for land subsidies at this point. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Final supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Supplementary To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is to that last point that I would really like to focus on. This is where I am continuously crowing for our government, Mr. Speaker, to be more aggressive and innovative. Could the Minister tell us, the recent announcements about federal infrastructure money coming into the North, is this potentially going to be something that can help us deliver more affordable land in our communities? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. McLeod.

Further Return To Question 347-15(3): Land For Affordable Housing Alternatives

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there are a number of different initiatives that we have been working on in the last while as a government. We have signed an agreement under the Municipal Rural Infrastructure Funding Program that has $15 million committed to the Northwest Territories which can be used towards development of a number of different infrastructures in the communities. We are also looking at a gas tax agreement that we are hoping to sign in the near future, something this spring. That is also geared towards infrastructure. As part of those infrastructure criteria, lands and bridges, water and waste water and all of those are allowable. Those things certainly can be considered. There is also the Northern Strategy funding that the Premier is heading up that has yet to be determined. There are mechanisms that I believe that we can look at the land issue and ways to lower the cost, especially in Yellowknife.

Of course, we have made a commitment to discuss these issues with the NWT Association of Communities. So we will be starting as early as this weekend, having some discussions on Friday as to where we want to see this money committed. There are a number of different areas that we would like to see. There are a number of areas that some of the smaller communities want to focus on. There are areas that larger centres want to focus on. So there is a lot of work yet to be done and a lot of decisions yet to be made. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My Member’s statement today was about the importance of internal audits and the lack thereof in the sense of human resource capital to do those important jobs. Mr. Speaker, can the Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board tell me exactly how many positions are currently vacant in the Audit Bureau and the average vacancy rates for the past five years? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The honourable Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 348-15(3): Vacancy Rates In The Audit Bureau

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this year we have approximately four positions vacant in the Audit Bureau. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 348-15(3): Vacancy Rates In The Audit Bureau

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister didn’t mention or he left out, probably accidentally, of course, the rate that we have absent for the last five years. How many employees have not been in that position for five years? What is the constant rate of absence in that section? What does the Minister plan to do to staff these positions in the Audit Bureau immediately? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 348-15(3): Vacancy Rates In The Audit Bureau

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, first of all, let me correct my initial response. We have three positions vacant in the year right now, in 2004-05. It has averaged from three to five, so we are about in the area of four percent average over five years' vacancy rate. Not four percent, but four positions average over the five-year period. We continue to try to attract people to those positions. It has been very difficult. I think if we were to survey those in the private sector, we would find that they are having just as much difficulty in getting that type of professional to come north or to take up that side of the ledger, so to speak, Mr. Speaker. We are continuing to recruit and offering our positions out there, so if there are people listening and have the qualifications, please send in your resumes. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 348-15(3): Vacancy Rates In The Audit Bureau

Apparently that public service announcement has been brought to you by the Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board. Mr. Speaker, I have the rates here back to the year 2000. So for the 2000-01 budget, we had six absences. In 2001-02, there were four absences. In 2003-04, we had five absences. The Minister was correct; we had three absences for this past 2004-05 year. Mr. Speaker, I can understand that there is probably little latitude and movement about offering people more pay and whatnot to attract people. I appreciate his little plug there to look for recruitment, but I want to emphasize that I understand equal pay issues will play a role in this, but, Mr. Speaker, we have 25 percent of that area not being staffed. We have one budget year where we are missing six people. That is almost 50 percent of the audit function missing. Mr. Speaker, do we have to wait for something tragic to happen before we start addressing this issue? Will the Minister address this by hiring consultants to conduct these operational value-for-money audits before something goes wrong? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 348-15(3): Vacancy Rates In The Audit Bureau

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Member referenced 2000-01; so looking at the year we are in now, I think we have done significantly better in attracting people to those positions. Where required, and if it is of urgent nature that we have to deal with. We will look outside of our systems, but, again, we have to remind ourselves that we are in a fiscal situation. We have to be careful with how we spend our money, and we are doing the best with what we have available to us. From time to time, if required, we will look at hiring outside of the government service. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 348-15(3): Vacancy Rates In The Audit Bureau

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, Minister Roland, for your good answer. Mr. Speaker, the Minister talked about the fiscal nature. Typically, in the budget, we staff these positions at 100 percent even though we know there are absences in those positions. So the fiscal nature doesn’t apply to this because we resource that area to the fullest of the budget potential of those staffing positions. Twenty-five percent of that job is not being done. That is of urgent nature. So I am not sure what he refers to when he says if it is of an urgent nature, something could be done. They don’t just check for missing money, but they check on accounting processes, they make sure things are going out in a proper ethical way. So I can’t just stand here in good conscience as an elected official watching public funds not being monitored, watching public funds not being put through the normal process of checks and balances. I would like to see the Minister roll up his sleeves right now and say we are going to solve this problem, we are going to make this problem go away. Roll up your sleeves, Mr. Speaker, and get this man into the job he is here to do. I know he can. Thank you.