Debates of January 21, 2004 (day 2)

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Dent. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister what kind of training and credentials are possessed by and required by people who work in our communities as income support workers. Thank you.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Dent.

Return To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Mr. Speaker, I have to say that I'm not entirely familiar with the educational requirements for those positions. I suspect that they may not have specific training requirements to begin with. I know that in the past we have approached community organizations, bands and so on, to offer the program, because it has been seen largely as a fairly simple project to fill in the blanks on a form to determine whether or not income support is available. So I suspect that there may be more training that's required, but I can't answer the question in terms of specific training that's required.

Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think it's very important that we nail that down and figure that out, because the people who come into income support offices do need a lot of assistance and are in a very vulnerable situation most of the time. I'd also like to ask the Minister what support services do these workers have at their disposal, and are they required to refer clients to those services in the communities, such as the ones I referred to in my Member's statement, so that they might not just be back on income support forever, that they might get the kind of help that they need? What kind of services do they get referred to; income support clients? Thank you.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, having answered the question about the training required for income support workers, I think it's also important to say that the expectation is that the workers will take a case management approach. In other words, they're supposed to work with other resources in the community; for instance, the social worker with Health and Social Services who may make available some counselling services. The social worker may have access to psychological assistance if that's necessary, or other tools that may be available. We don’t have the comprehensive program we used to. The Member will probably remember from the 13th Assembly, we had the life skills program called Investing in People. Unfortunately, that program was cost shared with the federal government and when the funding was ended by the federal government, this government didn't have enough money to carry on on its own. So we don't have that kind of comprehensive program, but individuals are still supposed to be able to access counselling that is necessary in order to help them improve their chances of being successful.

Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Also in keeping with the comment that I made in my Member's statement, I was quite shocked and appalled to have learned from income support clients who had received gifts of cash to buy gifts for their children over the Christmas holidays, that when they deposit that in their account and their bank statement is provided to the income support worker, that that was in fact also treated as income and clawed back. I just want to get it on the record from the Minister, is a cash gift at Christmas considered income to a low-income family for the purposes of assessing income support payments? Thank you.

Shame.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Do I hear Scrooge? Mr. Speaker, one way to indicate to Members…The way the program works is kind of like a glass of water. Everybody needs this much water in their glass. If you start with half a glass, then the program will top it up, but all of the water in the glass is counted. So as you have resources, no matter where they come from, they are counted as part of what you bring to the table. The income support program is offered as a…

Shame, shame.

---Laugher

Enjoy your glass of water now. Income support is offered as a program of last resort, it's not a guaranteed income. It is a program that I'm prepared to discuss its administration with the committee and discuss how it should be examined and reviewed, and then we can maybe move from there. But in its current format, it is a program of last resort, and all of your resources, all of an individual's resources that they have, whether that comes from legal winnings or a cash gift, are counted as something in your pocket and all that is provided is then a top-up to get to what is absolutely needed to survive.

Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Also with respect to other sources such as IBA payments, I'd like to ask the Minister what is the status of the government's deliberations on determining whether income benefit agreement payments should be considered as income, or compensation or restitution for land and resources of the people that receive them? Is it income or is it compensation? Thank you.

Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 14-15(2): Training Required For Income Support Workers

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, Education, Culture and Employment has been advised by Justice that the IBAs are private contracts and we do not have access to them, so we are unable at this point to determine the answer to whether or not they are compensation or cash payments as a gift or whatever, income. I am prepared again to review the entire income support program, and would be happy to discuss that with the Standing Committee on Social Programs. But I am reluctant to make any one-off changes. I would like to take the opportunity to spend some time, work with the committee to review the program, and then if we are going to make changes, make them in a comprehensive manner.