Debates of June 1, 2005 (day 6)

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, on March 9th I submitted a written question to the Minister of Housing in regard to information about the EDAP program. The reasoning behind that is because there is an urban legend out there about crazy amounts being given to people. On April 7th I had a great response from the Minister referring to the area I was specifically asking about, which was Yellowknife. It pointed out many detailed pieces of information in Yellowknife. All along I’ve been asking about the transparency issue and why are we giving such large dollars to so few. That’s all I’ve been asking, that’s strictly the point. I’ve been waiting for that information about the transparency to justify those large dollars to, again, so few. So that letter came under signature from the Minister, yet I’m hearing out there in the media that this information is incorrect. So I’ve been asking these questions for over a week and no one has come down to my office, which is 200 feet away from the Minister’s office, to tell me that there were some errors or possibly clerical errors in this information.

Madam Speaker, this affects my work here in the House, it affects the process. So, Madam Speaker, my question to the Minister is, is the letter addressed on April 7th absolutely correct and if there are some small clerical errors in this, would the Minister be willing to update this to the most accurate information as possible if any errors were made whatsoever? Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The Minister responsible for the NWT Housing Corporation, Mr. Krutko.

Return To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy Of Information Provided By The NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I have checked back with the corporation to look at the numbers that have been mentioned in this House and I was made aware by the department that there has been errors in the numbers that were entered. Basically they use a code system and the code that was used was for new construction in regard to EDAP housing. After checking into it, there has been no new construction for EDAP housing in Yellowknife since the year 2000. So because there has been no new construction for new EDAP housing, that is the error in the information that was provided to the Member. I have looked into that and I was hoping to have a chance to sit down with the Member and discuss this, but apparently he released the information. So I am stating it here. I am doing an interview with the media to make them clear that that information was a clerical error where it was put into the wrong category using the wrong entry code for that information. So there is no new EDAP construction dollars for Yellowknife in those years prior to the year 2000.

Thank you, Minister Krutko. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy Of Information Provided By The NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I want to applaud the Minister for clarifying that because no one is above making an error, and certainly a clerical error could happen to anyone out there, and I’m certainly not perfect myself. That being said, this whole issue about the transparency of this program, I’m still trying to get justification as to why we give such large grants to so few. So, Madam Speaker, I ask the question to the Minister, why are we giving such large grants to so few and would he provide those details of transparency so we can move forward on this issue? Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Minister Krutko.

Further Return To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy Of Information Provided By The NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I would just like to remind the Member that we do have to ensure that we follow up the ATIPP confidential information, not to disclose information that is classified as confidential or of a personal nature. So I would just like to remind the Member we cannot provide information that is confidential or basically has a disclosure on those contractual agreements or mortgages that are in place. There’s certain information that cannot be released to Members.

Just in regard to the Member’s question, Madam Speaker, I tried to explain this the last number of days. The whole idea of EDAP was to assist people to move from public housing into home ownership. It’s for those people who are social clients. Once they get a job and are able to sustain themselves and they can show that they are paying their rent and they are able to maintain some sort of home ownership, then we basically move to those clients. The first offers were supposed to be given to those clients. So I would just like to mention to the Member that it may seem to be a little high, but it’s based on where you require a house. So I think it is important that we realize that the whole EDAP program was originally intended for low income people and a decision was made three years ago to allow communities such as Yellowknife, Inuvik and Hay River to expand a little more for those people looking for down payment assistance to get a first mortgage because the cost of development was so high they could not afford it. The whole intent of the program is to assist people with low incomes, get them out of public housing and be able to get them into home ownership. Thank you.

Thank you, Minister Krutko. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy Of Information Provided By The NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I’ll recognize the Minister’s passion for getting people out of public housing into personal home ownership but before we move on too far, I would like to hear from the Minister because we did talk about that $109,000. If the Minister could clarify exactly when they realized when there was a clerical error and why they didn’t come down to my office immediately to clarify this, because this has been an issue out there for a week. A lot of people are very concerned about this. So when did this information come forward to the Minister that the letter he had sent to me under his signature had a clerical error and why they didn’t come and clarify this with me immediately? Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Minister Krutko.

Further Return To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy Of Information Provided By The NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I took the information two days ago to the people at the Housing Corporation and asked them for clarification on the information that was mentioned in this House in regard to numbers that were mentioned by the Member. During that time, that is when they made it clear to me that those dollars were not expended in Yellowknife for new construction in regard to EDAP. So it’s a matter of the information getting back to the Member. I was in the process because I know that there is a confidential matter now that we have to consider that not having this information revealed to the public, which could jeopardize our ATIPP responsibilities to ensure we protect the interests and the information. It is private and I cannot release it to anyone who may have it out there in the public. So that was a concern that we had. We wanted to make sure that we were aboveboard and we were not breeching any responsibilities that we have. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. A brief final supplementary and a brief answer. We have more people on the list and we have only made it through eight sets of questions in the last hour. Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy Of Information Provided By The NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. I didn’t get satisfaction on the answer. Why didn’t the Minister, if he identified there was a mistake or a clerical error in the information, rush down to my office or send a note down to say there was a small mistake and we pause this issue for one moment until we get clear absolute numbers? Why didn’t I get that note on Monday if he says it appeared two days ago? Why didn’t he slow the process down, because I certainly would have given him the gracious opportunity to get the absolute number? Why didn’t he come speak to me about that? Thank you, Madam Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 76-15(4): Accuracy of Information Provided by the NWTHC

Thank you, Madam Speaker. Madam Speaker, I think because the information that the Member is talking about showed up in the hands of the press, I felt that it wasn’t for me to release any more information until I was sure that I was following aboveboard that this information was not going to be released publicly and that we also realize whether we’re breaching ATIPP legislation. So I had to ensure the protection of the clients were first ensured, that their information did not fall into the wrong envelope that would have ended up somewhere else. Thank you.