Debates of June 2, 2004 (day 18)

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 197-15(3): Repatriation Of Disabled Clients In Southern Institutions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Surely that's not what I'm suggesting, for the Minister to do anything willy-nilly. I don't mind breaking out into a song, "I Can't Get No Satisfaction,"…

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…as long as I'm doing that on behalf of my constituents and people of the North. Mr. Speaker, he has not answered the question about whether or not, first of all, he knows about these four facilities. Have any of the hundreds of staff that he has under his supervision looked at these buildings? Has that come onto his radar screen? Could the Minister commit to look at these buildings and see if they are at all usable? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 197-15(3): Repatriation Of Disabled Clients In Southern Institutions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the level of the Member's satisfaction is the level of detail I don't think I really need as the Minister. However, I will attempt to respond once again. These are very specialized placements, they're not necessarily institutions, they're supported living, there are multiple needs, some of them very complex that require specialized care. Are we looking at this? Yes, we are.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Your final supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 197-15(3): Repatriation Of Disabled Clients In Southern Institutions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm not asking any of the Ministers to satisfy me…

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…I'm asking the Ministers to do their jobs and use the money wisely. Mr. Speaker, I want to say that I'm not looking for all these 25 or 35 adults to be put together. I understand that they all have different needs. But we know for a fact that it was enough, it was satisfactory to put 10 people together in a facility in Edmonton. If it's good enough for them, it's good enough for us. Would the Minister consider putting them together into any of these facilities we have? Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 197-15(3): Repatriation Of Disabled Clients In Southern Institutions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this is not a facility with one huge roof like Wal-Mart. We're talking about individual living accommodations and supports for people with complex needs. I have indicated to the Members involved that I would be happy to look towards arranging a tour down to Capital Health in Edmonton to look at all our health services…

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…and all our social services that we contract with them. We did it in the last assembly and it was a very informative tour for myself and the Members who went along, and I would be willing to look at arranging that again. We are looking at the individual needs, the individual clients. The intent is to put them into as home-like supportive living as possible, as opposed to any kind of major institution where they are just housed with dozens of other people. That's not the intent here. We are trying to respond to individual clients, many of whom are very complex. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today in my Member’s statement I spoke about the need for the telephone to be an allowable expense under the act. I spoke about the fact that many government services, such as the Department of Health and Social Services’ new Tele-Care line, are not accessible to people without a phone. It’s hard for people to get a job if a potential employer can’t get hold of them in a timely fashion. My question for the Minister is whether his department is considering, under the income support program, including basic telephone as an allowable expense. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Minister of Education, Culture and Employment, Mr. Dent.

Return To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is no intent within the department to review the program right now to include the cost of telephone as one of the basic expenses. The expectation is that the amount that’s in the program is one that allows people to make choices as to what they will spend their money on. I recognize that there are some who feel the program is not adequate, but I have started the process of discussing with the standing committee the adequacy of the program and we have had some initial discussions and are planning to carry that on through the month of June. I am prepared to work with the Standing Committee on Social Programs to discuss the program, make sure that everyone is aware of how it functions, and then see if we can agree on whether there should be any changes made. But I am not going to launch off and make any commitments to any changes at this point. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Minister for his answer. Could the Minister reply with some further clarity as to whether he would be willing to consider a telephone expense as an allowable expense under the income support program? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I said, I have already begun the process of reviewing the program with the standing committee and listen to the committee and work with them as we work through this. Stipulated expenses like rent, for instance, we pay the actual cost. The overall allowance that comes out, we expect people will make choices as to what they spend the money on. Therefore, at this point, it’s up to clients whether they believe the telephone is an essential expense. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, would the Minister provide any comment in relation to timeline for issues to be discussed like making the telephone an allowable expense under income support, and will he be allowing public input on that type of expense? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. No, I am not planning any public process. There have been enough reviews of the income support program over the course of the last nine years and I don’t think we need to do that again. I hear from advocates quite regularly. I have committed that I will work with the standing committee. The Member is on that committee, so he knows we have had an initial briefing and there is another briefing planned for later this month, at which we will see if we can move things along. As is the process here, if any changes are to be made to a program which will impact it fiscally, that has to be worked through the business planning process and the business plans will be presented to committees in September. That is the timetable for any changes to be seen by Members of this House for proposal. That would mean they would be implemented then in the course of the next budget, which is April 1, 2005. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Your final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If the Minister could comment specifically what is holding up the telephone being considered an allowable expense? Basic telephone service is no longer a luxury of the modern day. I would quantify it as just as important as rent and food. So can the Minister explain that, please? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 198-15(3): Eligible Income Support Expenses

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess there is a question as to which is more important. The program pays right now the full cost of rent. So there is an agreement that is not calculated as part of the amount that you have to justify. The program does pay the full cost, but most other things are considered the client’s choice. The expenses are added up as to what a person has and brings to the table, and then an amount is provided as a top up. So it’s entirely up to people right now to decide whether they choose to spend the money on a phone. It’s essential to point out that there have been arguments that our program is not efficient, we have way above anybody else in terms of benefits. There is nobody else in Canada that comes close to what we provide in benefits in income support. So it’s a very good program. Does it need to have attention paid to it? It probably does. That’s why I am committed to reviewing it with the standing committee. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In my Member’s statement, I made reference to seasonal and healthy lifestyles enjoyed by the people of the Mackenzie Delta and elsewhere across the Territories. I want to ask the Minister of RWED if he would assess the priority of his department, so that we can have a designated renewable resource economist assigned to the Inuvik region. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Allen. The honourable Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, Mr. Bell.

Return To Question 199-15(3): Supporting Traditional Harvesting Lifestyle

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This is something that the Member and I and my department have been in some discussion about, not the specific position of a renewable resource economist, but more to the point of what we need to look at with renewable resources, work with communities to better understand where there are economic opportunities that are acceptable to the communities and economic opportunities that individual entrepreneurs would like to pursue. We do have business development people in the regions who can be actively engaged in this regard. It’s probably more appropriate than renewable resource officers, who have had a slightly different mandate, as the Member knows. Certainly it has merit. This discussion is important as we look to understand and identify opportunities that will allow us to take full advantage, especially of traditional lifestyles. Certainly this is a message that I have sent to the department and we are in discussion about how to pursue this course of action. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Supplementary, Mr. Allen.

Supplementary To Question 199-15(3): Supporting Traditional Harvesting Lifestyle

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the context of the Minister’s reply, I want to commend the department for their continued support of the fur harvesters’ program, fur pricing program. I think it’s important as well to make the Minister aware that even though there is some renewed interest in how they are going to address the renewable resource sector, I still think it’s important that they consider the fact that we need to have the same level of investment in the renewable resource sector to mitigate some of the socioeconomic impacts that the pipeline proposal would bring, so we can continue to enhance that level of lifestyle. I certainly hope the Minister would respond to the question of whether his department would support this subsistence-based lifestyle that is enjoyed by most communities and will be directly impacted by the pipeline. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Allen. Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 199-15(3): Supporting Traditional Harvesting Lifestyle

Thank you. I will certainly commit to continue with the programs we are currently providing in this regard. I think they are very important and very worthwhile. The member has indicated a couple and we’ve received a lot of response from other jurisdictions who really envy the fur pricing program and suggest that this is unprecedented support for that industry. I would also like to add that this government recognizes the need to diversify our economy and ensure that we aren’t solely reliant on mining, oil and gas development. There are a lot of tourism opportunities and a lot of renewable resource opportunities. It is important for us to pay a lot of attention to these sectors because they are sustainable and they will be here, be with us and be strong going forward if, in fact, we provide that level of support. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Supplementary, Mr. Allen.

Supplementary To Question 199-15(3): Supporting Traditional Harvesting Lifestyle

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We quite often talk amongst ourselves about the importance of supporting the renewable resource sector, but I haven’t seen any dialogue to date on the level of discussions. Is the Minister continuing to dialogue with the aboriginal corporation on the Gwich’in Tribal Council to try to enhance some of their motions that were presented during their board of directors meetings to facilitate and promote the renewable resource sector? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Allen. Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 199-15(3): Supporting Traditional Harvesting Lifestyle

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Certainly we are having a lot of discussion internally in the department, but we do recognize the need to work very closely with our aboriginal government partners, with aboriginal development organizations. Obviously much of this activity will be grassroots driven. It’s not something that the government is interested nor should impose on regions. This should be to the comfort level of the individual communities and regions, but we want to work with them to help them understand and identify opportunities that there may be as we analyze world markets, because there really are a lot of resources we can tap into and we don’t have to be solely focussed on the ones that obviously jump to mind in terms of diamonds, gold and oil and gas. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question today is for the honourable Minister Michael Miltenberger. In my Member’s statement today, I talked about the uncertainty facing clients in the Northwest Territories who are currently living in the facility operated by the Aboriginal Partners and Youth Society. While I sympathize with the troubles of the society, I have too, as a legislator, recognized there are certain standards and criteria that have to be met by this government to continue other contractual relationships. I cannot advocate a cause that would open them up for lawsuits. This would be irresponsible as a legislator. This being said, Mr. Speaker, I wonder if the Minister of Health and Social Services can provide this House with information on the programs and services offered by the proposed new contractor as they relate to aboriginal people. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Miltenberger.

Return To Question 200-15(3): Aboriginal Youth And Partners Society

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We would be happy to provide this House, to the Chair of Social Programs, the package of information that we have as it relates to Integrated Services in Edmonton and the various components of the programs and services they offer. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 200-15(3): Aboriginal Youth And Partners Society

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I look forward to the information from the Minister. In saying all this, I also want to ask the Minister and his officials what they are planning to do to inform these nine clients who are in Edmonton about the facility. Not so much the clients, but look at the families of these people rather than just having a phone call to the families. What is his department doing to talk to the families? I know it’s a sensitive issue and I would appreciate a phone call from any department of this government to let me know what’s happening to someone who is close to me. I think we need to make the personal touch and reach out and touch someone, as someone from the phone company says.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 200-15(3): Aboriginal Youth And Partners Society

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have had staff down in Edmonton now for almost three weeks, senior staff working through the situation and dealing with the clients on a daily basis. We’ve also made sure, as we have tried to keep everybody informed, that the families have been informed. Some of them are very active in this particular issue. If there is more to be done, then I would be glad to take advice from the Member to see what that would be in terms of keeping the families better involved and informed. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 200-15(3): Aboriginal Youth And Partners Society

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, one of the concerns of the families is the new services being proposed by this government to be used by the clients who are in Edmonton is that Integrated Services may not be a good move. Some of the families indicated that the Aboriginal Partners and Youth Society has a really good program and are afraid that their clients would not receive the same type of programs by this new proposed facility. What steps will the Minister take to ensure that the new contractor meets the needs of the aboriginal clients who are being suggested to move to the new contractor? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 200-15(3): Aboriginal Youth And Partners Society

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We, as a government, have taken all the steps at this point we believe are necessary. We’ve made arrangements with Integrated Services. We, along with Nunavut and the Alberta government, no longer place clients with APYS. The issue of the aboriginal and cultural component is one that’s been addressed. Integrated Services is tied into services in Edmonton with the group Bent Arrow and the friendship centres. We are working with them to make sure that the northern content is there. Once the clients move, we can deal with issues like northern foods and that sort of thing. So we are very sensitive to the issue the Member has raised. We’ve made the case to ensure that is clearly addressed and we will continue to work with Integrated Services to ensure that that component of the program is strong and robust. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Your final supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 200-15(3): Aboriginal Youth And Partners Society

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I heard talk of $1 million for nine clients who are living in Edmonton. It’s hard for families, Mr. Speaker, to visit their loved ones who are so far away in Edmonton. It seems to me that it’s high time this government takes a hard look at some steps to repatriate some of these people or all the people back up North in the many facilities that can be used. Some Members have indicated to the House which facilities are located in the North. Can the Minister tell me, tell the House and tell families and people in the Northwest Territories, what concrete steps his department is taking with regard to repatriating our people back to the Northwest Territories? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.