Debates of March 17, 2004 (day 2)

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I should add that a program similar to this, in probably the exact same kind of positive wording, was introduced in last year's budget, except that it was for about $1 million. In the discussions of that item, we found out there were a lot more details that had to be worked out so that money ended up not being spent, now it has been reduced to $300,000.

Anyway, Mr. Speaker, I think the people in industry will tell you that if the government is really strapped for cash, if you create more housing for cities like Yellowknife where there is a huge shortage, you'll have more people coming to the Territories and it will give you more money. Whereas right now we have people leaving. We have even our local, aboriginal people leaving the Territories because some houses are up to $500,000. So why wouldn’t the Cabinet follow the path that was followed by the last Assembly, and that addressed the high cost of lot development in tax-based communities?

Minister of Finance.

Further Return To Question 14-15(3): Lot Development Assistance

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there have been past initiatives that were tried by previous governments to enhance building in market communities that were being impacted by increased resource development. We find after a while, though, that those initiatives get adjusted to by the market and get incorporated. I speak specifically of past governments who instituted a program of giving $10,000 additional to potential purchasers so that they could afford their new homes. We found that any subsidy that we have like that soon gets swallowed up by the system and just drives up the prices in that area.

We feel that with the land development in non-tax-based communities, one of the things that is happening is because the smaller communities are on the outskirts of development, larger centres are being able to take advantage of that development where small communities aren't. It's still very expensive to develop any kind of a lot program. At one time in previous governments, there used to be programs for municipal governments to develop land areas in their communities. That was removed and tried to be incorporated into the system. It hasn't worked successfully. This is an avenue to try to bring some development into the smaller communities. Thank you.

Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 14-15(3): Lot Development Assistance

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think in reading this item it’s apparent that this is a very modest initiative. It is something that would be funding developers to do very technical things -- geotechnical investigations, legal and engineering surveys -- which I would argue is something that the government should be doing anyway. Why are we continuing to be discriminatory and treating non-tax-based communities and tax-based communities unfairly? I think this is the kind of thing the government should do anyway. It would reduce the cost for municipal governments who have to provide these lots. Would the Minister reconsider that? Thank you.

Minister of Finance.

Further Return To Question 14-15(3): Lot Development Assistance

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I stated earlier, in market communities where there’s competition for developers and construction trades, there is room for that competitive spirit. Developing of lots is up to the municipalities to see what they can make available. It is expensive for them, but they do have the tools and avenues that they are able to do that. Non-tax-based or the general taxation area -- it should be correctly terminated as general taxation areas -- there is not the flexibility and the revenue for them to look at the high cost of just developing for small housing projects, whether it’s two or three or four lots. This initiative, we feel, is moving in that area which will allow those communities to better house people who would come and work in their community or even long-time residents in their communities. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I addressed several pertinent points to the Premier during the question period of March 16th, that was yesterday, with very little confirmation on whether he was willing to introduce a bill of intent to seek provincial status for the Northwest Territories. In review of the unedited Hansard, I feel it requires further clarification of the rights of aboriginal peoples of Canada, part II of schedule B in the Constitution Act of 1982 as it applies to aboriginal peoples in the NWT Act. So, Mr. Speaker, I’m going to ask the Justice Minister, who is the legal advisor to the Executive Council, if the Aboriginal Summit has constitutional status for negotiation on the devolution and resource revenue sharing. How is it constitutionally entrenched in the NWT Act? Those are my questions to the Minister of Justice. Thank you.

Minister of Justice, Mr. Dent.

Return To Question 15-15(3): Constitutional Questions Related To Attaining Provincehood

Mr. Speaker, that’s considerably more detail than I have at my fingertips, so I’ll take that question as notice.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the honourable Member responsible for RWED brought to my attention an initiative that was called integrated arts strategy to support art and culture in the NWT. Part of this strategy is designed to bring support to the arts and craft industry. Current and immediate actions proposed in the integrated arts strategy are supported by having raw materials and equipment available for people out there. This strategy, as the honourable Member stated in his letter to me, is to be completed by early 2004. Since the time is nearing, my question for the Minister of RWED is what is the present status of this initiative and how does the Minister see this initiative being rolled out?

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Return To Question 16-15(3): Integrated Arts Strategy

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to thank the Member for bringing this question to the House and also for raising this prior to today with me. I’ve had a chance to discuss this with the department and, as the Member knows, our department is working with the Department of Education, Culture and Employment to roll out this integrated arts strategy, and we are optimistic that by summer we will have this integrated arts strategy and be able to articulate our vision for meeting some of the gaps that we see in current arts support and development.

Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 16-15(3): Integrated Arts Strategy

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I wanted to thank the Minister for recognizing that there are gaps in the system, because that leads me very nicely into my next question. What is the Minister’s plan to ensure that the gaps are filled for supplying raw materials to the public out there who wish to continue the traditional lifestyle of the arts and craft industry? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 16-15(3): Integrated Arts Strategy

Thank you. I will acknowledge that there are gaps in our support where the traditional economy is concerned, but I’d also like to highlight the fact that the Department of RWED does offer grants to small businesses. Arts and crafts businesses are absolutely eligible and do qualify and we have given grants in the past to the arts sector. In addition, we have the business development fund which provides contributions of up to $25,000 for a wide range of business needs. Arts businesses would obviously qualify, as well, here.

So I think we haven’t been excluding the arts and crafts sector. Can we do more? Yes, I believe we can. The Member has proposed something to do with raw materials and I will give the Member my commitment that we’ll address this in some manner in the upcoming strategy.

I would say that we’re not in the position to get into the game of outright subsidies for raw materials. I think that will cause us problems. Any time you get into the free market and start to distort the pricing of these products, I don’t think that probably is somewhere that we want to go. I’m not proposing that we will do that, but we will discuss the availability of raw materials. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 16-15(3): Integrated Arts Strategy

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Could the Minister provide all the Members of the Assembly the action plan that will show the steps to be taken to complete this initiative and how his department plans to maintain this strategy? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 16-15(3): Integrated Arts Strategy

Yes, I will do that. The action plan was submitted to and approved by Cabinet of the past government in August 2003, and then Minister Jake Ootes tabled a response in the House in October 2003. Now we’re talking about the planned development of the integrated arts strategy and we will articulate the implementation of that and I’ll make sure that all Members have a copy of that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I’d like to bring up an issue that has been talked about for too long in the past government. Today we heard a budget address that addresses us going forward in a new direction and bringing prosperity to our country. The issue that I’m talking about, Mr. Speaker, is the BIP policy. I want to ask my questions to the Minister of RWED today, but I’m sure that this issue is going to be around now for awhile and eventually I’ll have some questions for the Premier on it.

Over the life of the 14th Legislative Assembly we spent probably two years going around the Northwest Territories consulting with people, looking at draft changes to the business incentive policy and the word was back that we should not change the business incentive policy. We should leave it as is. It’s a government policy and the government should administer it as such. I would like to ask the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development, is there another move afoot to make changes to the business incentive policy? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Return To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

No, Mr. Speaker. At this point there is no intention on the part of this government to change the business incentive policy. Of course, we would always listen to the suggestions of committee, should they suggest that we would consider it. But our feeling is at this point that we would not be proposing any change. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Supplementary To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if there are no changes to the business incentive policy, is the Minister aware of any of the departments within the government that are putting out contracts and not applying the business incentive policy to them? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

I am aware that the Housing Corporation has gone to the marketplace for the provision of housing in non-market communities and the BIP is being waived on this provision of housing.

Supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Supplementary To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, if this is a government policy and it’s to be applied government-wide, how does the Housing Corporation get to waive the BIP on a contract that they put out? Who do they get permission from? Is it from RWED or is it from the government itself, the Cabinet? Where do they get permission to waive the BIP on a contract? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

Thank you. My understanding is that the Housing Corporation approached Cabinet in the past Assembly and made the case that the provision of housing in non-market communities had to be done in the most cost-effective manner. They had concerns that this couldn’t be achieved with the BIP in place and asked Cabinet to direct that they be allowed to waive the BIP on this contract. Thank you.

Final supplementary, Mr. Delorey.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it’s really unfortunate that we spent so much time on this very issue over the last four years and we have so many issues in front of us right now, big issues to deal with with this government, and I’m very much afraid that this issue is going to rear its ugly head again and take up an awful lot of our time. I’m aware of other departments that are looking at playing with the BIP, whether it’s the local preference or the 15 percent on different contracts. If this government has the BIP policy and if they feel that it’s an important policy to this government, then I say that we stick to it. If not, let’s do away with the BIP. But let’s do one or the other. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of RWED, Mr. Bell.

Sorry, Mr. Speaker. I apologize. I did miss the question, if the Member could just restate the question. Thank you.

Mr. Delorey, restate the question.

Supplementary To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the question was, is the Minister aware if the government still considers this policy to be beneficial to the government?

Minister of RWED.

Further Return To Question 17-15(3): Business Incentive Policy

Yes, Mr. Speaker, the government does believe that this is a policy that provides benefit to the people of the Northwest Territories, has a validity and we certainly continue to support it. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question today is for the Minister of Finance and it has something to do with the budget address that was presented to us earlier today. An omission from that, I do believe, was travel and that the government was going to go department by department and reduce 25 percent of the overall travel budget. Having gone through the draft mains the last two-and-a-half weeks, it was very difficult for me to get a firm handle on which departments were spending what in terms of travel. I know there was a 25 percent reduction, but the real numbers were very hard to get to, Mr. Speaker. It seemed to me that in order to arrive at a travel budget it was the number of employees times about $10,000 and that’s what the department arrived at in terms of a travel budget. So I’m asking the Minister if he could supply myself and other regular Members with what the real numbers are in terms of travel for each department of this government. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Finance, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 18-15(3): Reductions To Departmental Travel Budgets

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Member is correct. We’ve told departments that there will be a 25 percent reduction for the upcoming year on discretionary travel. Non-discretionary travel such as medical travel, student financial assistance, those things, court appearances, court duty travel, have not been touched. So it’s been discretionary travel. Those are difficult to follow through the business plans. Members will have the opportunity when each department comes forward to get specific details from them and we’ll inform departments that they should be ready with that information. We could try and gather the information for past years, but for the upcoming year it would be difficult because within each department, there may be health boards and education boards and so on and it would be difficult to actually take out an actual amount that they’ve specified, because a lot of it is built in to either a directorate function or another wing of their department. It would be fairly difficult to get that kind of detail. I’ll inform all Ministers and their departments that they should be ready with as much detail as they have when they come before Committee of the Whole with their specific departments. Thank you.

Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 18-15(3): Reductions To Departmental Travel Budgets

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, Mr. Minister, for the response. Yes, it was very difficult as a regular Member to arrive at what the real numbers were, so if the Minister can ask the deputy ministers and the other Ministers of the departments to allow us to see what the real costs are in terms of travel, I think that would be beneficial for us. I know there’s a 25 percent reduction. I don’t know if that goes far enough. I don’t know the real numbers, so it’s very hard to make a decision of what we should do with that, Mr. Speaker.

I guess my final question is can we get the real numbers? I know he’s going to ask, but I want to know if we can get the real numbers on travel, department by department. The medical travel, the student financial travel, things like that, that’s not what we’re trying to tackle here. We’re trying to tackle the travel that’s really unnecessary in this government. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Minister of Finance.

Further Return To Question 18-15(3): Reductions To Departmental Travel Budgets