Debates of October 22, 2004 (day 26)

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 285-15(3): Spill At Jackfish Power Plant

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, even if the plant is not in full use, it is situated practically in the middle of the city, next to a lake that people frequent for recreational uses and for other reasons. It is important that that facility be monitored and the safety is taken care of so that environmental disasters don’t happen that affect the people. Mr. Speaker, I understand that extra security would monitor it, but you still need operators on standby in case something happens. I don’t know if the security is enough. Mr. Speaker, there are varying numbers as to how much oil was spilled. It was initially reported by the company that 3,000 litres were spilled. There is an employee who is suggesting that up to 50,000 litres were spilled. The latest report a couple of days ago suggests that it was 13,000 litres, which is still 10,000 more than what the company was suggesting. I would like to know what investigation has gone on to determine exactly what happened, how much was spilled, and how to prevent this from happening. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The honourable Premier, Mr. Handley.

Further Return To Question 285-15(3): Spill At Jackfish Power Plant

Mr. Speaker, I will answer the last question. Mr. Speaker, the Power Corporation has a way of calculating the amount of fuel that is used, that is by measuring how much the fuel has gone down in a tank. They know that, in running the engines, some of the fuel is consumed by the generators when they are started up and when they run. When they first did the calculation, they made an error in the amount of hours that the generators were running and estimated something over 3,000 litres. They have since done a closer calculation and are now pretty comfortable that 13,000 litres is the amount that was spilled. I don’t know how the employee who mentioned 50,000 litres calculated that or where that came from. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Short supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 285-15(3): Spill At Jackfish Power Plant

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It seems to me that the federal government is somehow involved in investigating this. Could I ask the Minister to tell us whether or not the GNWT is responsible for monitoring and enforcing and cleaning this, or is it the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The honourable Premier, Mr. Handley.

Further Return To Question 285-15(3): Spill At Jackfish Power Plant

Mr. Speaker, the lead department on these kinds of spills is the Department of Indian and Northern Affairs. Having said that, Mr. Speaker, because of the size of the spill, if Environment Canada chose to become involved, they have the right to become involved as well because of the size of the spill. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Your final supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 285-15(3): Spill At Jackfish Power Plant

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the opportunity for final supplementary. Mr. Speaker, the report suggests that the workforce at the plant, for whatever reasons and maybe for valid reasons, has been reduced from 10 to four, and there are no longer operators beyond 5:00 p.m. where it used to be monitored 24 hours a day. There seems to be a lot of morale problems. There always is when there are changes going on in a facility like that. There are people who have been working there for many decades. I would like to know if the Minister would speak to the corporation to make sure that all the workers there know what is going on, what the future plan of the plant is, what they should be expecting and that their concerns and grievances are dealt with. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Handley.

Further Return To Question 285-15(3): Spill At Jackfish Power Plant

Mr. Speaker, there are always morale problems whenever any operation reduces staff and so on. At one time, we did need a lot of operators when the two mines were operating, the city was growing, and we were using the diesel power from the Jackfish plant a lot. But now, with the two mines closed, with the Bluefish onside, we don’t need the number of operators, so we have cut back, and that has caused morale problems. I have spoken to a couple of the workers myself. I will pass this information on to the Power Corporation, as well. Mr. Speaker, the reality is that we just don’t need as many as we did before because we are not using that plant as much. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question today is for the Minister of Justice who, earlier in the sitting of the House, stood up and mentioned the fact that employees at North Slave Correctional Centre could speak out without a fear of retribution from management at that centre. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask the Minister of Justice if, indeed, employees are being targeted at the North Slave Correctional Centre for conduct that they do in terms of questioning management. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Minister of Justice, the Honourable Mr. Dent.

Return To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, employees are certainly not targeted for speaking to the investigators from corporate human resources about human resource practices within Justice. In fact, nobody in the Department of Justice has access to those interviews, so there is nobody out there who has any idea of what may have been said. So, no, there would be no targeting of employees for that.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have been getting a number of phone calls and e-mails. One e-mail was even titled "The Department of Injustice," Mr. Speaker. There is a disturbing situation that occurred recently with an employee being terminated at the North Slave Correctional Centre; an employee, Mr. Speaker, that indeed was speaking out against management practices and the hiring process at North Slave Correctional Centre. I find it to be quite a coincidence. A day after he was assaulted by an inmate, he was relieved of his duties as a correctional guard at that centre. It is a very big coincidence, Mr. Speaker, that this employee was one of the more vocal employees there. I was just wondering if the Minister is aware of this situation and when he may be able to get me some answers as to what happened to this individual. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would say that it is not appropriate in this venue to discuss an issue like this. I would invite the Member, if he is interested in further information, to approach either myself or Mr. Roland, who is responsible for the public service, to discuss issues such as this. But I will not respond in this House.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the reason I bring it up here today is because this might be the only venue where I might get some answers as to what happened at the North Slave Correctional Centre. What is happening out at the North Slave Correctional Centre? I haven’t really been happy with any of the responses I received from what is happening there. It seems to be quite secretive. Mr. Speaker, if the Minister doesn’t want to answer the question about what happened to the employee who was assaulted one day and fired the next, I am wondering, Mr. Speaker, when he might be able to address this with me. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister responsible for the public service has advised me that the review of human resource practices is underway, and that, in the not-too-distant future, a report will be available that will be provided to Members on their findings. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. Final supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am just wondering if the Minister is aware of some concern among employees at the North Slave Correctional Centre, that management does indeed have a list of targeted employees, Mr. Speaker, that they have singled out and that they are going after, Mr. Speaker. Is the Minister aware of this list being in existence? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 286-15(3): Labour Concerns At The North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I do not believe such a list exists. Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, I would just like to pick up where the honourable Member for Tu Nedhe left off with regards to civic leave. My questions are for the Minister responsible for FMBS. I am sure the Minister is aware that smaller communities are generally at least 50 to 70 percent staff of government. In order to run the many boards and councils that are needed for the communities, a lot of these people offer their volunteer time, Mr. Speaker. Constituents in the Nahendeh riding are particularly concerned about regional manager's interpretation of the rules with regard to civic leave. Does the Minister have a system in place, Mr. Speaker, where the interpretation is clear across all departments? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Minister responsible for the Financial Management Board, the Honourable Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as I said earlier, it has been recognized that with our fragmented system of human resource management throughout the Government of the Northwest Territories, many issues of this nature do arise. That is why we have taken the effort to pull that together so that we will have a better process in place, and the same interpretations of our rules would be enforced, worked on and delivered. We do recognize that and are working to make that better so that all employees would have the same understanding of what is available to them.

I haven’t been made aware of the specific issues of different areas, but in our manual it is fairly clear as to who is able to take leave and at what time. There is some discretion when it comes to maintaining whatever environment it is where we have staff working. We can’t have everybody going off to different areas at the same time and leaving us unable to do the work that is required on a daily basis. There is some discretion in existing policies, but, yes, we are working to ensure that everybody will have the same understanding. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Menicoche.

Supplementary To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess, specifically, there are instances in the community where I am from, in Fort Simpson, where community band councils are involved in strategy sessions. It takes a lot of time during luncheon meetings. That is where some of the employees have been having a problem, Mr. Speaker. The rules that exist really don’t address luncheon meetings. I was wondering if the Minister has any comments in that regard. Often employees have to meet beyond lunch hour, beyond 2:00. Does the Minister know if it is in the existing guidelines to extend employees at least perhaps an hour or two through lunch hours and classified as civic leave? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, an employee is eligible for up to 15 days annually. That amount cannot be booked or gone over. It is fairly clear there that there are 15 days. That can be broken down into whatever number, a half-day at a time, a few hours at a time, and put into practice that way. There isn’t a process in place to say that they met during lunch hour and need to take a different time for that process. That isn’t built in. If their meetings go over, and it is part of the allowable reasons for civic leave, then, again, it would be just a matter of applying for the hour that they were sitting and doing work, as eligible under the civic leave policy. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Menicoche.

Supplementary To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I guess if anything, it’s just to make the Minister aware and if he can convey that to his department, that it occurs, it’s unplanned where the meetings go beyond the lunch hour. But I’m still quite concerned about the administration of civic leave, with regard to different departments administering it differently. There are still cases where, say on this particular band council there are members from four different departments and only two of them will get approved for specific strategy sessions. Does the Minister have any current plans to have a level playing field when it comes to administering civic leave? Thank you.

Thank you Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, our civic leave is considered one of the most generous across the land as to how we make time available for employees to go and do work with other agencies, and it’s because we understand in small communities there is a need for this from time to time. But each case is going to have to be looked at individually, if members from a different band or department may have used up their time or if there are potential conflict issues with the issues that are going to be addressed in their work within the department they have. So there are a number of factors that come into play, and each one would still have to be dealt with on an individual basis, but the policy itself will be understood across the board. That’s our goal as we go forward with our work around human resource management. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Menicoche.

Supplementary To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It wasn’t clear in the Minister’s answer whether they are going to undertake to have a good, solid review of the policy. I am particularly concerned with the many, many boards that the community has. There are a couple of them that are just as important, but they are not on this approved list, Mr. Speaker. So I would like to ask the Minister responsible when will he be looking at reviewing the policy? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 287-15(3): Policies Respecting Civic Leave

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue of civic leave has come up with respect the overall policy, and I have done a review and discussed with my Cabinet colleagues the potential issues and avenues that we had. It was felt that we leave it at the existing stage. Now it becomes an issue more of making sure that the implementation is the same across the board. So we have looked at it and feel that we are fairly generous. We have to be careful here, because it can go either way with the review, either tightening it up and making it very rigid or making it too loose and have a hard time accounting for all the time that is being taken. So I have looked at it and it is more, at this point, ensuring that the policy is interpreted the same across the board. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise again to bring attention to comments I made during my Member's statement which was about Canada’s involvement in the missile defence program with the United States.

Mr. Speaker, my question is directed to the Premier of this Assembly, and as I passionately referred to him yesterday as our shepherd of this Assembly. Mr. Speaker, would the Premier be able to confirm or say otherwise if the GNWT has a policy or a position in regard to Canada’s involvement in the missile defence program? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The honourable Premier, Mr. Handley.

Return To Question 288-15(3): Involvement In Canada/USA Missile Defence Program

Mr. Speaker, no, we don’t have a policy on the federal government's programs. Those would be issues outside of our government and not things we would have policies on. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 288-15(3): Involvement In Canada/USA Missile Defence Program

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It has been well said many times that the population of the Northwest Territories does not anchor Canada; however, it is a significant population, I would like to say. I think that the fact that the missiles, if we ever reach that stage, would all be going over our heads and who knows where the fallout may happen one day, I think it’s critical that we do take a position. Why do we not have a position? Why do we not send an open letter from this government to our Prime Minister on our position? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.