Debates of October 25, 2004 (day 27)

Mr. Speaker, the intent here is to recognize the complexity of the work in different areas; that a nurse is not necessarily a nurse any more than a pilot is, or that doctors all seem to be the same or remunerated the same. In this case, that is a similar circumstance. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 291-15(3): Re-evaluation Of Nursing Positions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I mentioned in my Member’s statement that this practice does not happen anywhere else in the country. I am just wondering, through you to the Minister, why is Stanton Territorial Hospital any different than the way they do this anywhere else across the country. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 291-15(3): Re-evaluation Of Nursing Positions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to think that the Northwest Territories is a very progressive jurisdiction as is the Stanton a very progressive hospital, but it is also my understanding that Newfoundland and P.E.I., as well, pay nurses in this similar way. Every other jurisdiction, in one way or another, recognizes that a nurse is not a nurse; that there are different levels. There are higher skill requirements in some areas. In the work that we did here as a government, no nurses’ salaries went down, but there was a recognition, clearly, that there are some higher levels of skill requirements. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Your final supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 291-15(3): Re-evaluation Of Nursing Positions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, that is all fine and good. However, I am just wondering at what value the Government of the Northwest Territories places on education and certification of nurses. From what the Minister said, there really is not a value on education and certification. That is how it is done in other jurisdictions, Mr. Speaker. I am just wondering, to the Minister, what value he places on education and certification for nursing professionals. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Miltenberger.

Further Return To Question 291-15(3): Re-evaluation Of Nursing Positions

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we place tremendous value on the nurses and their skills that they bring to the job, and that is recognized by the way they are paid, the amount they are paid, the value we place on them in terms of other benefits that we give them, the work that we've done to update and modernize the Nursing Act, the way we've moved to bring in nurse practitioners, and the way we are going to move to incorporate LPNs as well. Mr. Speaker, I think the proof for us is demonstrated by our actions and the reality that is there today, when you look at how well nurses are compensated. Thank you.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are for the Honourable Brendan Bell, the Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development and the caretaker of our environment. Mr. Speaker, as I referred in my statement, we are engaged in two processes regarding the cleanup of the two mines in Yellowknife. Both of them are underway under quite different circumstances. I would ask my first question, Mr. Speaker, in relation to the Giant Mine situation and what I understand to be a jurisdictional dispute between ourselves and the federal government over who has responsibility and accountability for the cleanup of that property. The last time I believe we talked about this, the Minister was going to talk to his federal counterpart to see how we could progress. Has any progress been made? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. The Minister of Resources, Wildlife and Economic Development Mr. Bell.

Return To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Member indicated, I was able to meet with the Minister of DIAND in Ottawa on September 1st and had a fair bit of discussion around the cleanup at Giant Mine. We discussed the issues in-depth and I was very impressed, he was well briefed on the file. He indicated that it was a priority for the department to see this cleanup move forward. The last time I stood in the House and answered the Member’s questions in this regard, he had some concern about the level of dialogue, I believe, between our officials and DIAND officials. I am getting weekly updates from my staff; we are having almost weekly meetings with our staff and their staff. Our deputy minister of the department has just recently met with the regional director general of DIAND to go through these. There are several outstanding issues of liability and responsibility on surface. Who is responsible for what is something that continues to nag. I have given direction to our staff to try to negotiate a bit of a cap in terms of financial exposure on our part so that we can move forward on cleaning this mess up. I think if we decide that we want to resolve all of the potential outstanding liability and responsibility issues, we will be here for a long time.

I would rather see us start to clean this up and work those issues through as they arise, but the key to us being able to do this is having some understanding of what our potential financial exposure will be and we are working on that. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Supplementary To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Are we going into this with a bottom line of some kind? The Minister has indicated that there might be a financial line there, but there are other things about the timing and the standards that will be set. Are these things also part of our negotiating approach? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Thank you, we are discussing all of those issues and we do, in our minds, have a financial bottom line. I don’t want to disclose that here, obviously. We are negotiating these issues with the federal government, but clearly we see, by and large, a federal responsibility. Obviously, underground is entirely a federal responsibility, they have been the mining regulator of record for the life of that mine. On the surface there is some debate. We want to move this forward quickly. DIAND is proposing to come forward with a project description and an A and R plan. I think they will do that this fall and early spring. We are going to participate in that. Really now it’s timing, it is the timing that is imminent here. The real concern that we have, outside of this liability and responsibility question which I am willing to continue to work on, but to some degree park for the time being in order that we might get some sort of financial agreement, because I believe the most important thing is for us to start cleaning this thing up, sooner rather than later, and in order to do that we have to set aside some of these disputes. Thank you.

Thank you Mr. Bell. Supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Supplementary To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Mr. Speaker, the process going on on the other side of town at the Miramar property is quite different. I think there is more substance to it, in that under, I believe, the Mackenzie Valley Land and Water Board, there is a process by which the cleanup of that property has been broken down into, I understand, eight different components. There is a process underway to evaluate and approve. However, the public access to this process is quite limited. Can the Minister provide some information on the progress of that cleanup approval process? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As the Member indicates, the A and R plan under the terms of the federal water licence is under review by the Mackenzie Valley Land and Water Board. They have formed a working group to review the draft plan put forward by the mine, by Miramar.

We are sitting on that working group and we also indicated our support for some public process. They have had public meetings and hearings on the draft A and R plan. It is my understanding that Miramar has now taken some of that input and the recommendations from the working group. They have taken that away and are revising portions of their A and R plan and are proposing to come back before the water board with that revised plan. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Bell. Short supplementary, Mr. Braden.

Supplementary To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Mr. Speaker, in news reports last week there was indication that the mine has missed some critical deadlines in this process. I won’t go into the detail here, of course, but I would like to ask the Minister if our government is taking any notice of this and what pressures are we bringing to bear on either the process, or DIAND or the company to comply with rules that really have already been in place? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Braden. Mr. Bell.

Further Return To Question 292-16(3): Responsibility For Cleanup Of Giant Mine

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We believe that Miramar is out of compliance with their water licence because of the delays and, as a member of the working group, we were involved, obviously, when the chairperson of that group wrote a letter to Miramar Con Mine to advise them that they were in fact, in our minds, out of compliance with their water licence by not meeting the deadlines. We are waiting for a response from the company, but obviously we see it as being of paramount importance that we get some progress here, and are waiting for Miramar to respond. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my question is to the Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation. Mr. Speaker, recently the Minister and I went to the Sahtu to talk about some of the housing issues in the Sahtu. I want to ask if the Minister could give me an update on the terms of the one seniors' facility in Deline that the people in the Sahtu would like to see open. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Minister responsible for the Housing Corporation, the Honourable Mr. Krutko.

Return To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is a care facility in Deline that has been unoccupied for some time. We have put a proposal to the community to come back with something in writing, if they can find another use for it. We are talking to people within the department, from the Department of Health and also if there are any non-government organizations interested in making use of that facility, we are open to offers. So we have put an offer out there, we haven’t heard anything back to date, so the offer is still there. So that is where it sits today.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, would the Minister inform the House here as to some sort of a time frame that they would make a decision on it with the community of Deline, in terms of the uses of that facility? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this is not the only facility that we are having problems with in regard to occupancy. It has been unoccupied for some time. We still continue to pay the operational costs of this facility. This is one of the items that have been put forward to the government by way of doing an assessment of all of our capital assets that have less than 30 percent occupancy. So we are putting the word out there that we want people to be aware this facility is available. Again, the corporation is definitely looking for someone to let us know if they are interested so we can dispose of this asset so it can be used for other functions besides a care facility.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, would the Minister provide the House with the reports of the assessments? He mentioned they are doing assessments of less than 30 percent occupancy of those types of facilities that they are responsible for. Would he provide this House with the report within the time frame? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I should be able to acquire that information and get it to the Member so he is aware of other facilities we’re talking about. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Final supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I look forward to that assessment report from the Minister. Also, would the Minister provide this House with a timetable that he is going to work with the Minister of Health and Social Services in terms of seeing what type of occupancy that the people in Deline can look forward to in terms of occupying that seniors facility and that they can at least have some decisions as to where to go next with that facility? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 293-15(3): Update On The Seniors Facility In Deline

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in case the Members don’t know, this facility was developed as a long-term care facility for the Sahtu and because the Sahtu is now in the process of establishing their own regional health board, there is still going to be a need for programs and services to be delivered in the Sahtu. So that’s sort of where the discussion is at, that that facility still has the ability to provide services for the Sahtu region. So that’s what the department or the regional health board is open to. That’s sort of the dialogue that has taken place today. We are still open to use that facility for what the purpose was. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I don’t know what to pursue today, maybe I’ll just continue on with my Member’s statement. To the Minister of Justice, Mr. Speaker, on the issue surrounding low morale problems and high vacancy rate and high overtime and such, I see two problems there. One is that I don’t think there’s recognition on the part of the Minister, he’s never admitted or acknowledged that there is any kind of problem and the more he says that, the more our phone lines and our e-mails and everything is burning up because people are getting really, really frustrated. The second thing is the more we ask questions to the Minister and the department about these problems, the answer keeps coming back saying well, it’s because there is a transition going on at the centre and whenever there is transition there are problems with change. That seems to not be the one that people are accepting either. They don’t believe that is the problem. They have no problem accepting that. It’s a whole lot of things. Mr. Speaker, one thing that keeps coming up is the fact that the warden of the correctional centre is related to a senior manager in the department and I’m very uncomfortable with this idea. This is a very small town and these are very good people, I’m sure they are doing a good job. I want to know from the Minister, to assure the people out there, what steps have been taken to ensure that there’s no direct supervisory link. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The honourable Minister of Justice, the Honourable Mr. Dent.

Return To Question 294-15(3): Issues At North Slave Correctional Centre

Mr. Speaker, I am not prepared to address that kind of question in this House. I would submit to you, Mr. Speaker, that this issue has been addressed in this House where a person is named in this House who has no possibility of representing themselves here, and I believe that in the past the Speaker has ruled that that is not admissible. I believe that this is the same situation, because we have now identified two individuals very clearly and they have no way of addressing that in this House. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Dent. The Chair will remind Members to not make reference to specific individuals in the House who are not here. The Chair did think that that question was slightly not related to the individuals in particular but, Ms. Lee, I will allow you a supplementary.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I totally appreciate what the Minister is saying and it is something that I have been thinking about for many months, many weeks now. It is true; I am giving the Minister an opportunity to explain what is happening in the department. It hasn’t anything to do with the individuals. I am telling the Minister that there are concerns, and I want him to explain to the House what he has done as Minister of Justice to make sure that all is in good order. It’s true; those two employees can’t explain themselves. I’m giving the Minister an opportunity to explain that everything is fine and that there are measures in place so that relatives are not reporting to each other and I think that’s important. We live in a…

What is your question, Ms. Lee? I didn’t hear a question there, Ms. Lee. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 294-15(3): Issues At North Slave Correctional Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question was what has the Minister done as a Minister to make sure that there is no perception or occurrence of anything wrong going on? I think he could explain that because it’s his department, it’s his employees…

Thank you, Ms. Lee, there was a question there. The honourable Minister of Justice, Mr. Dent.

Further Return To Question 294-15(3): Issues At North Slave Correctional Centre