Debates of October 26, 2006 (day 16)

Topics
Statements
Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. The honourable Minister responsible for Finance, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the idea of the macroeconomic policy unit has been discussed by previous governments that we should take this direction. Ultimately the final direction came from FMBS prior to this year’s budget we’re in now. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, what I take issue here with is the fact that we are dealing with a territory that has no real responsibility for its fiscal situation because we get $900 million directly or indirectly from the federal government. Five hundred million dollars of that is right out the door in salaries and benefits to our employees and I think, Mr. Speaker, we have higher priorities than this macroeconomic policy division. We need to hire nurses, we need to hire teachers. If you look at an ad that I found in the Globe and Mail recently, we’re going to pay these policy analysts in this shop $80,000 a year. That’s more than any nurse or teacher that I know make. Mr. Speaker, we don’t have…

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Do you have a question, Mr. Ramsay?

I’d like to ask the Minister who developed the policy? Who developed this policy? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I know the Member has issues with the macroeconomic policy. He’s made it clear since we’ve discussed this. In fact, at one point I believe he was suggesting it should go into ITI or Executive. It seems anywhere else but Finance. Now it’s why are we doing it. The fact is this issue was raised as far back as 1997 that the government should have something like this in place. A good example was, for example, when diamond mines were starting to be established should we pursue secondary industry or should we focus on taxation. That’s one of the reasons why we’re at this stage today. The fact is, we spend a billion dollars in the Northwest Territories. We do have some of our own-source revenues. Yes, we’re tied to the federal government, but we shouldn’t stop and bury our heads in the sand and not proceed. The fact is right now we’re in the process of developing that policy. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think in my discussions that I’ve had with the Finance Minister I’ve been clear that we have economists in the other departments the Minister mentioned, in ITI or in the Executive for that matter. But what I’d like to ask the Minister is how come, you know, Members on this side of the House haven’t seen this policy? I haven’t seen it and I’d like to ask the Minister when are we actually going to see this policy and what is in it? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we are in the process of developing that policy. In fact, in my Minister’s statement here I’d provided sort of a framework as to where we’re going and some of the questions we have to ask and some of the partners that we need to work with; for example, our community leaders and aboriginal leaders, as well as our business leaders. In fact, in November as we’re going out to start this leg of the work, going to meet with those groups to begin to put the framework together. Of course we’re always ready to meet with Members and go through that process as well. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Ramsay.

Supplementary To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, again I’m having trouble understanding, and I don’t know if it’s just me, but I’m having trouble understanding why we need fiscal policy analysts to help us better understand how to spend, in my estimation, what, you know, after we spend, pay all the bills and everything, might amount to $150 million. That’s probably going to go straight to program. I don’t understand where this policy is coming from and I’d like to ask the Minister, what is the basis for a macroeconomic policy framework shop in the Government of the Northwest Territories? What is the basis for that? What is he basing it on?

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 198-15(5): GNWT Macroeconomic Policy Division

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we’re basing it on the fact that the Government of the Northwest Territories needs the appropriate tools to make decisions on spending patterns. It’s not only about spending $100 million. As I stated earlier, we’re spending a billion dollars and should we as the Government of the Northwest Territories, how should we spend that money? Should it be focused on schools? Should it be focused on training programs? Should it be focused on infrastructure, airports, highways? Those are the things we have to use this piece for. In a sense, the policy will be developed and will become a macroeconomic lens that decision-makers like ourselves will have that tool as we make spending decisions as well as revenue-raising decisions. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are for the Minister responsible for Housing. You’re not off the hook until 5:00 today.

---Laughter

So I better get my questions in.

---Applause

Anyway, just talking about the affordable housing initiative. Don’t get me wrong, Mr. Speaker, I’m fully supportive of the affordable housing initiative. I only have concerns because I just don’t want this initiative to be reflected on five years from now or after its completion by the public as another big Housing Corporation mistake on the type of units that are put on the ground. I just want to ask the Minister, we have some, the old housing plans that I think that I asked the Minister about the other day that were dysfunctional floor plans with inadequate room sizes for children because these kids in these houses, usually there’s more than one family member occupying one room which is the size of eight by ten and it just doesn’t work. They’re also dysfunctional for the disabled or the elderly and the Housing Corporation had to come up with a lot of extra dollars to do some renovations to make ramps, to change bathrooms. I just want to see the houses that are coming, that are going to be put on the ground, and are going to allow people to appreciate and maybe we have to spend a little more money into reviewing some of the old business plans that we have or the drawing plans, Mr. Speaker. I just want to ask the Minister, are the new affordable housing building plans the old plans from years ago that the government still has the reserve-style matchbox-shaped housing units that are not unique in any shape or form to anybody in the community? Are they the old ones or are we going to have some new ones coming out? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve. The honourable Minister responsible for housing, Mr. Krutko.

Return To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we are looking at more improved models of what we are constructing. We’ve constructed housing units for seniors, for people with disabilities, and also looking at multi-configured housing, which we are looking at improving the designs and the layout of what we have. But more importantly, we’ve evolved to a point now where we’re actually meeting the needs of the clients that we’re serving. I think it’s crucial that we have input from the Council for the Disabled, the Seniors' Society and other community organizations to identify what they need. I think from what we’ve built so far and what we’ve been able to put on the ground to date, it is an improvement from what we’ve had before through this affordable housing initiative. We will be proceeding with those new blueprints that are out there. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve.

Supplementary To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Let me ask the Minister if he can provide this House with what changes from the old reserve style matchbox 5-12s that the Housing Corporation has been putting on the ground for the last 10 to 15 years. What changes is the Housing Corporation going to incorporate into this new affordable housing initiative?

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we do take into account the family size and exactly who the tenants we are serving. It is either seniors, families, singles or elderly, but we have to keep that in mind.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve.

Supplementary To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Are they all these 500 units that they are planning on putting on the ground in the next two years now, do we already have the clients already listed of who is going to be getting a house, which ones are going to the public housing? Are those lists already drawn up, family sizes determined and needs assessed? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we do ongoing surveys. We know exactly roughly how many housing units we have. The majority of these units we are going to be putting on the ground are replacing the older 5-12s that the Member mentioned. Also, we are looking into more energy-efficient units by looking at multi-configured housing. So we are proceeding forward but also looking at exactly what we are going to be replacing and how we are going to get away from the old idea of the old singular constructed dwellings to multi-configured dwellings. So we are able to get a more energy-efficient house but also making sure that it more meets the requirements that we need by way of ensuring that it is efficient, accessible, and affordable at the end of the day for the client to operate, maintain, and own. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve.

Supplementary To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. A lot of these affordable housing units are going to be going into communities. The Housing Corporation’s intent is to have them turned into or sold off into private homeownership programs or to private individuals in the community. Just with respect to the multi-housing units that are going to be going out there, I know the ones that are there now, they have shared mechanical rooms, water tanks and sewer tanks, which are the design of the old multi-units that we have today. We have lots of problems with the tenants that are in them. People don’t like to be in them because of all these shared water, sewer, mechanical and whatnot. How are we going to get people attracted to buy these units? How are we going to do that without changing these configurations? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve. Mr. Krutko.

Further Return To Question 199-15(5): Inadequate Housing Models For New Affordable Housing

Mr. Speaker, again, it is the client choice at the end of the day of what type of unit they would like to require. Again, it is conforming with what we already have in place by way of it is either…If we are looking at a senior's facility, we like to ensure that a senior is going to move in there. You are basically putting in the mechanism so that you know they are going to be aged in this facility. You know that they are going to need hand rails. You know that they are going to need to be able to have access and eventually maybe in a wheelchair or whatnot. So you design these units with the client that you are looking at serving, but, more importantly, looking at exactly the number of people in those units to bring down the problem that we have with overcrowding but ensuring that we do make them energy efficient and also affordable at the end of the day so they can be able to maintain and operate those units and not have to worry about the high cost of operation. Thank you.

Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are to the Premier. It is in follow-up to the Member’s statement and the questions raised by my colleague from Hay River South. I think we have seen in this House that Members take very seriously any indication or any sense of intimidation or any pressure put off on us unduly for doing our job as a Member, which is to speak on behalf of the constituents that we represent but also for the people of the NWT and the bigger picture of upholding the basic principles of democracy, Mr. Speaker. I was encouraged to hear from the Premier that he also agrees with that notion and that it is important that the Members can speak freely in this House. I heard him, in answering questions to Mrs. Groenewegen, in fact, if he knew of any situations like that, that the government will police that or will be engaged in…I can’t remember exactly how he said it, but make sure that that doesn’t happen. So I would like to ask the Premier what he has done as Premier to make sure, in fact, any policy, guideline, directive, any statements he has made to make sure that the people out there understand that we have a consensus government and the government takes its rules seriously in making sure that people understand that we cannot be intimidated? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Ms. Lee. The honourable Premier, Mr. Handley.

Return To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think the public expects that we are going to be fair to everybody as a government, that we all have equal rights in this Legislative Assembly. From the day I first let my name stand as Premier, I made it clear that that is the way that I was going to operate. I don’t have the exact wording of my statement in this House following my appointment as Premier, but I operate that way. We have talked about it in Cabinet. Certainly, from our side, there will be no tolerance of intimidation of Members, and I expect the same is true for everybody in this House. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As we saw last week, apparently it is not in practice. People have forgotten. I hear from the Premier’s answer that there hasn’t been any direct statement to either the staff or to the public or anybody who is interested in knowing about this that says that we are a consensus government and that we, as a government, respect the Members’ rights. Would the Premier make a commitment to do such a thing in a directive or policy way of any kind of document that he sees fit? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Handley.

Further Return To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Mr. Speaker, I want to think about how we would do it, the best way of doing it. Certainly, in letters to Ministers, that has happened. If the Members feel there is a need to come out with some kind of public statement, then, yes, I will take that into consideration. I am not sure what would be the best way of doing that, but, as I say, Mr. Speaker, I expect that the public believes that we operate fairly in this government. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I believe, within this House and outside, I don’t think there is that clear understanding that people understand that this is a House of free speech and that it is the Members’ jobs to criticize the Premier and the Ministers if and where necessary. That is not happening at all. I would like to ask the Premier, would he put that into paper and maybe he should do an announcement in the paper to let the people know that we hold this very important? Would he be willing to take that commitment, Mr. Speaker?

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Handley.

Further Return To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. When we were all sworn in, we did pledge an oath of office. We all have to abide by that. We all have to abide by the rules of the House. Everybody has a right to critique, to criticize, to comment on Ministers, on the Premier, on performance. I think the public expects no less. Mr. Speaker, I need more information about is somebody putting pressure on someone. I don’t know. Of course, the public always has the right to make their comments to each of us too, and we have to respect that. Mr. Speaker, I want to think about how we would convey this kind of message and so on to the public. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Handley. Final supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, he lost a Cabinet Minister last week because Members felt intimidated. I believe, Mr. Speaker, I don’t know if everybody knows. I would really like it if he could just repeat what he just said and if he could just do a public notice telling the people that, in fact, that is the case; that we all have to operate under the atmosphere of freedom and freedom from intimidation. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Handley.

Further Return To Question 200-15(5): Speaking Of Matters Of Accountability And Integrity

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I can’t repeat exactly what I said. My message is that we all have signed an oath. We all have responsibilities. We all know what the rules of the House are or know where to find the rules if we are unsure, and we all operate with respect, but we all have the right to criticize positions taken by one another. Certainly Members have a right to comment on Cabinet’s performance, whether it is individual Ministers, the Cabinet as a group or the Premier or whatever. That is all part of the democratic process. Mr. Speaker, we respect that. If we violate that, then we know there are consequences. In fact, Ms. Lee referred to the incident last week. That is a good example of how the system works and why it works if there is a suggestion of intimidation.

Mr. Speaker, as I said before, in terms of going beyond my statement today saying, yes, we operate this way and the good old days of whatever they were before are not tolerated anymore. We operate in an open way, whether it is capital or business planning or question period or whatever it may be. We will maintain that as a government. In terms of putting out a public notice, Mr. Speaker, I want to think about how we would do that. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Question 201-15(5): Access To Legal Aid Services

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today will be about legal aid service levels and how we are meeting those challenges here today, Mr. Speaker. It is no surprise to Members here that I take a serious interest in the Legal Services Board as well as the legal aid issue and service levels. Mr. Speaker, I quickly did a search on those two topics and I came up with about 32 questions since I have been a Member in this House. I didn’t do a search on e-mails or written questions. I have always been about fair and timely service for those people in our society that need it most, Mr. Speaker. So my question to the Minister of Justice will be as follows: Would the Minister tell me what he is doing to help meet those service level needs to ensure the people who most need it get those opportunities through either a pilot-based program, whether it is a family law clinic or a poverty law clinic? How is this Minister meeting those challenges through any types of partnerships? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.