Debates of October 30, 2006 (day 18)

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 215-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the Minister mentioned forced growth. Forced growth often relates to increases in salaries and benefits for workers in the public service. I would like to ask the Minister when he talks about the increase in the amount of the contract to address forced growth, does that forced growth include incremental increases for the workers at the Nats’ejee K’eh? Thank you.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 215-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the process we have entered into for organizations that deliver programs outside of our own staffing situation, there is a process that is used by each department that would look at the services being delivered and if they fit our definition of forced growth and if they would be included, that’s department by department. I am not clear as to the process that was just implemented, if in fact they would fall into it. I know, for example, there was no inclusion for higher wages at this point because there was no agreement in place. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.

Supplementary To Question 215-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to ask the Minister if there are any other third-party contracts similar to this that would see the employment of unionized workers where they would actually have been without a contract for three and a half years. This seems like a long time and I would imagine it is fairly unprecedented. Also, would the Minister be prepared to table a copy of the contract with the Deh Cho Health and Social Services Board in this House? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 215-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am not aware of any situation where we’ve had a group of employees working that are represented by a union that does not have an agreement in place. I don’t have any of that information available. As for the tabling of the contract, I would have to work with the department to see if we could do that. So I will have a look at it, but I can’t make that commitment at this point.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my Member’s statement also talked about Nats’ejee K’eh and the issue over there. I would like to ask the Minister of Health and Social Services, at what point did the GNWT become aware that the parties where they were without an agreement? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have been aware for some time, as in the previous question, that it’s been recognized that they have been working without a union since 2003. They have always been encouraged to come together and come to a conclusion. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it’s been three years that these workers have not had any type of agreement on security. It’s been three years. So what did the government do in the three years to get the parties back on the road and not have our clients shut out and have people go down to other treatment centres? What have they done in three years and not just now when it comes down to the crunch when we are having this discussion? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, a contract is in place with the Deh Cho Health and Social Services Authority and the board that is the employer. That’s been in place and that has been honoured. They’ve waited for a conclusion to this. Of course, we are dealing with a separate employer dealing with their employees. From my standpoint, it’s to honour the initial contract with the society that’s delivering that service. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.

Supplementary To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, in this situation here, because we are at the 11th hour of this agreement, it’s the only treatment centre in the Northwest Territories that shut down for a lot of issues that came from alcohol, and our communities are suffering terribly. I wonder if the Minister or GNWT would consider bringing the facilities or the parties, workers, into the public service so we have some security for our people. You have to think about the people in the community and the clients. Would the Minister consider bringing these workers into the public service? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue of bringing employees into the public service has been considered by this government in the past and can be reconsidered. Ultimately, part of the issue is here when we are dealing with one union to another, there are issues that have to be dealt with. It’s not just straightforward taking on employees and bringing them in. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Roland.

Supplementary To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I couldn’t agree more with the Minister. It’s the same with alcohol and drugs. With alcohol and drugs, you have to negotiate. I would encourage the Minister to reconsider bringing the workers into the public service where there is some security and benefits. Pay them for what they are worth in dealing with this serious issue of alcoholism in the Northwest Territories. I would again ask the Minister to really strongly consider bringing these workers into the public service where they are honoured and respected for the work they are doing in our communities in saving the lives of our people. Mahsi.

Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 216-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the fact is, right now we do have a contract with the society who is the employer and that has to be taken into consideration as we proceed. That’s why, at this time, the encouragement is for the employer and employees to sit down and conclude a successful negotiation. Ultimately I think one has to look at the Government of the Northwest Territories which is no longer considered the choice employer of the Northwest Territories as we have, for quite some years, gotten away from some of the benefit levels that past employees were accustomed to. That should be considered as well. At this time, we are encouraging both parties to get back to the negotiation table, hopefully come up with a successful conclusion. During the meantime, we will be dealing with those individuals who are requesting help in the area of drug and addictions and help them receive that at this time. That would be going through alternate sources. At this time, that is going further south than our own border. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, during my Member’s statement, I raised a number of concerns at Stanton Hospital that I feel very strongly should be addressed. Can the Minister of Health and Social Services tell this House today that the survey we are talking about will be shown and guided with keen leadership? Will the Minister show that it will be an independent, open, fair discussion with all employees, both union and management, and be considered to be done at arm’s length to ensure there is full buy-in to ensure workers are happy and safe? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as the previous Minister committed to and I followed up with the commitment, I will be working the Members of the Social Programs committee and I will be coming forward to committee in the very near future with the terms of reference and how we can move forward on this. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. One of the issues that had been highlighted to me is the fairness of bringing issues forward without feeling the pressures of other people looking at you or implying things that aren’t right. We would all be well and good if we had whistle-blower legislation or an ombudsman for someone to complain to. So what is the Minister doing to ensure that we have anti-harassment training done and used, and to ensure that all employees feel safe to bring issues forward to management if there are problems, without any fear of reprisal? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as the Government of the Northwest Territories, what we have used for some time now as well as adapting those in southern Canada, the federal government, their legislation and through our own negotiation process in dealing with employees over the years, we do have a system in place that would allow for those who feel they are in unsafe conditions or rules aren’t being followed to address those. Of course, we have to use our existing system that is in place and the chain of command, as hard as that may sound, is something that is used. If there are concerns raised, you go to your immediate supervisor and forward. Of course, as the Government of the Northwest Territories, in my previous role here, we are looking at a discussion paper coming forward on whistle-blower legislation. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Let me say that that whistle-blower legislation will be well received, because there are people out there who feel that their jobs are at risk when they put issues on the line by putting their name forward and saying I believe this is a problem. So, Mr. Speaker, the next problem I highlighted in my Member’s statement was lieu time. There is an unfair balance of how lieu time is orchestrated out there. It’s about fairness and morale and the fact that many people feel that this is an imposed change without any consultation. Can the Minister agree to go back and look at some type of consultation that can help build back a refillable bank of lieu time so people will feel that they are part of the system and not being imposed by it? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the issue of lieu time within our government service operations throughout the Northwest Territories has been looked at. We have worked with all departments. All departments are treating this somewhat differently. It goes to show, once again, that the need for a clearer human resource plan was required. We have now tried to bring some consistency back to the table looking at operational requirements, and the funding available to ourselves as a government came up with what we felt at this time was the best solution. So although the Member is requesting that we go back to a refillable lieu time package, right now, as we have moved this first step, I am not prepared to go back on that. I would rather like to see how it would work instead as we have put it in place. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.

Supplementary To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. If I rebut that, I won’t be able to ask my fourth question. Mr. Speaker, I raised another serious concern in my Member’s statement about relief workers and agency workers and the fact that there are many staff employees at Stanton who feel that they are losing their senior staff. They are getting new ones as good as they are, but the problem is we don’t have the experience and the seniority that that has. Our senior staff can get jobs in the Yukon or elsewhere at these great bonuses. There is no incentive. Would the Minister take on this problem and show some leadership by saying maybe we need to open up the Public Service Act or maybe we have to find new and innovative ways to ensure that our senior staff are appreciated through whatever mechanisms? Would the Minister go back and rework this problem? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 217-15(5): Stanton Territorial Hospital Human Resource Survey

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think, as the Government of the Northwest Territories, we can show the commitment we’ve made to try to secure our nursing workforce and make sure the environment they work under is a productive one, a healthy one and is satisfactory. Of course, the demand for services by the people of the Northwest Territories also has to be met. That’s why we have looked at a number of different options. In looking at the file now and working with the department, I believe we are trying to take the necessary steps to ensure we have a competent nursing force in place and we will continue to work with all the parties to try to ensure that that is the case. Thank you.

Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. My question again is to the Minister responsible for Human Resources, the Honourable Floyd Roland just about with the Nats'ejee K'eh clients. I guess Health pays the bill. Just with the government having notification of the lockout prior to it actually coming through, but efforts were taken to notify the clients and their families of the move to ensure that as little as possible interruption of their treatment would happen. What efforts were made to notify families and clients that they would be moving south? Were they given advance notice? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve. The honourable Minister responsible for Health and Social Services, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 218-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, when we were given notice that the strike action could possibly be taking place, the department made the decision to move the existing clients out. It was discussed with the clients if they wanted to travel back to their home communities or continue on in another location with their programming. All of the clients that were in the facility chose to continue with their programming. That is what we did. So the notice was very short. We felt that it was in their best interest at that time. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve.

Supplementary To Question 218-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Ironically enough, from October 29th to November 4th is Canada Career Week. You find the work you love and build a life you want, and here we have a gallery full of 22 people that obviously found the work they love and are building a life that they want and a lot of northerners want their clients to have. They are here today dealing with this lockout. What assurances can the Minister provide to the current clients that are down south, and their families, that they will again have access to treatment here in the NWT in the near future? When might that be? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Villeneuve. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 218-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as I had stated earlier, I have signed off a letter going to the parties involved and urging them to get back to the negotiations. I can’t give a commitment in this House, as right now we are monitoring the situation hoping that a successful conclusion can be reached. So giving a timeline at this point is not something that I can commit to. Just for the record, as we have looked at the situation, I don’t believe it is a lockout. It is an arrangement that the employer has made with his existing workload. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Mr. Villeneuve.

Supplementary To Question 218-15(5): Disruption Of Service At Nats’ejee K’eh Treatment Centre

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As far as I know, the employees did get locked out prior to their strike deadline that was issued to the employer. Can the Minister’s department do more than just monitor at this point in time? Of course, time is of the essence in this whole issue. We have people who want to come home and want to get treatment here in the NWT by people that they know and have received treatment from in the past, I am sure. What can the department offer besides just monitoring? Can we provide some mentoring, perhaps, Mr. Speaker; anything besides just sitting back and monitoring the situation? I don’t think that would suffice for clients and families of Nats'ejee K'eh. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.