Thank you, Mr. Chair, for that comment. I can bring that back to the department. But I want to be very clear that with the function of these LHOs and they're allocating units at the ground level and 80 percent of our budget is actually allocated to the smaller communities, so outside of Yellowknife. I just wanted to express that as well too. But I could follow up with the Member with that. But I just really want to defend the representation of the LHOs at the community level where they make the decisions of what needs to be built in their communities. They I want to give them more decision making powers. I want them to be able to I want to be able to more communicate with the chairperson, chairperson to Minister. I want that to change. And then also if they are going to be challenging our policies and it doesn't work at the smaller community level, or even in the larger centres, this is the board and this is the structure that I would like to I would like to be working with. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. Mr. Johnson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yeah, I guess I'm going to say that I will offer no opinions on what I think LHOs in the communities should do. I'll leave that up to community MLAs and them. But I noted in Yellowknife the staff, they're not public servants, and they have quite, you know, high maintenance costs. They're nowhere near the private sector in what it costs to maintain and operate buildings. You know, perhaps that's a good thing, the number of staff they have, if you need to get something fixed in a public housing unit in Yellowknife.
But I'm just wondering if we've done some sort of cost comparison of different options. Or is it cheaper essentially to have LHOs with staff who are not GNWT public servants? Is that part of the reason for their existence? I'm just kind of confused about how this came to be, Mr. Chair. Thank you.
Mahsi, Mr. Johnson. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And this has been something that has probably been, you know, functioning in the smaller communities and the larger centres for quite some time. I'm not too familiar with the history and why we created the LHOs and why there's the board structure. I will have Ms. President Young respond to the answer. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. President Young.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And like the Minister, you know, I have my background was actually initially with an LHO here and even I can't explain some of the rationale about why it was created because it was it predated me. But in my time here, I've seen a lot of ebb and flow about levels of responsibility to LHOs and, you know, it's very much changed with the government relationship over time and sometimes there's been more responsibility locally, and other times there's been other things. So I think that's part of the reason for the desire to have the conversation as part of the renewal. But I think one of the things you're pointing out is the need for flexibility. Not only for different sized communities or different structures but also, as you've alluded to, in some cases Indigenous governments may want to take the LHO over, and sooner, and in other cases they may not. And we started to hear some of that conversation as part of our engagement on the renewal. So I think whatever we come up with as part of the renewal has to be able to be flexible enough to accommodate some of these these different situations that are going to evolve over time and not lock us in to one model that may not work. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. Ms. Nokleby.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I just, yeah, want to continue on with this conversation. I too find this all to be quite confusing and think that it definitely needs to not be a onesizefitsall answer because for me, if an Indigenous organization is doing it, that's great; we're going to empower them and then to take care of their people. But in Yellowknife, I find it hard because I don't know how I can ask or intervene because it is a third party entity. It doesn't make sense here because we don't have an entity that's, you know, an Indigenous organize or government that's specific to Yellowknife itself. So I also agree that some sort of change for maybe Yellowknife and efficiencies could be found and then, yes, leave communities to come up with their own solutions for that.
My question, though, is around the apprenticeship program here. I'm glad to see there's more money there I'm so blind between from the 2020 actuals to now. But I guess my question is knowing that apprenticeship programs and such are a continuum, and they you know, there's a three, fouryear type situation that goes on, how do we make sure that we're being efficient and not losing apprentices out of the system? We have a high turnover often of employment in the North, and I guess I worry that there would be employees that start an apprenticeship program maybe with the housing corp or somewhere else, and then they can't move that to others, or can they? Like, so are we ensuring that they're not just getting kind of these piecemeal parts of an apprenticeship program without actually getting to be apprentices? And I'm wondering what mechanism or sorry, getting to be journey people, and what mechanism is being used to kind of track that efficiency? I'm not sure if I really explained that well but the Minister or deputy minister can comment. Thank you.
Mahsi, Ms. Nokleby. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And apprenticeship is highlighted in our contracts going forward when we're putting out that we have such a huge unit delivery this year. So then I think the last number that I did have, and Jim could correct me if I'm wrong, but I think had 19 apprenticeships all together. And currently right now, we do have apprenticeships that are required through those contracts. And the other thing is that we do have such a large construction delivery that I would like to see that opportunity for who's entered into those apprenticeships be able to move on to the existing projects going forward. But and how we track them and take care of those numbers, I'll turn it over to Jim. But the other thing I wanted to highlight is that we do have red seals, and we do have apprenticeship certifications at the ground level. I'll just if vicepresident Jim Martin can elaborate on the response, thank you.
Mahsi. Vicepresident Martin.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. So the Housing Corporation does continue to certainly support apprentice hires here in the NWT. We do have an inhouse program with an intake of about 12 we try to maintain year to year. To date, we've seen 21 apprentices journey certified through this program. So we're quite pleased with that.
In terms of the outcomes, also in addition to our inhouse program, the Housing Corporation has also introduced, back on April 1st, 2020, a requirement for our general contractors to establish at least one apprenticeship work assignment for each of our contracts. So to date, we've supported 33 work assignments with the contractors. So between a combination of the contractor work opportunities and attrition in our LHOs, we're quite comfortable in saying that the LHOs that do complete our program are getting hired. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. Ms. Nokleby.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thanks for that answer. And I guess to the I'm assuming that with an apprenticeship program that it's not always tied specifically to the employer but is an overarching program, and I see people nodding their heads "yes", so that's that's good. I guess that was where my concern is.
I'm just looking at the training and support workshops line. You know, there's only the 2,000 spent in 20202021 and then, you know, back up to 250 I'm assuming that these are these numbers are so low because of COVID? Could the Minister confirm that, from the 20202021 actuals? Thanks.
Mahsi, Ms. Nokleby. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm going to turn the response over to president Young. But I do know that for the number of our training opportunities for our workers that there was a delay in the delivery. So I'll just I'll turn it over to president Young. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. President Young.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And that's correct. With unfortunately with travel restrictions, many of our folks have not been able to travel to scheduled training and that will be something that we will be trying to catch up on in the near future.
It also impacts, like our formal training as noted through educational institutions, but even our regularly scheduled workshops to do training for LHO managers, tenant relation officers, foremen, those things which normally the corporation would sponsor at least once annually, we've not been able do over the last two years, and so that's something we need to now catch up on and bring those folks back together to do some of the basic training that we would normally deliver to those cohorts and build that network amongst the people doing that job in the communities, and that's really important. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. Ms. Nokleby.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And, yeah, that I would expect. I guess, then, leading to my next question would be has there been an ability or an interest or looking at what it would cost to put some of these programs on put them virtually, and could they even be put virtually because it is a trade type or some of it is very handson training. And then as well too, I think this is a great way to support skill sets so or to increase capacity within communities. So is there a want to, like, increase this funding over the next while, or is this going to be high? Is this high just as a catchup, and we'll see it decrease later? To me, it's a great line item and I'd like to see more of it. Thank you.
Mahsi, Ms. Nokleby. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'll have president Young elaborate on the response. Thank you.
President Young.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I think this is one of the items that we're very much looking forward to having conversation with the LHOs about, to talk about both the style of delivery but what we're delivering and whether we're delivering enough. I think in the House before, we've talked about clientcentered service training for our frontline staff. That's something that we need to start delivering and develop and deliver across. So we may look to do facetoface initially but then that could be something that could be, as new folks come on stream, become more of an online delivery. But those are those are decisions I think we're looking for local housing authority input on before we make some final decisions about the next fiscal year. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi. Ms. Nokleby.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. And I appreciate the deputy minister's response or sorry, the president's response. You know, I can't stress enough how often when I am talking with my constituents that are housing clients how really a lot of it, it comes down to how they feel they've been treated and often they feel that they have been disrespected or that there's been a rudeness. And I mean, I get that frontline workers also have a burnout and a a need to almost protect themselves in a way by having a little bit of a maybe a reserved or removed manner. However, I feel that, you know, it is critical that these that the frontline workers here understand that this is a social client service, and I do see that the department appears to be moving in that direction. So I'm pleased to hear that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi, Ms. Nokleby. Minister, you want to...
Just a comment, and I appreciate the the Member's comments as well too because training is is something that I really want to be identified for our LHOs and to support them, whether it be from from client service to, you know, finance. And I'm kind of looking at a similar model to what MACA had provided for the senior SAOs, senior administrative officers. And also the training that they did have for their boards and their councils there. So something similar, not identical, but my my way of thinking is very similar to what MACA has already set up. And the school of community government as well too, and what they can offer. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Mahsi, Minister. Committee oh, Ms. Nokleby.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to make one last comment as I appreciate the Minister's comments around the training and awareness. A new thing that I recently had a constituent make me more aware of where we're often talking about traumainformed approaches to things, but I think we also need to have an FASD approach to our work and it's going to be something that you're now going to start to hear me saying to a lot of the Ministers on that side of the room, that just as much as we are affected by trauma in the North we're affected by fetal alcohol syndrome as well. So I think that there's an aspect in that training that needs to be a part of that as well. Thank you.
Mahsi, Ms. Nokleby. Committee, we've got our hard stop. Member from Frame Lake, what is the wish of committee?
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I move that the chair rise and report progress.
The motion is in order. The motion is nondebatable. All those in favour. All those opposed. Motion is carried.
Carried
Will the SergeantatArms please escort the witnesses from the chamber.
Report progress.
Madam Speaker, your committee has been considering Bill 23, 29, and 38, and Tabled Document 56119(2): 20222023 Main Estimates, and would like to report progress with one motion. Madam Speaker, I move that the report of the Committee of the Whole be concurred with. Mahsi.
Thank you. There's a motion on the floor. Do I have a seconder? Member for Nunakput. All those in favour? Opposed? Motion carried.
Carried
Orders of the day for Friday, February 25nd, 2022, 10 a.m.
Prayer
Ministers’ Statements
Members’ Statements
Returns to Oral Questions
Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery
Replies to Budget Address Day 4 of 7
Acknowledgements
Oral Questions
Written Questions
Returns to Written Questions
Replies to Commissioner Address
Petitions
Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills
Reports of Standing and Special Committees
Tabling of Documents
Notices of Motion
Motions
Notices of Motion for First Reading of Bills
First Reading of Bills
Second Reading of Bills
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
Bill 23 - An Act to Amend the Public Utilities Act
Bill 29 - Resource Royalty Information Disclosure Statute Amendment Act
Bill 38 – Miscellaneous Statute Law Amendment Act, 2021
Tabled Document 561-19(2): 2022-2023 Main Estimates
Report of Committee of the Whole
Third Reading of Bills
Orders of the Day
Thank you. This House stands adjourned until Friday, February 25th, 2022, at 10 a.m.
---ADJOURNMENT
The House adjourned at 6:03 p.m.
