Thank you, committee. Does committee agree that this concludes our consideration of Bill 78, Waste Reduction and Resource Recovery Act?
Agreed.
Thank you, Minister, and thank you to your witnesses for appearing before us. Sergeantatarms, you may escort the witnesses from the Chamber.
Committee has agreed to consider Bill 83, Liquor Act. I will ask the Minister of Finance to introduce the bill.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, I am here this evening to present Bill 83, Liquor Act.
The bill addresses the recommendations resulting from the review of the Northwest Territories liquor legislation completed by the Department of Finance in 2022. The liquor legislation review resulted in several recommendations. 20 percent of those recommendations were directly related to the Liquor Act, and the remaining 80 percent of recommendations related to the liquor regulations or the operations that support those regulations.
Bill 83 was drafted to directly address the 20 percent of recommendations related to the Liquor Act and to achieve four main objectives:
Streamline how industry is regulated by introducing a new licensing and compliance approach;
Ensure safe public access to liquor by allowing different types of retail outlets;
Enhanced community control, including greater control over the introduction of liquor sales as well as the cessation of liquor sales in a community; and
Modernize liquor enforcement by updating inspection and investigation powers.
These changes will modernize and streamline the Liquor Act.
This concludes my opening remarks. I am prepared to answer any questions that Members may have.
Thank you, Minister. Would you like to bring witnesses into the Chamber?
Yes, please, Madam Chair.
Okay. Sergeantatarms, please escort the witness into the Chamber.
Minister, can you please introduce your witnesses.
Thank you, Madam Chair. On my left, I have Kelly Mahoney, the director of policy, legislation, and communications. And on my right, Victoria Carmichael, legislative drafter.
Thank you. And welcome. I will now turn to the chair of Standing Committee on Government Operations for any opening comments on Bill 83. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Bill 83, Liquor Act, received second reading in the Legislative Assembly on March 30th, 2023, and was referred to the Standing Committee on Government Operations for review.
The standing committee held a public hearing with the Minister of Finance in Yellowknife on May 29th, 2023. The committee then hosted three public meetings in Inuvik, Norman Wells, and Yellowknife. The committee also received one written submission.
The committee heard a range of views from the public engagement not limited to alcohol addictions, bootlegging, community control of liquor, consumption in public places, and server training. The committee recognizes many concerns will be addressed through regulations.
On July 28th, 2023, the standing committee held a clausebyclause review of bill and moved two minor motions advanced by the department.
I would like to thank the public for their time to meet with committee and for the committee's work on the review of this bill. Individual Members may have additional comments or questions. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. I will now open the floor to general comments on Bill 83. Are there any general comments? Does committee agree to a clausebyclause review of the bill; can we proceed to a clausebyclause review of the bill?
Agreed.
Committee, we will defer the bill number and title until after consideration of the clauses. We will consider the clauses in groups. Please turn to page 1 of the bill.
Clauses 1 through 10, does committee agree?
Agreed.
---clauses 1 through 149 inclusive approved
Committee, to the bill as a whole, does committee agree that Bill 83, Liquor Act, is now ready for third reading?
Agreed.
Thank you, committee. Committee has agreed that Bill 83, Liquor Act, is now ready for third reading. Does committee agree that this concludes our consideration of Bill 83, Liquor Act?
Agreed.
Thank you, Minister. Thank you to your witnesses. Sergeantatarms, please escort the witnesses from the Chamber.
Committee has agreed to consider Bill 92, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, No. 3. I will ask the Minister of Finance to introduce the bill.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I am here this evening to present Bill 92, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, No. 3. The purpose of Bill 92 is to add carbon tax revenues sharing grants sharing community grants and annual reporting requirements to the carbon tax legislation. This bill represents our final collaborative effort to revise the territorial carbon tax regime to meet federal 2023 to 2030 carbon pricing benchmarks.
As part of March 23rd discussions concerning Bill 60, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, we worked together to better mitigate the additional carbon tax burden required for the Northwest Territories to continue to administer its own carbon tax regime. This collaboration led to my commitments to do the following:
Implement a regional cost of living offset;
Provide annual revenue sharing grants to community governments totaling 10 percent of net carbon tax revenues;
Introduce legislation establishing community government revenue sharing;
Strengthen annual reporting requirements; and
Follow up with the federal government to ensure federal departments meet directly with Northwest Territories communities to discuss developing energy alternatives.
The cost of living offset benefit based on the region of residents was made effective July 1st, 2023. For the July 1st, 2023 to June 30th, 2024 interim benefit payments, those are made to residents until the Canada Revenue Agency completes its system change in the fall. At that time, residents will receive any applicable additional payments retroactive to July 1st of 2023.
Bill 92 represents my commitment to reduce the carbon tax burden on community governments through revenue sharing grants totaling 10 percent of net carbon tax revenues. These grants will provide flexible funding that may assist local governments to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. The allocation formula will be described in regulations and the intention is to provide each community government with a base funding amount plus a per capita allocation. This will provide appropriate support to community governments in larger communities while also recognizing that smaller communities are often in more remote locations where costs are higher.
Bill 92 is a good example of consensus government's style of getting things done. The 19th Legislative Assembly's approval for keeping territorial control of the carbon tax has meant that the GNWT retains the flexibility to design a madeinthe North solution that reflects northern priorities and circumstances.
I would like to thank the Standing Committee of Government Operations and the Member for Frame Lake for their tenacity and willingness to collaborate on this bill to demonstrate our commitment to making carbon prices work in the Northwest Territories. That concludes my opening remarks. I would be happy to answer any questions the Members may have.
Thank you, Minister. Before we bring witnesses in, we have to get we have to take a short, probably about a fiveminute break. Yeah, fiveminute break. We got to get the right motion. Sevenminute break. Go.
SHORT RECESS
I now call Committee of the Whole back to order. Sorry about that, committee; we just had to get some documents printed.
Minister, would you like to bring witnesses into the Chamber?
Yes, please, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Sergeantatarms, please escort the witnesses to the Chamber.
Minister, would you please introduce your witnesses.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, on my left I have Kelly Bluck, the director of fiscal policy for the Department of Finance. And Laura Jeffrey on my right, legislative drafter in the Department of Justice.
Welcome. I will now turn to the chair of Standing Committee on Government Operations for any opening comments on Bill 92. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Bill 92, An Act to Amend the Petroleum Products and Carbon Tax Act, No. 3, received second reading in the Legislative Assembly on June 1st, 2023, and was referred to the Standing Committee on Government Operations for review. The standing committee held a public hearing with the Minister of Finance on June 27th, 2023, and held the clausebyclause review on July 28th, 2023.
I thank the committee for their work in reviewing this legislation. Individual Members may have additional comments or questions. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. I will now open the floor to general comments on Bill 92. Member for Nunakput.
Thank you, Madam Chair. No, just in regards to carbon tax, what are where the carbon tax revenue sharing in regards with the communities that they're going through a tough time right now because of fuel costs, the gasoline costs, to run the hamlet to run our hamlets, for heavy equipment and just general labour for the community for watching the roads and the you know, the water/sewer companies having to buy increased costs in fuel when, again, you know, our carbon tax or carbon that is only 0.05 but across our territory. I mean, like I said before, they should be paying us in regards to cleaning their air for them.
The biggest thing that I have the issue that I have with this is why is it taking so long to give the carbon sharing to the communities in regards to the cost offset for the fuel, gasoline, and the high cost of trying to do businesses in the local hamlet? Thank you.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, the numbers are only just beginning to I mean, the change only happened just this past July. So I don't yet necessarily know how much carbon tax revenue there will be. As soon as the calculation can be made, then the payments can be made.
Member for Nunakput.
Thank you, Madam Chair. No, I'll just give her a little a little briefing here.
From $2.30 and it went, jumped up at the pump for diesel to $2.60 in Tuk. From $2.10, it jumped to $2.30 in Tuk for gasoline at the pump. And it's affecting the community, Madam Chair. So that date she just said is the worst day this territory ever did to us across the territory for the people, taking on carbon tax when we're at 0.05. So why is it taking so long? I don't care about the time in regards to when it happened. I mean, it happened. People are going without. This carbon tax is affecting the trucking, the community local community stores, and it's people are waiting. And is there an update from the federal government on when they're going to start giving people this socalled carbon tax rebate; is that happening yet? Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, again, the federal government changed the tax rates on April 1st of this year and when there's the ability to make the calculation of the amounts for the year, then we will do that and be able to do that. The federal government does provide the rebates on a quarterly basis. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Member for Nunakput.
Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair. Right now, you know you know my thoughts in regards to carbon tax. We are hit so hard in the small communities for cost. The people want to blame the local stores, the trucking companies for the cost. But they should be blaming us in regards to taking on that carbon tax. And like I said before, we're doing the federal government's dirty work in regards to doing this to a territory; we should have never took it on because people are going without in the communities. I got families that for carbon tax that are, like, income support should be increased because of that, because the cost of food. Like I said, safety of hunters. Today I had two boat crews going out, hunting this late in the year, fall, going to get caribou meat because, you know, to subsidize food subsidies for their families. So it's just for myself, I how I look at this is we should have killed the bill that time when we did it because all everybody who's going without right now and the federal government not supporting them, they should be ashamed of themselves in regards to this. Right now we have like, I could go on and on but you're going to hear more tomorrow, so this is just a start.
So can the Minister, I guess, ask her federal counterpart in Ottawa when when is it going to be like, give exact dates on payouts for the hamlets of Tuk, for the people that are individuals in the communities. Thank you.
Thank you. Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, the carbon tax was happening whether we did it ourselves or not. I can say with respect to the communities, again just a reminder that, you know, income assistance certainly is currently to cover the costs as it would for their clients' housing, Northwest Territories covers costs for their clients. But as to a calculation for the amount that would go to communities under the current amendments that are before the House, again, right now, there's a calculation, it's in subsection (5) describing what needs to be calculated. It requires knowing the total amounts of rebates provided, total amounts of grants provided. I'm going to need to do that at the end of the fiscal year. I simply do not have the numbers to do the calculations before that. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Member for Nunakput.
Thank you, Madam Chair. No, just in regards to the communities that we represent and the cost of living with the carbon tax, I think that, you know, sooner rather than later in regards to getting the funding flowing from Ottawa and if it's possible like, we have like, for instance from Tuk, you're 1,140 kilometers away. Cost of living over there, it skyrocketed. So can the Minister try to reach out to her federal counterpart to ask if we could get this rushed because of the carbon tax and carbon tax three or 2.0's coming out. Is there going to be an increase in that too for us, to charge on to our to the people that we represent and the people that voted us in? Thank you.
Thank you, Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, I certainly have asked that the idea put forward that there be some further effort from one of our counterparts in the federal government responsible for this that they be in a position to provide more funding, that they recognize the burden they've put on small communities, and recognize the burden they've put on small Indigenous and remote communities. So let me see certainly if I can provide some further information on their behalf. It's certainly my efforts to distinguish the Government of the Northwest Territories from the choices made in Ottawa, I would stress again that they are different levels of government, but if there is something I can do to help facilitate some further information about funding from federal sources, I will certainly undertake that. Thank you.
Thank you. Member for Nunakput.
Madam Chair, just because Ottawa tells us to do something doesn't mean we have to do it. We're a local community government and legislators of the Northwest Territories. Our madeinthe North tiered system, where's the Minister at with that in the communities and like what we talked about when this was coming forward? Thank you.
Thank you. Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Madam Chair. So Madam Chair, if what is being referenced here is the again, the regulations are contemplating having a base amount for everyone community and then a per capita amount for every community to address the fact that there will be needs in every small community but then also needs associated to greater populations. That is part of what's before the House today. Thank you.
Thank you. Member for Nunakput.
Thank you, Madam Chair. No, clarity, I need clarity in regards to the tiered system. You have higher North communities. You have the Sahtu. And then you have the South Slave. The tiered system, they agreed upon it. Where they're at with the tiered system in regards to the funding that the communities are going to get, and do they have that sorted talking with the federal counterparts in Ottawa? Thank you.
Thank you. Minister of Finance.
