Debates of October 19, 2006 (day 11)

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are in follow-up to the Member's statement I made in regards to the government's policy on overtime, Mr. Speaker, and my questions are to the Minister of Human Resources. Mr. Speaker, I have discussed this with the Minister of Health and Social Services and I do believe that the Minister of Human Resources has been made aware in correspondence. My understanding is that with the centralization of human resources, and I support Human Resources trying to get some consistency and some coordination and reviewing policies to see where consistency is important and following through with that, but in this area I think they're doing more harm than good by making this policy consistent. The fact is, Mr. Speaker, not all government jobs are alike. I don't think anybody could dispute that somebody working in an office in downtown Yellowknife, their job is not and their overtime requirements are not the same as somebody who works in an emergency in the hospital. The policy has to be flexible enough to accommodate that. But my understanding is that the government has a policy where government-wide no one can bank any more than 75 hours of overtime. Anything over that, they get paid out and they can't take time off. So I'd like to know from the Minister whether he thinks that's a wise policy in managing human resources. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Honourable Minister of Finance, Mr. Roland.

Return To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, yes, in fact, as we pulled human resources together and looked at the departments and how they were managing their lieu time activities, we found there was great inconsistency between departments of how it was banked, how much could be used, if it was refillable, how much could be carried over from calendar year to calendar year, and a decision was made, in working with the other departments, that we did need to bring some consistency back to this and establish the 75 hour amount per year. We also do recognize that, in fact, not all occupations are the same and, as well, operation requirements are the same. So we have made allowance for two areas of exemption to this, which we allow them to continue to have a bit more lieu time, and that's the operating room at Stanton as well as employees who have heavy work schedules in early winter and seasonal periods around that time. Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm glad the Minister mentioned that, because I think that speaks precisely to the inequity and the problems that come out of this Minister's policy. Mr. Speaker, it is not right for the government to have one policy, even just within the nursing field. There are nurses at the OR room at the hospital who are allowed to bank 150 hours and the rest are 75 hours. Does he think that's fair, Mr. Speaker? How could that be fair? Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Asking the Minister's opinion on this, I'm going to disallow that question, or if you want to rephrase your question, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Mr. Speaker, I don't want to know the Minister's opinion; that was the wrong use of words. I would like to know, would the Minister review this and see if that is not affecting the morale of the nurses when even in the same nursing field they have different banking hour requirements? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have tried to address some of the operational issues through this policy, and the one reason, for example at Stanton, is because the operating room does shut down each year and for lengthy periods of time. It was felt that this is an appropriate method of ensuring we had nurses to cover that year round when they would come back on. Again, for seasonal or for heavy work schedules in the winter or early spring, are paid out effective as of October 1st is another area. So we do try to put some flexibility in here. But the big matter here is, we have to address our operational issues. Whether a person is allowed to bank more time or not, we still have to fill that position. If they decide to take it and go on an extra long holiday, we still have to have nurses or employees filling that position. So it costs the government money one way or the other. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This flexibility that's built in for OR nurses is done because it's convenient for the government. It does not pay attention to equity issues and fairness to all the health care professionals. The government allows this flexibility because the OR shuts down. But for the rest of the health care professionals, they are asked to work overtime excessively because there's a shortage of workers, they can't take any time because there's a shortage of workers, they're asked to get cash paid out. But you know what? People don't want to work three weeks in a row, or 10 days in a row. As a Minister of Human Resources, does he not see a problem of overworking the workers and treating workers unfairly, Mr. Speaker? Would the Minister revisit this policy? Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, we have revisited this policy. Looking at the direction different departments are in, we felt there needed to be some consistency taken into account here. We've made the necessary moves and made a couple of allowances for operational issues. So the whole fact of lieu time is something that we have. Just having 75 hours in place is to try and help the employee morale and allowing them to take extra time off, not just annual leave earned. So it is something we've tried to address, we've tried to be flexible, but at the same time we have to look at operational issues that each department has to work with. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Roland. Final, short supplementary, Ms. Lee.

Supplementary To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have to tell you that this inequity is caused because of overall shortage of health care workers and it is really playing on the morale of the nurses, because nurses are being treated differently and the policy is based on the lack of nurses and this is just a catch-22 thing that's making the whole situation worse. I would urge the Minister, could the Minister just commit to looking further and talking to his managers and really revisiting this, because I'm telling you, this is…

Thank you, Ms. Lee. Mr. Roland.

Further Return To Question 139-15(5): Human Resources Policy Regarding Overtime/Lieu Time

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I think we can show on a number of fronts where we take very seriously the issues that employees face who work for us here in the Government of the Northwest Territories no matter what department. We have looked at this. We need to bring some consistency back. We have tried to be flexible where operational requirements are looked at, and feel that this is the avenue we need to work with for the time period and see how it works out. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.