Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, that Bill 100, Appropriation Act (Infrastructure Expenditures) 20242025, be read for the second time. This bill authorizes the Government of the Northwest Territories to make appropriations for infrastructure expenditures for the 20242025 fiscal year. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
the motion is in order. To the principle of the bill.
Question.
Question has been called. All those in favour? The question
Okay, it's been a long day. Bill 100 has had second reading.
Second reading of bills. Minister responsible for Finance.
Mr. Speaker, I move, seconded by the honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, that Bill 100, Appropriation Act (Infrastructure Expenditures) 20242025, be read for the third time. And, Mr. Speaker, I would like to request a recorded vote.
Thank you, Minister. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm given 20 minutes here, and I know we all want to leave, but I'll make a promise. If any Member of Cabinet yells out the estimated cost of the Taltson Hydro Expansion Project at any time, which I know all of them know, I will stop talking.
Now, Mr. Speaker, I love hydro. I believe it is the future to getting to carbon net zero. I love hydro for the Northwest Territories. I am so glad for the mines that came before and built our hydro power. We need more hydro, Mr. Speaker. I also love mining, and we need more mines, Mr. Speaker. It would be absolutely irresponsible to allow more mines go in production in this territory that run off diesel, Mr. Speaker. I don't believe renewables are going to get us there. We have seen our solar and wind projects to date come in at an astonishingly high price per megawatt, and they are intermittent. I think the hope of micronuclear is a pipe dream. There's not a single micronuclear reactor in Canada that is currently active, Mr. Speaker. One day, perhaps, maybe we can put them on the back of a truck, and those can power a mine, but I don't believe in fantasies. But you know who does believe in fantasies, Mr. Speaker?
The Department of Infrastructure and the GNWT, because 25 years ago someone had a dream about expanding the Taltson Hydro Project and running a transmission line to the diamonds. And if we built it, Mr. Speaker, it would have been amazing. We would be sitting here rich, paying it off, and all of our power bills were lower. But, instead, we spent 25 years not building it. And, Mr. Speaker, in the life of this Assembly, the most significant thing to happen in this project in the last 25 years occurred; that is, this government secretly, without really telling anyone, decided that it was no longer going to the diamond mines, which was the whole point in the first place, Mr. Speaker.
And, Mr. Speaker, why is that project 60 megawatts? Because that's how much power the diamond mines needed, Mr. Speaker. We have been talking about expanding Taltson at 60 megawatts for 25 years, Mr. Speaker. And we have forgot that we actually have 10,000 megawatts of undeveloped hydro potential in this territory. We have the Bear, La Marte, Lockhart, MacKenzie, Snare, Snowdrift, Taltson, and Yellowknife River, Mr. Speaker, all with undeveloped hydro potential, and no one has ever even talked about those in 25 years because they got so laser focused on a project that they have repeatedly failed to build, Mr. Speaker.
The Minister talked about well, we got too focused on who was on the board. Well, Mr. Speaker, the previous government fired that board because it had members who said listen, I'm not going to take this Taltson project on without longterm power purchasing agreements. And the GNWT didn't like that. They didn't like an independent arm's length corporation having some say over what their hydro infrastructure looked like because, Mr. Speaker, if the NTPC gets given a dam and doesn't have anyone to buy the power, guess who's rates are going up? All the other ratepayers. So we are talking about enough money here, some questionable amount that anyone could yell out at any time, Mr. Speaker, but it is fair to say it is enough to pay every single individual's power bill in this territory for the next 50 years, Mr. Speaker. And that's not surprising because we're talking about 60 megawatts. Essentially doubling all the current power we sell, Mr. Speaker. Every single power bill you have ever paid in your life is how much we are talking about for 50 years, Mr. Speaker, for all our residents. You could do the math on that, and you'll get to the number. I may have just kind of leaked it, but whatever.
Mr. Speaker, it is billions and billions of dollars. There is zero transparency in this project. There is zero transparency from the government about the cost overruns. There is zero transparency about any of our energy projects.
We have been promising a line to Fort Providence and a line to Whati for years. Well, I still don't know the cost of those projects. We are light years behind on them, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, and no one, despite years of asking has answered a simple question, why don't we just build a transmission line to Alberta? Mr. Speaker, we keep talking about selling power to Alberta and Saskatchewan. You know why they don't want our power? Because it's currently at 35 cents a megawatt, Mr. Speaker. And you know what they're selling power for in bulk? 9 cents a megawatt, Mr. Speaker. Let's build a line south and buy their power. Stop trying to sell our 35 cent power, Mr. Speaker.
Every single mine we could ever open in this territory is a drop in the bucket of what Alberta currently produces and provides to industry. We should tie into their grid and call it a day, Mr. Speaker, but we are stuck on this one project. We are stuck asking federal government. We are stuck wasting Indigenous government's projects. And no one will even tell me what they think it costs.
Mr. Speaker, the cost matters. The cost per megawatt on production is the entire debate we are having. It tells you whether you are going to develop another hydro system. It tells you whether you are going to continue to burn diesel. It tells you whether you're going to use LNG. The cost per megawatt is the entire debate. That is why we need to know how much it's costing to build 60 megawatts, Mr. Speaker.
Mr. Speaker, this is my plea. Say the number. Bring some transparency until we have an election. Until then, I ask every single worker in the GNWT who spent 25 years, some of them their entire career on a project that's going nowhere, stop working on it. I am so sorry for you. I am sorry we have wasted your time on this hopeless endeavour, on this fantasy of made up math and made up numbers that does not work.
To all of the Indigenous governments we are meeting with right now, that we are keeping in a room, leave, walk away. Our government is lying to you. They are asking for hundreds of millions of dollars in P3 funding that is going to be a terrible investment for your people. And, Mr. Speaker, that business case we have is absolute garbage, and the government needs to make it public. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member for Frame Lake.
Merci, Monsieur le President. That's a very tough act to follow. I think it's most excited I've seen the Member in the entire Assembly. But I actually agree 100 percent with his analysis. I just tried to make some of those arguments, perhaps a little less vigorously in this House, but bang on. It's absolutely the case with Taltson. I think it's it's a good it will be a boondoggle if it gets built, just like most other hydro mega projects in this country. So I commend my colleague from Yellowknife North for his vigorous analysis and urge my Cabinet colleagues to make more information about this, and some of the other mega projects, public. Because, quite frankly, these are poor investments. They're not even going to bring northern benefits. You know, these things are just we could we shouldn't have put them forward as three big projects happening at the same time. They've just raised such unreasonable expectations. Our Ministers go to Ottawa. Ottawa says these guys just can't make up their minds, they don't know what they're doing.
So in any event, Mr. Speaker, I will be voting against this capital budget as I probably have probably the seven or other eight ones that I've dealt with in the life of this my two terms here because the budgets the capital budgets that we are getting from Cabinet just are a reflection of wrong priorities. When we spend more money on roads than we do on housing, wrong priorities. Wrong priorities. We shouldn't be spending more money on these mega projects. They're just not going to go anywhere. If we have to build something, build the Mackenzie Valley Highway. I actually heard even one Cabinet Minister say that in their reply to the Commissioner's address as advice to the next Assembly.
Get realistic. Build one infrastructure project. Do it at a scale and pace where the communities can benefit from it. So stop wasting time. Stop wasting money. Invest in our communities and build real energy selfsufficiency.
So, yeah, this capital budget, again, has the wrong priorities, lack of transparency as my colleague has pointed out, chronic over budgeting. You know, when we have carryovers that are in the literally hundreds of millions of dollars from one year to the next, we cannot get the money out the door because we for whatever reason, we just but that chronic over budgeting means we have to run an operating surplus to help pay for the infrastructure. Sometimes it's some of the dollars come from the feds. That's great. Sometimes we got to match 25 percent, whatever. But it means we have to run an operating surplus, which means we're shortchanging programs and services. We're not meeting people's basic human needs in the Northwest Territories because we're trying to spend it on mega projects that are not going to go anywhere.
So, again, Mr. Speaker, I will be voting against this capital budget. I would commend my colleague from Yellowknife North for his dismantling of the Taltson boondoggle. Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member for Frame Lake. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member for Nunakput.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I told you I'm sitting I'm a rose between two thorns.
Mr. Speaker, I'm in full support of this motion, and I just wanted to let you know. But at the end of the day when projects like this, the communities see a little bit of potential to have work and employment into the communities. And, of course, I want the allweather road to head from Wrigley to Inuvik. But at the end of the day, we have to set a precedent and try to work towards with our Aboriginal groups to make a difference for the people that we represent. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member for Nunakput. The motion is in order. To the motion. Member for Great Slave.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'll keep it short so I'm not keeping everybody from dinner and cocktails. So I just want to say that I do support this budget. I'm happy to see a lot of infrastructure projects going forward. 100 percent road funding that can't be used for houses, so we don't need to have that debate. It is money that's coming from the federal government to fix up our roads, and we didn't have to put any money into that. And I just want to say I completely support all of our communities and all of my small community colleagues' communities to be connected by roads, including what my colleague from Monfwi said about getting Gameti and Whati on there. And I want to see or sorry, Wekweeti. I want to see the entire Mackenzie Valley Highway road built. So not even just to Norman Wells but all the way up to my colleagues in Inuvik's riding so that we no longer have to worry about the Dempster Highway, so much; we still want it, it's beautiful and we need a tourism piece there and I know that yourself is on that highway, Mr. Speaker. But, you know, it would be great if we could have two areas to bring in resources, supply chain, and have some redundancy in our network of roads. So I support this. I will be voting for it. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member for Great Slave. The motion is in order. To the motion.
Question.
