Mr. Chairman, we are hoping to have the framework agreement signed off before the end of this month or very close to the end of this month. The funding arrangement, we’ve yet to get a timeline on that; it could be another couple of months. Thank you.
We’re still on page 20, Municipal and Community Affairs, Regional Operations, not previously authorized: $3,172,000.
Municipal and Community Affairs, Capital Investment Expenditures, Regional Operations, $3,172,000 approved.
Total Department, not previously authorized: $3,172,000.
Total Department, $3,172,000 approved.
Moving along to page 21, Health and Social Services, Health Services Programs, not previously authorized: $2,729,000. Mr. Ramsay.
Mr. Chairman, over the past seven, eight years, the Government of the Northwest Territories has spent millions and millions of dollars in the area of electronic health records.
I just wanted to know — and I’m not sure if the Minister of Finance or the Minister of Health and Social Services has this information — who’s in charge of electronic health records and the implementation of all this money that’s being spent in this area? Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, this project here works through the federal government. They’ve established the Canada Health Infoway process, which is established as an independent, non-profit organization launched by Health Canada in 2001. They originally started with $1.2 billion in that area.
The Department of Health and Social Services has been working on our own system but also adapting to what has been brought forward as a national initiative so that we can — as we’ve had patients going out to other jurisdictions — share information on the same platforms. Thank you.
I’m not a Member of the Social Programs Committee. But I think it would be useful for Members, perhaps through the Social Programs Committee and then other Members could be invited…. I personally would like to see what we’ve gotten for the $12 million or $13 million we’ve spent in the area of TeleHealth and on electronic health records. I’d like to see how it’s working and where we’re at because it’s a substantial amount of money that we’ve spent there. I’d like to think that we’re making some progress there. And I’d like to see some evidence of that first-hand. Thank you.
Mr. Chairman, TeleHealth is an initiative that started a number of years ago to work and provide services. For example, X-rays in the smaller communities can be shipped to doctors in our larger centres to help in the diagnosis situation. This piece falls into a different category. The funding started to flow in 2006-2007 and goes through to ’09-10. So it is, again, short-term money in the sense that it is capped.
The Minister of Health and Social Services can also provide more detail to this specific request.
Mr. Chairman, I appreciate the Member’s request for information. I think it will be a good idea for the department to go the Standing Committee on Social Programs and make presentations on a number of areas having to do with software programs and electronic information programs that the department is delivering. This one item on here is part of the Infoway project, which is a national project, as the Minister mentioned. TeleHealth is a support program. Then we have the electronic medical records system, which is a different program as well.
In the interest of briefing Members, as some of the Members are new, I think that would be a good thing to do. I want to accept that invitation, and I will work with the Chair of the Standing Committee on Social Programs to accommodate that.
Any other questions? Still on page 21, Health and Social Services, Health Services Programs, not previously authorized: $2,729,000.
Health and Social Services, Capital Investment Expenditures, Health Services Programs, $2,729,000 approved.
Total Department, not previously authorized: $2,729,000.
Total Department, $2,729,000, approved.
Moving on to page 22, Education, Culture and Employment, Education and Culture, Special Warrants: $250,000.
Education, Culture and Employment, Capital Investment Expenditures, Education and Culture, Special Warrants, $250,000 approved.
Total Department, Special Warrant: $250,000. Agreed?
Total Department, Special Warrant, $250,000 approved.
Page 23, Transportation, Highways, not previously authorized: $1,500,000.
Just a couple of questions on the cost — the $1.5 million to provide funding to cover the new permanent structure to replace the failed Caribou Creek drainage structure. I just wanted to ask a couple of questions.
Do we have some type of warranty or insurance to cover what would appear to be the fault of the engineer or whoever’s fault it is? Why are we paying $1.5 million?
We do have to recognize this culvert was put in place in 1973. The department has been doing its maintenance. It was on an annual basis. Based on my understanding, those large culverts are looked at for their safety. This one is felt to have gone through collapse because of the water flow situation that eroded underneath that specific facility. I would have to look into whether or not our insurance program would cover us off in this area.
The $1.5 million — I’m not going to point fingers. They do have people who are supposed to be going out there inspecting these things. If they pass an inspection and then collapse, there is responsibility there somewhere, as far as I’m concerned.
My question is on $1.5 million. Is this a true and accurate estimate that it’s going to cost to do that? Based on what I’ve been seeing from the department, I can almost expect to see another sup or another request for more money because the $1.5 million is just not going to cover it, if that’s what they estimated. Then the $422,000 that we just said yes to a little earlier, I think that was just to do the detour around where it is. And now we have $1.5 million.
I’m just curious. I would like to know or be reassured that this $1.5 million is a true estimate and that they’re not going to come back after the actual work and request more money. It is getting to be common practice with the department to underestimate and, when the actuals come in, request more money.
The total of the project on this one is identified by the department at $1.925 million; $425,000 will be reallocated from the major culvert replacement capital project. So they are realigning the $425,000 and asking for the $1.5 million.
We can have the Minister provide the schedule of events they have identified and the costing with those.
So the $425,000 the Premier made reference to, that’s on top of the $1.5, but that is not including the $422,000? I am assuming we are expecting work to be started this spring or even this winter because we do have a lot of anticipated traffic up the highway this summer, and we want to make sure that this is a safe place to drive. As it stands right now, I think they’ve made some signage estimates, which was a good thing. But the way they had it detoured was awfully dangerous. So my question is: the $1.5 is in addition to the $425,000 the Premier spoke to, but it doesn’t include the $422,000 that we had already approved a couple of pages before?
Mr. Chairman, the total amount for this piece of the work is $1.925 million. That does not include the earlier amount for the work around dealing with the collapse as it occurred.
The department also informs that this work must be done during the winter season, as part of the condition on the water licence application from the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, as we have to deal with this before spring runoff occurs to protect the fish habitat in that area. This bridge construction has to be done this winter, and the detour has to be removed before spring runoff occurs as well.
In regard to this item, I requested the Minister of Transportation to give me a breakdown on the age of the culverts on the Dempster Highway. The report that got back showed that the majority of culverts on this stretch of highway were installed in 1973. Again, they are 37-year-old culverts, and we are starting to see that corrosion is happening in these culverts. I think this is probably not the first culvert that you are going to see collapsing on this road system. I think that the government has to ensure that we do a literal test of our culverts to make sure that this doesn’t happen.
I know for a fact that there was a collapse in the culverts when they were building the Dempster Highway at Rengleng River, where they went to similar culverts as this one that collapsed. Those are similar types of culverts that were put in at the same time, and I think it is important that we take a look at those culverts too. That is a major cost to this government to replace them.
Also, if we have an emergency like we had in this case, to have the road totally shut down because there is no means to put an access route around that major crossing, especially around the Rengleng River, again, this shows that the age of those culverts is a threat to the public. I believe we have to replace them, hopefully sooner than later.
I would like to ask the Minister of Transportation what they are doing to replace the rest of the culverts on this part of the Dempster Highway.
Mr. Chairman, this deals with the existing situation. The department business plan and their capital acquisition plan would have to identify these areas. They do have a major culvert replacement fund available, and that’s where, for example, the $425,000 would be allocated from this specific area. I am not sure if the Minister of Transportation would have all of that information here this evening on the plan. They are going forward, as well. That plan would have to be voted on by this Assembly as we proceed with our budget processes.
Mr. Chairman, the department is going through their inventory. They are looking at the culverts in and around this area, in terms of 1973, and they are looking at all the culverts in the Northwest Territories. They are looking at what it will cost to replace them, and they’re updating information and reprioritizing some of the work that they have to do with regard to the culverts. There are another 54 bridged culverts, as noted, needing some form of rehabilitation.
They are looking at their costing, as the Premier alluded to. There is a process we’re going to enter into, looking to replace or repair some of these culverts. The department has a discussion program on a yearly cycle, so we do estimate the cost to put in the culverts or to put the bridge in. I think they base the numbers on some of the similar work that’s going to happen and what numbers they get. Certainly, as we delay, the costs are going up every year in terms of the material and that.
There is a process going on within the department, and of course, we’ll have to meet with the House and our colleague Members in terms of putting through some of the projects. We want to continue with replacing of culverts that are in dire need.
In regard to culverts and also the Department of Fisheries and Oceans, I know they have raised the issue with us in the past in regard to the stress on fish and everything else: the migration of fish and the effects that culverts have, especially in the spring runoff. I think at some point we’ll probably have to replace the majority of these larger culverts we have on creek crossings or river crossings in regard to dealing around Fisheries and Oceans.
I’d just like to ask the Premier if he can make it possible for the Department of Finance to give a report to the Economic Development Committee in regard to the problems we’re running into with culverts collapsing and whatnot, and other — not threats — liabilities we may have for the unforeseen, but know they’re there.
But because of this situation, we’re seeing more and more of these things happening. I think this does have something to do with global warming. I think we can’t take it lightly that we’re seeing more and more washouts; we’re seeing higher runoffs and everything else. It is having an effect on our culvert systems, on our road systems. I think the Premier can direct his department to report back to the Economic Development Committee on some way to update us on what the department is doing in this area of culvert replacement.
Mr. Chairman, the Department of Finance does have a risk section within it to look at our risks and liabilities. I’ll work with the department to see what we can provide.
Returning to page 23, Transportation, Highways, not previously authorized: $1,500,000.
Transportation, Capital Investment Expenditures, Highways, $1,500,000 approved.
Road Licensing and Safety, not previously authorized: $300,000.
Road Licensing and Safety, $300,000 approved.
Total Department, not previously authorized: $1,800,000.
Total Department, $1,800,000 approved.
Now, Committee, we’ll turn to the bill. I would ask you to stand down the clause-by-clause and Preamble, and turn to the Schedule found on page 3, if the committee agrees.
Agreed.
On the Schedule, Part 1, Vote 1, Operations Expenditures, Total Supplementary Appropriation for Operations Expenditures: $21,305,000.
Schedule, Part 1, Vote 1, Operations Expenditures, Total Supplementary Appropriation for Operations Expenditures, $21,305,000 approved.
Part 2, Vote 2, Capital Investment Expenditures, Total Supplementary Appropriation for Capital Investment Expenditures: $7,951,000.
Schedule, Part 2, Vote 2, Capital Investment Expenditures, Total Supplementary Appropriation for Capital Investment Expenditures, $7,951,000 approved.
Total Supplementary Appropriation: $29,256,000. Agreed?
Total Supplementary Appropriation, $29,256,000 approved.
Now, Committee, I ask you to turn to the bill. We will stand down the Preamble and look at clause 1, page 1.
Clauses 1 through 7 inclusive approved.
Page 2, the Preamble.
Preamble approved.
The bill as a whole.
Bill 2 as a whole approved.
Does the committee agree that Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 3, 2007-2008, is ready for third reading?
Agreed.
Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 3, 2007-2008 is approved for third reading.
Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 3, 2007-2008, approved for third reading.
I’ll thank the Minister. Thank you, Mr. Roland, and to your witness as well.
What is the wish of the committee? Mrs. Groenewegen.
I move that we report progress.
Motion carried.
We’ll have the report of the Committee of the Whole, Mr. Abernethy.
Mr. Speaker, your committee has been considering Bill 2, Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 3, 2007-2008, and would like to report that Bill 2 is ready for third reading.
I move that the report of the Committee of the Whole be concurred with.
Do we have a seconder for the motion? The Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.
Motion carried.
Mr. Speaker, Orders of the Day for Thursday, February 14, at 1:30 p.m.:
Prayer
Ministers’ Statements
Members’ Statements
Reports of Standing and Special Committees
Returns to Oral Questions
Recognition of Visitors in the Gallery
Acknowledgements
Oral Questions
Written Questions
Returns to Written Questions
Replies to Opening Address
Petitions
Reports of Committees on the Review of Bills
Tabling of Documents
Notices of Motion
Notices of Motion for First Reading of Bills
Motions
Motion 2-16(2): Highways Maintenance Tender Packages to Standing Committee on Economic Development and Infrastructure
(R. McLeod)
First Reading of Bills
Bill 1: Interim Appropriation Act, 2008-2009
Second Reading of Bills
Consideration in Committee of the Whole of Bills and Other Matters
MS 1-16(2): Sessional Statement
MS 9-16(2): Public Housing Rental Subsidy Survey Results and Plans for the Future
Report of Committee of the Whole
Third Reading of Bills
Bill 2: Supplementary Appropriation Act, No. 3, 2007-2008
Orders of the Day
Accordingly, the House stands adjourned until Thursday, February 14, 2008, at 1:30 p.m.
The House adjourned at 6:03 p.m.
