Thank you, Madam Chair. I am going to ask Deputy Minister Loutitt for that.
Thank you. Deputy Minister Loutitt.
Thank you, Madam Chair. We don't have that information handy, but we can provide that. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Deputy Minister. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I have nothing further.
Member for Great Slave.
Thank you, Madam Chair. That was the question I was also going to ask: where was the education and Internet access? Thanks to my colleague for asking that. It is my understanding that we are looking at all of these back pages? Okay. Thank you. My question is around the Marine Transportation Services Revolving Fund on page 259. I am looking at the marine freight transport and charters, the revenues section. We have nothing estimated for revenues for charters for the upcoming year. Can the Minister or the department speak to whether or not we think we are going to do any charter loads this year? Thank you.
Thank you, Member. Minister of Infrastructure.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I totally have the wrong package here. I apologize for that. In that case, I am going to ask ADM Brennan to answer.
Mr. Brennan.
Thank you, Madam Chair. For that question, when the budget was done in the fall, with COVID impacts happening, we weren't quite sure over this past year. We had very little charters, and we didn't really budget anything for charters for this year with the uncertainty that was around business in the North, basically. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Brennan. Member for Great Slave.
Thank you, Madam Chair. With that being said, perhaps things are maybe not quite so drastic as they may have gone. Does the department anticipate that we would see any revenues from charters in the upcoming year? Thank you, Madam Chair.
I am just going to take a minute or so break, just to give the Minister a few minutes.
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I'll call Committee back to order. Thank you for the short little break. Just because of the way our restrictions are with not allowing so many witnesses into the Chamber at once, we've been switching out the Minister's witnesses. Some of the information items may not have the right witness in here. What we can do is: if it's not the right, then we can just check to clarify with the Minister first before we move along, and if you have ones that are with the Minister's witnesses who are in here, then the Minister can just get the information back to the Members on their questions, if it's not the right witness. How does that sound?
Agreed.
Good. Moving forward, we will continue on now. I'm going to go back to the Member for Great Slave.
I'm going to re-ask my question, then. I asked: do we anticipate we will have any charters in the upcoming year? Thank you.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I'll pass that over to ADM Brennan.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Brennan.
Thank you, Madam Chair. With respect to charters for 2021-2022, we have updated some numbers since the main estimates were completed, and right now, we're anticipating about $2.4 million in charter revenue next fiscal year. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Member for Great Slave.
Thank you. Just to confirm, that being the 2021-2022 fiscal year, the upcoming one? Okay. When I look at the charter costs for the 2019-2020 actuals, we lose money on the charters. Is the department looking at, perhaps, re-evaluating, as part of the governance model evaluation, whether or not MTS should be doing charters in the first place? Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I think I've got some of my papers figured out here. I want to reference that charters are the leasing of a vessel for use. Daily rates are charged for the vessel as well as personal costs. The Member did mention that we will be doing a governance review of MTS, and I think that's important to note whether we continue to do the work that we're doing, filling our 16 communities with transportation fuel. What's the cost benefit, and do we make money or not in doing some of our charters? That is part of the governance review when we're looking at some of the costs for charters and whether we do make money or not and is it the best use of our vessels and our time. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Member for Great Slave.
Thank you for that. Before I move on, I'll just make a comment that if the Minister hasn't already been reached out to from a lot of charter companies that we compete with, I'm sure she will be soon. I'd like to go to technology service centre and just ask quickly. You've got all the rates, and I apologize for jumping back and forth a bit, 254. You've got the different rate chargebacks for the different departments. It's not my belief that the COVID money or the extra costs to TSC to move everybody virtually or online would be captured here. Can the Minister explain where that money would be found in the budget? Thank you.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Madam Chair, I'm going to give this to ADM Brennan to be able to provide that information. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. ADM Brennan.
Thank you, Madam Chair. The amount that's on page 254 is the amount for departments currently, and the Member is correct, there is nothing here for COVID. The TSC still supports the COVID secretariat, but the COVID secretariat has a separate budget for TSC-related issues. We chargeback to them directly. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Brennan. Member for Great Slave.
Just to clarify that a little bit further: any of the money that was spent earlier on in the COVID situation, such as a year ago, March, April, to get everybody working from home, that would also be captured under COVID secretariat costs, not Infrastructure? Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. My understanding, it is a cost that Infrastructure has taken on as part of that. I'm just going to look at ADM Brennan to just confirm that. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Brennan.
Thank you, Madam Chair. What the Minister said is partially, mostly correct, that, in 2019-2020, in March, that was when the government decided that we should not be working from our work site and sent everyone home, there was a lot of requirement for remote devices and support for remote devices, so lots of laptops, cell phones, et cetera, and getting the network ready for people to work at home. The TSC did overspend its budget, and the Department of Infrastructure, because it is a chargeback model, had to pick up that amount. That is the amount that you see there at the bottom line, $881,000. The COVID secretariat actually was approved, I think, with a budget effective August 1, 2020, so any costs incurred by the department prior to August 1st stays within the department. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Brennan. Member for Great Slave.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Maybe the Minister could commit to providing a little bit of a summary at some point of what it did cost us as a government to move from working in offices to the virtual, in a breakdown of, say, hardware versus software upgrades and such that were needed. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I think that's something we need to put some work into, but I'm sure we have that information. I'm just going to confirm with Mr. Loutitt to answer that. Thank you.
Deputy Minister Loutitt.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I think that we have some breakdown, but maybe not quite as much as the Member wants. The department has spent about $2.7 million on COVID costs. Approximately $1 million of that is for the TSC, and $675,000 is hardware and software, but I don't have the breakdown between hardware and software. If the Member would like, we could easily provide that information, as well. In summary, we've spent just over $1 million on TSC since April 1 on COVID-related costs. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you. Member for Great Slave.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I'm a nerd. I like data. I'd take that, if you don't mind providing that; that would be great. I have a question now. Sorry, I'm jumping around a little bit, to the Petroleum Products Revolving Fund on page 257. I would also like a suggestion that we make our page numbers larger, going forward. With the Petroleum Products Revolving Fund, I note that we still are carrying an accumulated deficit at the beginning of the year of $1 million. I'm just curious to know, and I always struggle with wrapping my head around this one: have we paid off the extra debt that was incurred due to the tainted fuel delivery? If so, what is this $1 million deficit, then, reflecting? Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Madam Chair. There were a number of changes within the fuel services, including, and if I can, the increase of $4.5 million that is due to the increase in sales that is expense; the decrease of $5.2 million mainly because we have some deferred maintenance on some tanks; $450,000 for fuel to Tlicho; decrease of jet fuel delivered to Inuvialuit Settlement Region. I think that's where the Member is questioning, is the $550,000 decrease. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Member for Frame Lake.
Thanks, Madam Chair. I'd like to turn to the Yellowknife Airport Revolving Fund. There is a significant surplus that has built up here, and I'm just wondering when we're going to start to spend it. Thanks, Madam Chair.
