Thank you, Member for Nunakput. Are there any further questions on this page, "Increase the number of resident healthcare professionals by at least 20 percent"? Member for Frame Lake.
Thanks, Madam Chair. You had better start the clock again. I don't expect a lot of time on this, but I am just wondering what role could or should scholarships play with regard to recruitment. That is probably something longer-term, so scholarships as a tool and also whether the Premier and Cabinet see any links to the polytechnic. Thanks, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member for Frame Lake. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Those are ideas that we are searching for, ideas of putting scholarships, so when we do our recruitment plan, those are the kind of things that we are looking for suggestions from. We will be gathering that feedback. Is there a link with the polytech? I would like to say "absolutely" right now. However, we made a commitment with the polytech that we would be going out in the fall to do a survey, find out from people what we should specialize in. In that regard, it would be inappropriate for us to make a commitment until we have done that work. The Minister of Education, Culture and Employment might want to expand on that. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Minister of Education, Culture and Employment.
Thank you, Madam Chair, and the Premier is absolutely correct that it is too early to say what we are going to be doing at the polytechnic university, but one thing about universities is that they are willing to put on programming. If the government has money and it wants to fund a program that would help increase healthcare professionals, that is something the college would probably gladly do. Those are the kind of opportunities we will have going forward. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Madam Chair. One of the concerns I have with this one is: I recognize it is best practice to increase resident healthcare workers and that we should be training as many nurses and getting as many nurses as possible. Right now, the case is that we cannot find those nurses and that locums are really filling the gaps. One of the beautiful things about locums is they are brought up here and they can immediately jump into a position, or at least that is the goal.
My concern with this is that what we may see is that we want more resident people, so we are going to start getting rid of the nurses we are currently bringing up from down south. I am looking for a commitment that we are not going just simply start using fewer locums without actually having the nurses in place. I think this is a long-term goal to actually reach. I know the health authority has posted a deficit. They just came packed with another supplementary, and one of ways that you could maybe cut costs is: let's stop bringing up so many locums. However, I am afraid if we do that the situation is going to get worse, so I am looking for some sort of commitment that we don't stop bringing up nurses from down south until we have those positions filled.
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. This is a long-term goal. I think it would be very inappropriate for anyone to just discontinue what we have. The priority is to increase the number of resident healthcare professionals by at least 20 percent, yet the priority does not say about decrease the number and then increase. If we are providing services to our residents in the North as public servants, which we should be, and we already know we have a shortage, it would just be illogical for us to stop using locums until we have that filled. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, and I am glad to hear that. My other concern or one I would like to see with this is: I have raised a number of times some more flexible positions, some more part-time positions. I have a number of constituents who are retired nurses. They are not willing to go out for a full-time nursing position, but they would gladly come back at casual or part-time. I think that is another one of those things is that we really have to do whatever we can to retain people, and that may involve being a little flexible in our hours or creating some different positions. I am wondering if that is part of that in any of these items here, looking at some kind of alternative ways, whether it be part-time or casual, to make sure we can retain anyone who is willing to work here.
Anyone?
---Laughter
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. Madam Premier.
HON. CAROLINE COCHRANE: Thank you. I will start by saying we do want qualified people in our healthcare professions, so I just want to clarify that. Our number one "How we will do it," if we say we are going to work with employees and partners to
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Madam Chair.
All right. Are there any further questions on "Increase the number of resident healthcare professionals by at least 20 percent"? Member for Kam Lake.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to echo what my colleague the MLA from Yellowknife North just said in terms of being able to hire retired nurses. I, too, have spoken to a lot of retired nurses who have literally walked out the door and then been told that, if they want to be able to work casual shifts here and there when we are desperate for nurses, that they would do that. Then they have been told that they have to come in and compete in an interview process, and they are just not prepared to do that when they have literally walked out the door. There are people in town who have expressed to me that they are definitely willing to come and do shifts here and there to relieve some nurses who are at the hospital, and so we just have to make that a little bit more doable for them. That is one thing. My question, though, is about staff surveys. When we did our Stanton debriefing, we did hear about staff surveys taking place that were specific to our relationship with our P3 contractor, but I am wondering if these staff surveys are more for staff satisfaction about working conditions and workplace culture. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member for Kam Lake. Madam Premier.
Absolutely. This is not about how do you like the new hospital, or how do you like the contractor providing food services. This is about how do we keep you and how do we get new people? If you are doing a good survey, you have both closed questions that are very, this is what I want to know, how much time do you want to work sort of thing, and open questions that say: what are some ideas that you would give me? We have to be open to both. This survey will incorporate both some closed questions and some open questions so that we can get all the feedback as appropriate. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Kam Lake.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Do these surveys preserve the confidentiality of the person completing them, and where do they go? Thank you.
Thank you, Member for Kam Lake. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Confidentiality is a huge issue. I can't say where they go. The Minister might have an idea, but I know that, when I did the housing survey and I went right across the Northwest Territories and asked people, I was worried about people being penalized and being evicted from their homes. I actually picked out a person within the department who I felt I could trust, and that poor person, I made all those surveys go through that person. The Minister does have that authority to decide that, if she so wishes. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Kam Lake.
Thank you, Madam Chair. No. I think that is really important. I think one step farther might even be to be able to remove people's names completely because we do live in a very small territory that gets smaller and smaller by the day, and we all get to know one another. If we want people to be 100 percent honest, then we need to make sure that their personal relationships on their work floors are protected in that process. That would be my one recommendation there. Thank you. No further questions.
Thank you, Member for Kam Lake. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Any good survey only has information, identifying information, on what is necessary. If we don't need to know your name, if there is no implementation on how we retain and recruit people, then why would I ask it? If we don't need to know what community, then why would I ask it? However, there are times where you might need to know what community, because the issues might not be the same across the whole of the Northwest Territories. Good surveys are only asking the data that they need. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Are there any further questions on "Increase the number of resident healthcare professionals by at least 20 percent?" Member for Hay River South.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I guess things have changed with workers nowadays, that includes the doctors and nurses, and people want quality of life. In the past, you could count on doctors and nurses to work 20-hour days. I think those days are gone. Having locums come in here, and nurses, I think that is going to be the standard for a while, and I agree with my colleagues that we can't throw them out to the wind. We should be planning how to best use them to our advantage. Firstly, for quality healthcare for our residents, and the second thing we worry about is the cost.
I guess I am wondering, the healthcare system is, of course, in a deficit. What impact does having to bring locums in, outside medical services and professionals into the North? How does that impact, and are we capturing that back from the federal government? Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member for Hay River South. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I was a bit confused about what the actual question was. My guess, and correct me if I am wrong, is that you are asking if the federal government is covering the cost of this. That isn't the case, although healthcare is on the agenda for the federal government and all the Premiers. Premiers across Canada are asking for flexibility within that. I will carry that message forward. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Hay River South.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I guess the other area that we don't tap into, for whatever reason, is through immigration and doctors and professionals from other countries. Why is that? I guess I know why it is, but I want to hear it from you why that is and what we are going to do about it or what we can do about it, working in conjunction with the federal government. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Member for Hay River South. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. The reason that is, is because there is not one set of standards of care or training or qualifications across the world. For example, I have heard nightmare stories of people in some countries that are pulling teeth on sidewalks. Do you want me to make them your dentist? Those are the things that I am asking. There has to be a quality of care that people need to meet the standards, the Canadian standards of healthcare. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Hay River South.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Just a comment. Actually, I am under the non-insured health benefits, the Indian Affairs, and that is the care we get. Thank you, Madam Chair.
---Laughter
Thank you, Member for Hay River South. I will take that as a comment. Are there any further questions on "Increase the number of resident healthcare professionals by at least 20 percent?" Seeing none, committee, we will move on to page 35, "Create a polytechnic university." Questions? Member for Yellowknife North.
I would like to begin, on behalf of Frieda, saying the headquarters will remain in Fort Smith. Also, I think I would like, on this issue specifically, to move on from the number of conversations that have happened around the president and begin to look to the future. I am very excited about this. I have been to a number of university towns across the circumpolar North, and the key is they are economic drivers. They employ hundreds of people. They are very inspiring. Yukon College, unfortunately, is going to beat us and will become Yukon University in two months. I am going there in two weeks from now to get a tour. They are doing amazing things. I hope we can put a lot of things behind us and get forward on the path. My specific question here is: can we have an update on where we are working with the federal government to access infrastructure funding immediately ongoing? Do we believe we are going to be able to capture that funding, and what is the chance of it being 100 percent funding?
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. What I can say is that, right now, the federal government is looking at a post-secondary strategy for the North. I am guessing, but I am not 100 percent sure if that is just the three northern territories or if that includes northern Quebec, northern Labrador, all of those that sometimes the federal government includes. That, I don't have the answers on. I do know that, right now, when they do give infrastructure funding, it is usually -- not always, but usually -- 75 cents, or 25-cent dollars. As I said in this House before, we are in a place that we need to start asking for more, and I am willing to take that on and start asking for more and explain to them the huge gaps in the Northwest Territories and the territories compared to the southern jurisdictions. I cannot commit, though, that that will happen. I would love to be able to, but no, it is in the hands of the federal government. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I know that there have been a number of questions on this, but one of the very exciting things about a university is that, once you actually get it to that point where it is accredited; it has a board of governors; it has a senate; it is arm's length from government; professional universities go and get their own funding. They raise money through endowments. There are lots of donations. The potential for a university to go and get 100 percent funding is much greater than it is for the current Aurora College structure, which is essentially the GNWT going and getting money.
I am just looking through this. Can I get a sense of the timeline of when we expect Aurora College to have a board of governors again? A senate was recommended in the Aurora College review. What timeline can we kind of expect it to be arm's length from the GNWT, and what is the end date we are looking at in that it will actually be a university? Thank you.
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. Madam Premier.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to transfer that question to the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment. Thank you.
Thank you, Madam Premier. Minister of Education, Culture and Employment.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I will go back to the Member's first question. We don't have big asks out to the federal government right now, because we haven't done the infrastructure assessment. We have a good idea of what we might need, but you need better than an idea before you go asking for money. The work to determine what infrastructure we are going to need will be done later this year.
The second question that you just asked was about timelines. As I have said before, we are looking at 2022 for a return to a board of governors. The senate would be some time thereafter, and what that senate looks like or what the governance model looks like is still to be determined. I can say that, but that doesn't mean that that is the way that it is necessarily going to be, because we are still early in this. We are still in the phase where we are strengthening the foundation of the college and preparing for the transformation. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I am happy to hear 2022 for the board of governors. That is sharing my term, so I can see that step. Hopefully, I will see a senate formed. Then I just want to clarify. This is to transform Aurora College over the next six years. Are we on track, and do we believe that, in 2026, Aurora College will be a university, accredited as such?
