Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I spoke earlier today about a guaranteed basic income, but I would like to start by focusing on what the closest program we have to that in the Northwest Territories is, income assistance. My question for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment is: is our current Income Assistance Program working? Are people actually incentivized to get a job, or is it simply just keeping people in a cycle of poverty? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member for Yellowknife North. Minister of Education, Culture and Employment.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have said before in this House that we could always do better with every program in the territory, and the Income Assistance Program is one of those. The Member asks whether it's working, and that depends on what exactly people want out of the program. There is a seniors' component where seniors are supported, and we are not trying to incentivize people who have aged out of the workforce to get back to work. There is a program for persons with disabilities who just can't work. We are not trying to incentivize them. The program is there to help people with their basic needs, and, in that sense, it is working. We make sure that, if there is a home for someone, if someone will rent a home to a person, we will pay for that. If someone can't afford a home but someone is willing to rent to that person, we pay for that, and we will give them money for food, so, in that sense, it's working. Is it a program that is allowing people to get back to work? For some people, it is. There are people I work with who have been on income assistance at a point in their life and have used it as a stepping stone to get further. With that being said, it's not the program that the Member is describing, one which is doing a very good job at getting people out of poverty. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I appreciate that answer from the Minister, and I do recognize that the seniors and disability streams, the goal of those programs is not to get people back into the workforce. I do think, at the heart, both a guaranteed basic income and income assistance's goal is to get people into the workforce, but on their own terms.
I previously asked questions to the Minister regarding looking into a pilot project for a guaranteed basic income, and he said we simply don't have the policy staff. Given we are now in a global pandemic and entering into one of the largest economic recessions of any of our lifetimes, has the Minister's view on that changed?
We actually have less staff now than we did when the Member asked that questions. There are dozens of employees from ECE who have moved over to Health to help with those efforts. There are employees working from home who are having issues accessing government files, and things like that, so we are in a worst position to do that type of work, especially given what we have.
I appreciate the Member's comments earlier that we could start this program tomorrow, if we wanted. This pandemic has shown that departments can be responsive, and they can move quickly. However, I don't know if we can move that quickly, spending half a million dollars on a program that doesn't exist today that needs to be put into regulations that we need to have metrics on, and things like that.
Since day one, I have been committed to improving the Income Assistance Program. I agree with the Member that we should adapt that program or reform that program so that it does incentivize getting people to work, and that is not an easy task. It's not as easy as giving people $36,000 a year. That's not necessarily going to do it, so I'm working with the department to try and turn what we have into something approximating what the Member is talking about, understanding that, if we do want something like a guaranteed basic income, it is a decade away, as the Member stated.
I recognize that, perhaps, times when I say it can be implemented tomorrow, the program delivery model still needs to be there, and it will take some time, and I appreciate that many of the hard-working ECE staff have been redeployed. I guess that was almost a yes that the Minister is willing to work with me and have some of these further conversations. I'm concerned that he feels he doesn't have the policy staff in the department right now. What efforts are being made such that the department has the staff who can actually develop a program or a roadmap so that we can have a meaningful conversation about this issue?
On a regular basis, I badger the Minister of Finance and the Premier to give me more policy staff so I can pursue some of these types of initiatives, but, in the end, ECE does a lot of work. We provide a lot of people with a lot of support, and that's what the focus is on right now, especially during the pandemic. I would love to be able to go out and get some more policy staff to do this type of work in the background, but I think that the staff we have right now are doing a great job at delivering services that are needed and being adaptive and responsive to the situation and, in this environment, those staff can learn from what's happening right now and work toward those types of improvements. Because, you know, this pandemic has taught everyone a lot of lessons, and I'm going to make sure that those lessons don't go to waste.
Thank you, Minister. Final supplementary, Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate that, and I will pester my other colleagues in Cabinet to try and get you some more policy staff. In the interim, to me, one of the hearts of a guaranteed basic income is allowing people to work and have that income not be penalized. I recognize that, in Section 21 of the regulations, there is a formula for how people are penalized as they earn income on Income Assistance.
Right now, I believe this punishment is disincentivizing people from working, especially if you're also in public housing. By the time it comes around, if you've been earning a little bit of income and you're reassessed, you're losing half of your money. If you're earning $15 an hour in the Northwest Territories, it's more like you're earning $7 an hour, and I don't see any reason for someone to work like that. My question is: is the Minister willing to look at increasing some of the exemptions to allow people to earn more income on Income Assistance? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I've already done that work. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Oral questions. Member for Inuvik Twin Lakes.
