Committee, we will now consider the Department of Health and Social Services, starting on page 8. I will now open the floor to general comments on the Department of Health and Social Services. If there are no further comments, does the committee agree to proceed to the detail contained in the tabled document?
Agreed.
Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures), No. 2, 2020-2021, Department of Health and Social Services, administrative and support services, not previously authorized, $589,000. Does committee agree? Member for Frame Lake.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I see in the estimates here that this is for virtual care. Can I just get some details of what the funding has been used for and how virtual care has been implemented during the pandemic? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I can give you some detail on what the funding is intended for, and then I would turn it over to the Minister of health for any update as to what may or may not have happened in the course of the pandemic. The funding under the agreement is to be used firstly for licensing of the various types of software that is required; the hardware itself, which would include iPads, iPhones, and laptops that will actually allow for that care to be provided virtually; and also support for staff in terms of setting up that hardware, training, and setting up the teleconferencing facilities that are required. Again, Mr. Chair, with respect to any update on where that project and where that work is at, I would ask that we go to the Minister of Health and Social Services, please.
Thank you, Minister. Minister of Health and Social Services.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. This was the platform that we used to provide virtual care during the pandemic, and the funding is specific to the COVID-19 response. What I can tell you is that the current work is around allowing for secure messaging between healthcare providers and patients. This is an ongoing project, and I just want to note that the expenses here are fully offset by a grant from the federal government. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures), No. 2, 2020-2021, Department of Health and Social Services, administrative and support services, not previously authorized, $589,000. Member for Kam Lake.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair. Just in follow up to my colleague's question in regard to virtual care: is any of the software that we acquired from funds from the federal government to support COVID-19 and virtual care throughout COVID-19 usable beyond when they were used in the spring? Is it like a software program that we now as the GNWT can continue to use to support virtual care? Thank you very much.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I don't have the details in terms of that agreement. I'll see if perhaps the deputy minister has it or else the Minister of Health and Social Services might.
Mr. Kalgutkar.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. My understanding of the program is going to be permanently used to expand the virtual care capacities of the health system, so it's going to be a permanent solution is what my understanding is. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures), No. 2, 2020-2021, Department of Health and Social Services, administrative and support services, not previously authorized, $589,000. Does committee agree?
Agreed.
Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures), No. 2, 2020-2021, Department of Health and Social Services, COVID secretariat not previously authorized, $31,677,000. Does committee agree? Member for Monfwi.
Masi, Mr. Chair. This is a whopping millions of dollars here. We can't just approve it just like that. In this House, maybe the Minister or the Premier can explain. The Premier did indicate that there was a strong support from Indigenous leaders across the North. I've been making a call to my leadership. I don't see the same note as the Premier alluded to. Just wondering if the Minister or Premier can elaborate more if there is overall support from Indigenous leadership across the North, and also the mayors and the NWTAC, are they in support? If so, can I have those in writing if they do have that in writing, Mr. Chair? Masi.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I know that the Premier's office has engaged in a pretty wide variety of conversations and engagements over the last little while, so I'd ask that we direct that to the Premier, please.
Thank you, Minister. Premier.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Absolutely. We had an initial meeting with the Indigenous governments, I can't remember if it was Friday. I believe eight Indigenous governments were there. Out of the eight, seven accepted. The Tlicho government was not there at that time. We did reach out to other governments, as well. Unfortunately, not all governments have had a chance to get back to me on that. I can say that the Tlicho government hasn't given their support, but they haven't said they're not supportive, as well. That is because we haven't had the opportunity to talk to them on that.
I can say that $31 million is a lot of money for this year, absolutely. Twenty-three million dollars, almost, is covered by the federal government, so that leaves almost $9 million. We have asked the federal government for more support for the COVID secretariat. The federal government, talking to Prime Minister Trudeau, has promised to support us further so we've just put in the ask for the additional monies. Once we hear back, which will probably take a little while, I'll report to committee on what that looks like. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Premier. Member for Monfwi.
Mr. Chair, from what the Premier shared with us, obviously not everybody is onboard. This whole thing called secretariat, another form of bureaucracy within this government. We have 5,000-plus employees, almost 6,000, in the Northwest Territories, and we're going to create another 150. Mr. Chair, obviously, I fully support a coordination to deal with COVID-19 since March. We were doing fine with MACA and various other departments coordinating with internal resources, internal bodies that can take on these work assignments. When it came to the secretariat in August, that was the first time we heard the creation of this secretariat and no input from the public.
Mr. Chair, just as recent as yesterday when I went to a funeral in Behchoko, obviously people are still questioning why are we spending $87 million on the bureaucracy if we have so many needs in our region? Lot of people are dying left and right. In my region more specifically, Mr. Chair, just this past weekend we lost another young lady due to addiction. Mr. Chair, this is a very sensitive matter, and here we are. We're talking about $31 million that's on the books here. I understand that the federal government, $24 million -- I don't know why we need to bundle everything together. It's a federal approach where everything is bundled so even though you are against certain items, either you vote for the budget or your vote against it. I feel very uncomfortable with this going forward. I support other issues are on this supplementary with the exception of this COVID secretariat.
Mr. Chair, I'm getting a lot of feedback from my region and also surrounding the North, whether that be emails, phone calls, and people are still confused. Why are we supporting this COVID secretariat? We're talking about $87 million today. I'd be surprised if it's still the same number in the next few years as we approach this ordeal with the whole COVID secretariat. I just don't understand why we were pushing forward as a government. In my view, it's the cart before the horse. There was no engagement with the leadership when it was first created. Yes, I understand the Premier says, after the fact, we started talking to Aboriginal groups. We don't operate that way.
Mr. Chair, this is a general statement, but I do have a motion coming after Members speak to this. I'd like to know why the Premier, the Cabinet, is ignoring the public outcry and continuing to push this secretariat. The $31 million that's before us today, the public don't want it. Obviously, we don't want it. We want more housing. We want more addictions after-care program, deal with our homelessness. As soon as you walk out this door, we have so many homeless people, our people. So many of them are from my region I'm trying to deal with. We haven't identified money for them. Homeless people, yes, they're talking about a shelter, but to put another $31 million towards this COVID secretariat, 150 people that would be working for us. People are shaking their heads. People that I talk to, anyway.
Mr. Chair, it's very frustrating sitting here to deal with this matter that we're pushing this supplementary ahead without any engagement of the public. I'd like to know what the public view is on the secretariat. The leadership, not everybody's on board. Not all mayors are on board, but we're still pushing through. Mr. Chair, I'm kind of running out of time, but we've heard over and over, housing, homelessness, it's a real issue. Here we're talking about co-investment. Still talking about maybe hiring a person, we should have been proactive to say, well the whole secretariat, the $87 million, before that discussion even took place, that co-investment should have been the first priority in my view, taking advantage of $60 million, 75 percent from the federal government, 25 percent from us. No, here we are still talking about it. Are we going to miss the opportunity?
Mr. Chair, I don't want to add more to it because I have already talked about this on numerous occasions now, and I do have a motion that will speak to it, as well. Yes, I will leave it at that. It's a statement to the government that this is unacceptable. From the discussion around the table, obviously, this is going to go ahead with the supplementals, but it will be a recorded vote, so I would like to know who all stands for the government. Mr. Chair, that is it for me until I present a motion on this. Masi.
Thank you, Member. I will take that as a statement, but if the Minister has any comments?
Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chair, a few comments. I tried to catch most of the statements that were being made along the way. Firstly, with respect to the notion that the government was "fine" back in March and April when COVID-19 first hit, respectfully, Mr. Chair, things were not fine. The entire government shut down. At one point, I think we peaked with 188 staff who were redeployed in the course of the entire fighting of the pandemic. When 188 staff are redeployed, those staff members are not working in housing; they are not working in addictions; they are not working in social services; they are not working in some of the other departments where they are needed. Much of the work that needs to get done in the course of government does not get done. I think the point was made: stop using COVID as the excuse. However, the excuse was that the entire government was shut down and staff were being asked to do other work and other things.
At the same time, we were being asked: why aren't there more people at the border? Why aren't there more people at the airports? Why isn't there more enforcement? Why isn't somebody answering the phone line at NWT protect? The response to that was to create temporary positions, term positions, not permanent positions, within the GNWT to help fill up or to maintain some of those redeployments but to ensure that the other work still gets done by having people available.
Within the COVID secretariat, the 150 positions right now include 22 at NWT protect as of the moment, 16 over at NWT 811, 23 at the isolation centres, 21 in regional compliance, 44 at border compliance. Mr. Chair, that is one of the areas that does distinguish the response here in the Northwest Territories as compared to other jurisdictions, which right now are all facing a very serious second wave of the pandemic, with the exception, really, of a lot of the jurisdictions who, like us, have actually made an effort to have border compliance, to have isolation in place, and to really avoid bringing a lot of waves of travel.
Mr. Chair, really, the positions that have been created here are what answers that, are what provides the actual ability to implement the orders of the Chief Public Health Officer. To the extent that this is now before the House, Mr. Chair, it's here because that is our ability to actually continue to do the things that the Chief Public Health Officer has put in place. It's our ability to actually implement those orders.
As far as engagement, the Premier may want to speak to it, but I can also assure the House that I was involved in a lot of those calls in the early days. There were weekly calls in the early days of the pandemic. Those calls have slowed down over the summer, but to my knowledge, they actually have begun again. No, not everyone is going to agree on exactly the right way to fight the pandemic, but not everyone is agreeing across Canada or across the world, either, Mr. Chair. What we are doing is following the Chief Public Health Officer and ensuring that her orders are being implemented. The secretariat is one part, but one part, of making sure that we are doing that. It is one, and it is the part that is obviously right here. There is over $175 million being spent on the pandemic, a large proportion of which has funding coming from the federal government, including a large proportion of which is being funded from the COVID secretariat for the pandemic from the federal government, with the result that we wind up with only around $8 million that is actually required right now to the COVID secretariat to maintain the functions that are happening as border compliance, regional compliance, isolation centres. The calls that I was on, Mr. Chair, around the COVID secretariat, around the COVID response, they do not want people back in a lot of the communities. Some of the communities continue to be quite afraid of having travel cross the borders.
With respect to the question of whether the public and what the public reaction has been, Mr. Chair, I am sure we have all heard different things from our constituents, but I have certainly heard a lot of people saying that they are happy with the response that the territorial government has initiated and maintained and are not looking to have reopening particularly quickly. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Premier, do you have a comment?
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Absolutely. I will talk about the engagement. The MLA is correct that we did not have good engagement at the beginning. We did offer AOC a briefing on it back in April; that never happened. We offered one again a couple of months later, and it got deferred. When we finally did get in, it was open camera, and it was our first chance to present to AOC. It happened to be public, so it wasn't the way I expected it to go. It's just how it went. That is just how things go when we try to be transparent. We all learn from our lessons.
Since then, I did engage with the Indigenous governments, I talked to the municipal governments, we talked to the business community. More and more people are getting on board when they understand what it is. Mr. Chair, it's $87 million, but people always make the assumption that that's for this year. That is not for this year. That is for two and a half years. We were asked to provide a four-year budget. If the pandemic goes on, we are projecting $87 million, worst case. However, as stated in the Assembly today, we are already looking at the major costs. It's our isolation centres, Mr. Chair. I think that, although I did not reach all Indigenous governments, most Indigenous governments -- I stand to be corrected if not, but I think most Indigenous governments would say that our isolation centres are one of the key things and our border control is one of the key things. Again, I can stand to be corrected because I have not gotten to them all.
The other thing, too, Mr. Chair, is that we don't have a choice. The $23 million that has been allocated to the COVID secretariat is not an option we can just say to the federal government, "We want to take that money back, and give us money for housing or use it for homelessness or addictions." That money had been earmarked. It had defined areas that we were allowed to use it for. Within the Speech from the Throne, I think that Members would know that COVID-19 is an item within the Speech from the Throne; it's not an afterthought. There will be more money coming for COVID-19 is my assumption, and there will be more money for the other areas. This was money specifically to address COVID-19 in specific categories, and we did not have the option to say we wanted it for addictions or any other thing. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Premier. Member for Frame Lake.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I do have some questions and some comments I would like to make about this particular item. The first thing, though, I will start with some questions. I have had mixed reaction from some of my constituents about this COVID secretariat, and there is a lot of concern about the amount of money that we are being asked to put into this. I want to get a commitment out of the Minister of Finance or the Premier about some kind of regular reporting of the expenditures for the COVID secretariat functions to year-end and maybe into the new year, as well. Can I get some kind of commitment about what kind of periodic reporting can be made to Regular MLAs and to the public about the expenditures for the COVID secretariat functions from now till year-end? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am happy to make a monthly commitment. The Department of Finance will be collecting monthly variance reports on the COVID secretariat spending and can make those public as they are available. It does take some time, so September 30th, it does not mean we necessarily put it out on September 30th, Mr. Chair. When it does get gathered and reported and analyzed, it can take a couple of weeks, but we will be getting them and putting them out on a monthly basis. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Member.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Thanks to the Minister for that commitment. In the monthly variance reporting, presumably it's not just going to be a bunch of numbers, that there would be some attempt to explain the changes or differences from what is anticipated in terms of places where there might be extra spending that was unanticipated or, hopefully, reductions in spending moving forward. Is that going to be kind of documented in these monthly reports? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am inclined to just give the simple answer of yes, but rather than use hand signals, perhaps I'll turn it over to the deputy minister. He can describe in a little more detail what the contents of the report might be.
Deputy minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. What we'll do for Members on a monthly basis, and then we'll post it on the Department of Finance website, is a very detailed variance report on the COVID secretariat by every category area. In that category area, we will report on the costs that have been incurred to date; the variance to date; the projected costs that we're expecting to the end of the year and the variance of those projected costs; and an explanation of why we are seeing a difference. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, deputy minister. Member.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I do appreciate that commitment, and it's, I think, prudent financial management. Earlier, I mentioned how there have been mixed reactions from my constituents. I had an online constituency meeting I think it was early in October about this, and certainly, it was a big source of discussion. I do need to say that I think the communications around the COVID secretariat left a lot to be desired, and I think we've all learned from that experience, I hope. I don't think it was communicated very well.
This is not about creating some new institution or department or something. This is about carrying on a number of functions that have actually been going on since March and April. This is about the ProtectNWT function. It's about the border control functions. It's about the isolation centres. These are all functions that have been going on literally for months. The functions, as I understand it, that have been added to the secretariat are some additional staff around coordination and communications. We've all asked for clearer communications; I just said that a few minutes ago myself. These are things that we need moving forward to help us better manage our response to the pandemic and allow us to look at different ways of controlling some of the costs and finding cost savings. I think there is a misunderstanding in the public that this is creating some brand new bureaucracy, some brand new positions. People have been doing this job since March, April, for the most part. This is not about creating a new institution, a new body, whatsoever. It's about trying to find a way to better coordinate that, and look at cost saving potentials as we move forward.
This is not about approving $87 million in spending. The Premier said that is the worst-case scenario. It is over three years. That is not what is before the House right now in the supplementary appropriation. What is before the House with this supplementary appropriation is approval to spend $32 million on the COVID secretariat functions to the end of this financial year. We've heard from the Minister of Finance that there is $24 million in federal assistance that is already on the table, with the prospect of more coming, so what we are being asked to approve, Mr. Chair, is $8 million in new funding to carry on the COVID-related response that has been in place since March, April, May, June. That is something that I am prepared to support, with the assurance that there is going to be monthly variance reporting.
The Premier also spoke about efforts to find cost reductions, particularly half of these costs are related to the self-isolation centres. She has made clear commitments that there are going to be ways to look at rapid testing and whether the self-isolation periods might be changed; having people isolate in regional centres that are not on the self-isolation list right now; working with communities, if they are prepared to have people self-isolate in their communities. There may be some additional savings there, discretionary travel. I agree that we probably shouldn't be covering some of those costs ourselves, so I'm convinced that we're going to find ways to bring those costs down, even for the $8 million that we're being asked to approve between now and year end.
I think that's all I need to say now, Mr. Chair. With the commitments that I've received here in terms of regular financial reporting, a commitment to ensure that there are ways to reduce these costs moving forward, I am prepared to support an extra $8 million to keep in place the sound controls our government has had in place to keep COVID out of the Northwest Territories. I think that's a price that most members of the public are prepared to continue to spend until March 31st to get that peace of mind and keep our residents safe and sound. I'm prepared to support this with the commitments that I've received here in Committee of the Whole from our Finance Minister and from our Premier. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Member. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm not sure that there is much to be added. I appreciate the recognition that, to do the work of government, you have to actually do the work of government. That does mean that you have to have people doing the work and you have to coordinate the work, and you have to spend money to get it done. Fighting COVID and implementing the measures we have costs money, and the Member actually does point out quite accurately that, as of right now, the federal government is providing us with an amount that brings down the net cost to the GNWT of just over $8 million. I'm going to make one more commitment, if I might, and I think the Premier actually spoke to it. If it was missed or if it wasn't clear, Mr. Chair: we aren't going to stop going to the federal government to try to engage. I mean, we will certainly make that commitment and can also continue to update the Members to the efforts that are being made, both, I know, by the Premier's office, but also on the part of the Department of Finance.
I have more than once said in the regular calls that I continue to have that supports from the federal government vis-à-vis our COVID response must be individualized to the jurisdictions. Each jurisdiction is responding in a way that fits that jurisdiction. The way we are responding fits our jurisdiction, and we are going to continue to take that message forward. That will be another commitment, and again, we will continue to provide updates to the Members as to what we are doing in that regard. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Member for Thebacha.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am going to be supporting this expenditure, and I am doing it because I have just been in contact in the last 10 minutes to reinforce exactly what the three leaders have said in the community of Fort Smith: the chief of the Salt River First Nation says they support the secretariat; the Fort Smith Metis Nation support the secretariat; and I was also in contact with the mayor of the Town of Fort Smith. I will be supporting the supplementary in full.
I know there are other issues that are of concern, especially the housing issue. Because the housing issue is a major concern with regard to making sure that we access the $60 million, I think that one of the things that you can do, Minister, is: because most of the housing issues are for vulnerable people and Indigenous people in the Housing Corporation, at times like that, especially in a pandemic, you might be able to get 100 percent. There have been exceptions before. I am privy to that because, as a former chief, and a strong one, there are exceptions that, because we are in a pandemic, we might be able to just ask them to switch that over. I would encourage you, Minister, to ask that special favour of the Government of Canada.
I don't have a lot of questions. I am going to be voting for this because my community has said that this is what they want. They want protection; they want to remain safe. We have a large group of people. Everybody is vulnerable, and what's happening down South is not a good thing. I think we are very fortunate in the Northwest Territories to keep the numbers as they are, and hopefully, they stay that way. I'm not going to ask any questions. I will be voting in favour of the secretariat.
Minister, do you have any comments? Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.
Marsi cho, Mr. Chair. I've been thinking about this for a long time and consulting with the leaders of my riding. The general consensus is: there is not a lot of support for this. Right off the hop, I was reluctant, and I was very skeptical. If you try to make the best decision possible, you look at all the stats. You try to look at all the benefits. I just can't, the rationale behind this, I firmly believe this is a mistake. There is a better way through than allocating what we are allocating. I think that throughout, so far in this sitting, we've mentioned various issues that we are having during this pandemic, everything from addictions and there are gaps in services. Those breadcrumbs are spread out throughout the floor here, and we've talked about them. I honestly think there is a better way through. This isn't it. That's what I believe.
Again, it's frustrating for me. It was funny, when I first saw the first documents come out about this and they had the name secretariat, it made me think of that beautiful horse from the 70s was a beautiful thing to watch, graceful, speedy. I thought: this secretariat is not so much graceful to watch. At the same time, it's tough to navigate this, too. I get the position that the Premier is in. We have to navigate a pandemic, an emergency, and to do what's best for the North, and I appreciate that. Just listening to the Premier's comments, she'd said that there was not 100 percent support on this, not a lot of people were reporting back, not a lot of Indigenous governments reporting back. That's a clear signal. I think that's something that you should really listen to.
Last year, in our round table, we vowed to work with each other for any major initiative or any sort of major decisions, that we'd work with each other. I didn't see that here. There wasn't a clear example. Again, just to share some of the comments from my colleague from Frame Lake, the communications part was something that we really needed. What we need to learn from that was: we need to do a better job with communications. I don't have any questions at this time. I've said my piece, and I'll leave committee with that. Marsi cho.
Thank you, Member. We'll take that as a comment. Member for Deh Cho.
Initially, when this was brought back to our attention back in, I think it could have been June or this past summer, I think I was totally surprised about what was forming in terms of COVID for $87 million. That was the price tag put to this project at that time. Then, in subsequent questioning to the Premier on the floor of the House, I wasn't getting answers to many of my questions. Probably one of the biggest ones I had was: was there any absolute thought given to this process? Was there a think-tank group to look at ways we could do this without breaking our bank because as things progress, we find that, and probably the Finance Minister was even saying it herself, that there was no guarantee that the federal government will throw in any more funds. They did for the $23.4 million, but it's like any of our other major projects. It's the 75-cent dollar that we've got here. We have to put in 25 of our own money.
My concern was: we're taking it from other programs and services to fund this secretariat. We made suggestions, I've always mentioned them, the public health emergency, plus we began with the state of emergency, which gives you the power to direct staff, to recruit from within our workforce of almost 6,000 people. I stated people would have stepped up to the plate and want to be part of this initiative. I stated at that time, most of them will say yes. They'll have a story for their grandchildren at that point, saying, "Yes. This is what I did." For the $23 million, we throw out lots of ideas; we throw out suggestions. Nothing gets listened to, nothing.
We still have border check stops that no one is happy with because they still see Alberta plates, BC plates; even this summer, there were Quebec plates driving around in the Northwest Territories. It's a free for all. Then we have a situation on Fort Liard, where we didn't even give them the due diligence there to put actual people at that border crossing. Rather, they put an unmanned gate. There is nobody around there because we're hearing stories of vehicles and quads and everything going around the gates. It's not even manned. We're doing a real sloppy job. I don't know what the situation is up by the Dempster, whatever at the border there, or what's the situation there. Things haven't really improved that greatly there. People of my K'atlodeeche, they keep wanting to put up security, and they have. Fort Providence they had it there, now they took it down, now they've got it back up again because that's how concerned they are about people coming into the communities.
One of my Member's statements was the authority that the Chief Public Health Officer has in granting exemptions without consultations with First Nations communities or with the communities, community leaderships. We had an incident that really put that to the test where the CPHO granted an exemption to a family, and the community was up in arms. These people just came from Edmonton, and Edmonton is a hotspot for us. It's just south of us, with a very many cases of the coronavirus there. Especially, it's starting to hit the major hospitals in that area. I'm not going to say that I'm totally against having something in place.
Like I said before, we could use the local workforce. I think I mentioned it, too, in my Member's statement: Pierre Elliott Trudeau, to enforce something one time, there was an incident in Quebec; he invoked the War Measures Act. He had the authority to do what he wanted to do with his people. That's why I'm saying. You could do the same thing, declare a state of emergency or something to put it back, and you could make things happen. Let's try to look at ways we can keep our costs down so we're not affecting other programs and services. These are the type of things that we don't want to have to negotiate between what's good for the people. They can still be done, and I still believe that we should look at what the federal government gave us was $23 million. Let's make it work within that budget. I'm pretty sure we could get pretty much close to that.
We've got lots of frivolous travel. The medical travel is okay. The frivolous ones are people just going up and down, in and out of the territory at will. My God, what are we doing to control that? I saw on a Facebook post; I copied it, and I sent it to the CPHO. I think the Premier was in it, too. Someone was coming up from the South with a trailer of goods. I said, "What is going on with this?" I got an email back saying, "That's okay. They've probably got a self-isolation plan already," but they didn't know themselves. They didn't even check that.
We've still got a flawed system here, a flawed secretariat. They want to do it for $87 million. Let's try this $23 million first. It's the federal government's money, not ours from the territory. I would prefer to see it go that way rather than spend an astronomical amount of money on something that's just not going to fix everything. Those are my comments related to the secretariat expenditures. I wish you would really heed a lot of what we say here on this side of the House because there's experience on this side. Mahsi.
Thank you, Member. I'm not sure if there's a question in there. Minister, do you have a comment?
Thank you, Mr. Chair. As the Minister of Finance and the Minister responsible for the public service, Mr. Chair, I believe over 400 members of the public service have put their names forward volunteering at various times to take part in the government's response to COVID-19. Not every one of them can necessarily be positioned somewhere as part of a direct COVID response. Although, I believe at one point, we hit 188, if not more, that were, in fact, redeployed. Again, every time you redeploy someone, you take them away from their home position, and you take them away from the programs and the services that I understand the Member is wanting us to be so mindful of. I agree with the MLA that we cannot interrupt the programs and services that people of the Northwest Territories are depending on and relying on, which is why you can't simply redeploy everybody without filling those positions or without finding a way to otherwise provide those services.
That's, again, part of the reason why there have to be new positions created to respond to COVID-19. I think a lot of people are tired of hearing it, but it is unprecedented. It is something that no one in the world knew what to do and how to respond to. Different governments in different jurisdictions are still figuring that out, but it takes new positions to do it. Otherwise, you wind up interrupting the programs and the services of government.
Mr. Chair, I want to make one last comment again with that lens of being responsible for the public servants is that it's not only those that were deployed under the front lines or deployed to respond under the secretariat's functions. Every single public servant, in my view, over the last several months have been responding to COVID-19, and every single one of them should take pride in the work that they've done. Every single one of them should take pride in being on the front lines of a response from the government, whether they were working at a desk to ensure that invoices were paid to governments or to businesses that were struggling, or whether it's people who are working in the health department. I know the Member is concerned about, and has spoken more than once, and I think I remember hearing the statement in the House, speaking about people's desire to be involved. I just wanted to acknowledge that, indeed, I do think the public servants really have risen to that occasion, so I appreciate that he's bringing attention to that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
