Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Although I don't see her in the House, I believe I have constituent Ariella Fox from Yellowknife Centre, and I'd like to acknowledge her officially on the record. As well as I'd like to take a brief moment, as you did, Mr. Speaker, acknowledge the Handley family. Mrs. Theresa playing hearts with her at Avens and, of course, I served with Premier Joe Handley for some good years at the House, and we did some wonderful things. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member from Yellowknife Centre. Recognition of visitors in the gallery. Member from Hay River North.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Of course, I must recognize former Premier Handley. I appreciate him being here, and I must say I have a new-found respect for the work that he has done as Premier as well as all others who have done that work. So thank you. And I also want to recognize him as the chair of the board of governors of Aurora College and thank him for that work as well. So thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise today, Mr. Speaker, to acknowledge former Northwest Territories Premier Joe Handley who was named one of this year's Symons Medal recipients. The Symons Medal is awarded to outstanding individuals who have made an exceptional contribution to Canadian life, and former Premier Handley has no doubt earned this honour for his decades of dedication to northern society.
Mr. Handley has had an impressive career as an educator and public servant who has worked as deputy minister for numerous departments, including the housing corporation, renewable resources, and economic development. Since his previous election to the Legislative Assembly for Weledeh, he was named Finance Minister and ultimately became our 10th Premier in 2003.
I want to offer my sincere congratulations for his achievement of this historic award and wish him all the best as he continues to contribute his best efforts towards positive change and progress for our communities. We have gained much thanks from his ongoing leadership, and I am privileged to have him as a constituent of Range Lake. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are for the Minister of Housing NWT. First, can the Minister confirm what is the current number of people on the NWT public housing waiting list? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Member from Yellowknife North. Minister of Housing NWT.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The current number of people on the housing waitlist is 897 applications across the North. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So next, can the Minister confirm whether it is expected that all of those 897 families can be housed through federal funding to Indigenous governments? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Unfortunately, I don't have that information. Based on what I know to date, Indigenous governments are working on market home plans, other type of market rentals for professionals in the community. The 897 on the waiting list are looking for affordable public housing units so, unfortunately, they may not meet the criteria for market home plans. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you. And thanks to the Minister for that. Can the Minister confirm that a major barrier to increasing our public housing stock, at least up to this point, has been resistance to the idea of increasing the transfer of resources for O and M from the GNWT to Housing NWT? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Government of the Northwest Territories, through our finance department, provides us about $80 million a year for Housing NWT operations. We do get funding from CMHC and from CIRNAC to operate and maintain the homes across the North. That's an additional $20 million. So that's the sum of our public housing operating funds throughout the North. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Minister for Housing NWT. Final supplementary. Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. And finally, does the Minister believe that it is both a federal responsibility and the GNWT's responsibility to fund public housing through capital and O and M resources, or is it only a federal responsibility? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. It's a shared responsibility. It's important that this government and the federal government realize that we need to invest in public housing in the North. I pressed this with Cabinet and my FMB colleagues. This is important. It's a priority of this government, of the 20th Assembly. The work we do and the message we brought to the Council of Leaders in Ottawa was a shared responsibility, working with Indigenous governments in the Northwest Territories, making sure that the message set across from both the federal government and Indigenous governments is these are public housing units in our communities that our families and people in the communities live in and need on a day-to-day basis. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Minister of Housing NWT. Oral questions. Member from Inuvik Boot Lake.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are for the Minister of Infrastructure regarding the condition this year, as I mentioned in my statement, of the Dempster Highway and the Inuvik-Tuk Highway. Can the Minister provide some context on why this year there were delays and what had happened to cause the conditions on the highway this year? Thank you.
Thank you, Member from Inuvik Boot Lake. Minister of Infrastructure.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there were some delays and some particular challenges this year owing to the nature of the spring melt and just an unusual amount of snow that came in last year resulting in an unusual spring as that was melting. So that certainly posed challenges to the department and to our contractors. We also had two different contracts up in that region that were both out for renewal this year, and so that had to go through the usual public procurement processes. There was some delays therein. Every time, though, Mr. Speaker, we were reaching out to existing contractors who were continuing to work, the contracts were getting extended and, really, a big shout-out goes out to them for always working through those projects and those needs. And I appreciate I have heard a lot from the region and every time I would, would go back and was always quickly able to be assured that work was happening and was able to be assured when it was going to happen. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. And thank you Minister Wawzonek. And, yes, we did have a huge amount of snow this year in our region. So can the Minister kind of provide an update on the current status of those contracts now that were, as she had mentioned, had expired and where they're sitting today? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I'm very happy to say that all of our O and M contracts for the region are -- for the Dempster region are now in place, they're being operationalized. The ITH O and M contract is still being finalized. We spent a lot of effort on this one this summer and have certainly been approaching it, I think, from a view of some relationship building with contractors in the region. I do expect to have an update on that this week, and I'm looking forward to it being in place before the freeze up. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. And thanks again, that is good to hear that the contracts will be let. So I guess, finally, Mr. Speaker, going forward, has the Minister tasked the department with coming up with kind of a long-term plan to ensure that years like this year is not something that we'd expect going forward next year and in future years, Mr. Speaker? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there is regular reviews and regular eyes on both highways throughout the entire year. What I've asked for though, and very happy to commit to the Member that this information will flow to the Members from the region as well, is that we have outlined in advance what the regular maintenance process is, what are the regular times when there's someone that does go out and inspect, and what is the regular maintenance that's going to happen. So MLAs and Members and regional residents know themselves in advance what they can expect. Obviously, when there's extreme weather events, which there seem to be regularly, we will then also have to go out and do more. But at least folks will know in advance exactly what to expect, what's happening, and then there's hopefully less surprises and more eyes on the ground, frankly, to monitor and see how our efforts are going. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister of Infrastructure. Oral questions. Member from YK Centre.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. And on my acknowledgements, I just want to correct the record. It's not hearts, we were playing bridge at the seniors -- I don't know why I thought that earlier.
Mr. Speaker, my questions are for the Minister of Finance, and it's with respect to my Member's statement earlier today. And what's causing me concern is this entitlement to write the federal minister exclusively on their own decision including Cabinet's without it informing Members that they're asking for more money. So my question for the Minister of Finance is, is what is the reasonable threshold on taking on new generational debt that will warrant a conversation with Members prior to writing that letter? Thank you.
Thank you, Member from Yellowknife Centre. Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, about two years ago we began a very extensive process of having the fiscal responsibility policy reviewed. That process was undertaken with the Members of the House during the 19th Assembly, and part of what we did at that time was to review and to include an expressed threshold in our own policy after which point we would then be obligated to go to Ottawa. By doing that, it put an obligation on us. It was an obligation that all parties in this House, and anyone really within government would know, that once we hit the threshold of being within $120 million of the borrowing limit, the Minister of Finance would then be obligated to write to Ottawa to seek a borrowing limit increase. We do keep this House informed through various presentations, both to Members confidentially, to caucus, so that when we are approaching that threshold, we are now triggered to go to Ottawa to write. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Unilateral decision to ask for how much, that's the problem here. We have no idea what generational debt this Minister is now taking on and saddling this Assembly. So this is well beyond an operational decision, Mr. Speaker. How much debt has the Minister requested from the Minister of Finance of Canada? Thank you.
Mr. Speaker. At this point in time, we've simply put Ottawa on notice that we're going to need to have a conversation with them, that there's a lot more information that will have to go into that, a lot more planning, including, quite frankly, happy to have that conversation with Members of this House. It's not a unilateral decision. We are triggered by the fiscal responsibility policy. We've undertaken that effort to begin that conversation, but the process is not one that happens overnight. Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, my questions aren't intended to be a trial by ordeal. My questions are intended to be like: be honest, how much are you asking for? So you sent a letter requesting we don't know how much we need, we don't know how much we want, but we want more? Please, we must be able to narrow it down a little bit because Northerners are the ones who are going to be saddled with this debt. Hence, Mr. Speaker, what range of debt has the Finance Minister requested that Northerners will now carry without a MLA discussion? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'm going to say it again. At this point, the conversation has only just begun. So we've put Ottawa on notice that we're going to be coming to them in order to make this request, that there's more information coming. Our offices here in the Department of Finance and Fiscal Policy are looking at what kind of options we are going to be looking at, what kinds of needs we might have, what is on the capital plan for the next several years, what is in in the operational plan for the next several years. Mr. Speaker, if the Member doesn't believe me when I answered that the second time and doesn't believe me when I'm answering it now, I'm happy to share the letter with him.
Colleagues, please and thank you, address it to the chair.
Final supplementary. Member from Yellowknife Centre.
Thank you. That was a hint of Mr. Whitford style of managing the House, Mr. Speaker. Good for you. Mr. Speaker, what if Ottawa says no; what is plan B? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Well, Mr. Speaker, we have certainly made efforts with fiscal responsibility here to try to make changes within our main estimates. Obviously, the main estimates come to the floor of this House, and we see how the changes to the main estimates go in the last government, and we were -- or when we last -- Assembly -- or last session, we were certainly asked to roll back some of the changes that we were proposing at that time. But it's a conversation for this House generally when the main estimates come forward, what else we can do to adjust them if that's the situation we find ourselves in. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister of Finance. Oral questions. Member from Range Lake.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'd like to get to the bottom of these cost overruns that I brought up in my Member's statement. Can the Minister of Infrastructure speak to what appears to be a systemic problem with how we're budgeting projects? Let's start there. Thank you.
Thank you, Member from Range Lake. Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, there was a number of challenges that arose in 2019 or post 2019 where budgets and projects that were in the past Assembly -- actually two Assemblies ago now, then run up against COVID. There was a number of delays and as really I think everyone out there, whether it's government procurement or private procurement, saw increases in the huge numbers in terms of what kinds of impacts fuel had, inflation had, interest rates had, labour market challenges had, and the government is no stranger to that. So what we saw across the private sphere certainly impacted us as well and the projects that we had, again, 18th Assembly moved forward under delay and wound up with significant overages. So that has been a systemic problem but it's a systemic problem that didn't just affect our government. It's affected governments everywhere in Canada. It's affected private residents. It's affected private businesses. And we're certainly no stranger to it.
What we've done, Mr. Speaker, to support some change, we've already introduced an increase in planning and an increased focus in planning. We've brought back ADMs, we brought back peer review groups to actually make sure that when we go forward with a budget now that we know that that budget's more accurate. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister of Infrastructure, not Minister of Finance. Sorry about that. Oral questions. Member from Range Lake.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, the two portfolios are closely intertwined so I understand the confusion there. Because when Infrastructure can't manage its projects or can't predict these projects, it impacts the finance side. Our entire operational surplus wiped out because of cost overruns largely driven by capital costs, especially around NTPC, which is this Minister's -- within this Minister's remit as well. So why does NTPC continue to fail to bring its costs under control, continue to post these large cost overruns that are driving us into short-term debt? Thank you.
Sorry, colleagues. That kind of infrastructure/power corp, can you rephrase the question to be Infrastructure.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Minister of Infrastructure perhaps can speak to -- let's -- or sorry, you've given me a pickle. But structural -- so the structural debt of the power corporation, I suppose, whichever Minister wants to answer that question, I'll leave it in your hands.
Okay, colleagues, I should have said this at the very beginning of my oral questions. We need to focus on the Minister and the set of questions. We can't be moving from department to departments. Even though the Minister is Finance and Infrastructure and the power corp, we need to focus on the set of questions which was Infrastructure. I'm going to allow the Minister to answer this, but this will be the last time I will allow it. Thank you. Minister of power corp.
Slash Finance. It is a pickle, Mr. Speaker, thank you. So first of all, Mr. Speaker, the challenges that are being faced in the Northwest Territories Power Corporation that are certainly impacting the Department of Finance are not exclusively related to cost overages relating to different projects. There's a significant amount of impact from low water which is a situation entirely outside of my control or really that of anyone else in this House. We have been in a situation where the Snare plant has been burning a significant amount of diesel and in a situation where during -- because of the overhaul, the amount of diesel being burned down in the south is being burned at a rate that is much higher with the cost volatility of diesel since COVID. I don't have the numbers in front of me right now but it's a significant amount that is entirely related to that effect right there. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
