Debates of October 29, 2024 (day 34)

Okay, thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I asked the vice-president of finance and infrastructure, and he confirmed the funds to retrofit these units for the 2025-2026 fiscal year. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Member from Monfwi.

Yes, within this fiscal year or any other fiscal year, because there was a plan done for 10-year housing plan from 2012 to 2022 of how many houses they were going to retrofit. So that one is over and done with. So I'm just wondering, does the department actually have any funds to do major retrofit when they are -- you know, because the housing is saying they don't have any money to fix up some of these units and other organizations have fixed up a unit because they didn't have any. The Indigenous government fix up some of the units in my riding because housing do not have any -- they don't have the funds to fix up those units and asking people to move out when some of them are in good condition. Now they're sitting empty. And I would like to see some of the people that are on the waitlist to move into those units right now at the moment before freeze up, so it doesn't damage further, and then that's what -- that's how a lot of these units are boarded up, thinking they're going to do something, they're going to fix it up. To date, there's a lot of them. There's about almost ten units that are boarded up in Behchoko that belongs to the housing. So I just wanted to know, I just -- I'm just asking if there's actually any funds allocated and when are some of these constructions going to start. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister.

Yes, Mr. Chair, there is funds. It's outlined in the capital plan. There's two houses currently being retrofitted and three planned for next fiscal year. So just to confirm, three for the 2025-2026 fiscal year. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Member from Monfwi.

Well, two houses -- two houses are being retrofitted. Is it currently being retrofitted? Because I know one house was already retrofitted and that was not done by the housing; it was done by the Indigenous government that retrofitted that house because they really needed a client to move in there that was a forest fire victim. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister, please.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Housing NWT works with the Tlicho government for housing retrofits and construction in the Tlicho region. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Member from Monfwi.

Okay, I'm not sure if there was an agreement made between housing and -- so I just wanted to know if Housing NWT are going to refund the Indigenous government for retrofitting one of their units? Are they going to refund, pay back, because that is our Indigenous government money. That is our future generation's. So I just wanted to know if the Housing NWT will be refunding the Indigenous government for retrofitting one of their units. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. If there was a contract with Housing NWT to retrofit the unit, Housing NWT will pay the contract. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Member for Monfwi.

Well, that's good to know because she said it, so it's for the record. So I hope there is, you know -- I'm sure there is a contract, there is something in place somewhere. So I'm glad that, you know, she mentioned it.

So, yeah, no, I mean, Whati, you know, they're in housing crisis as well, and I don't see them on the list here. Gameti, and I know Wekweeti only have a few -- few units that belongs to the public housing units, so why they are not on the budget this fiscal year for upcoming fiscal year? Thank you.

Thank you. I'll go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Again, I noted that Housing NWT only has so much funds, so we have to prioritize the retrofits across the Northwest Territories and this list is the priority list at this time. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. Next on my list is the Member from Mackenzie Delta.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. My question is you have a lot of major retrofits in a lot of the communities. How old are the majority of these units that are being renovated? Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'll go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I would have to get a breakdown or an excel spreadsheet to provide that information of how old the units are. But we have over 350 units that are 50 years plus, and we have about 1100 public housing units that are 30 years plus. So the majority of our units are 30 years and older. It just gives you some insight to the age of our housing stock. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'll go to the Member for Mackenzie Delta.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. In Fort McPherson, you have nine units. When we were in McPherson this spring, you took a tour of one of the units that are over 50 years old and there are more units in that category. Do you know if these are the similar ones that are being renovated in Fort McPherson? Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. MLA Nerysoo is describing the older three-bedroom units that came into housing in the early 1970s, and they provided a tour of one of their renovated housing units. I'm not sure myself if these nine units are the units that are in question, so I will ask vice-president Jim Martin to provide some insight to that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'll go to the vice-president of finance.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. The nine units planned for retrofit, they are on -- they do deal with older units. Housing NWT typically plans for retrofits at mid-life of units, of the units, so that would be at least a 25-year mark and more. So in this case here, you know, they're certainly 25 years and older. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'll go to the Member from Mackenzie Delta.

Yeah, just a final comment that these units that are around 50 years old that, you know, should be demolished or something. You know, they're just using a band-aid solution every few years to accommodate the community, and it's just not working. They need to find a better solution. It's just more of a comment. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to -- okay, I'm going to go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Housing NWT realizes that much of its stock is aging, aging stock. Again, the needs across the territory are great. There's been a number of reports of housing needs across the Northwest Territories. And hopefully with the territorial housing needs assessment that's going to be completed over the next six months will provide better data both for Housing NWT and this government. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. Next on my list is is the Member from the Sahtu.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I see Deline's on the list of repairs there with six units. I'm glad to see that. We've, on our recent trips, heard a number of concerns on the older stock having mold and mildew created as a result of these units. And I'm also glad to see that your tangible capital assets are equal, and it's -- the financing of these expenditures include funding from the CMHC and other various sources. That tells me that you're exhausting other people's money, which is good. How much of that -- just a real general question, how much of that is coming from the federal government? Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. For the 2025-2026 Capital Plan, Housing NWT is funding our projects internally. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Member from the Sahtu.

So Mr. Chair, maybe the Minister could explain what that statement is on page 72 about funding from CMHC? Thank you.

Thank you. I'm going to go to the Minister.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. CMHC and CIRNAC, we had a bilateral agreement signed with CIRNAC in 2020, and those agreements provide us operations and maintenance dollars to maintain the public housing units across the Northwest Territories. It's approximately $19 million combined, $18 million combined, something in that range. It's declining year to year. We have the bilateral agreement that will decline -- or will end in 2028, and the CMHC agreement will end in 2038. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. I'll go to the Member from the Sahtu.

I've got nothing further there, Mr. Chair. That answered my questions. Thank you.

Thank you. I'm going to continue on. I don't see any Members.

Seeing no further questions, I remind the committee that the estimates for Housing Northwest Territories are included in the capital estimate as information items only. The committee will not be voting on activity total.

Please return now to the Housing Northwest Territories summary found on page 72. Are there any further questions or comments from committee? I'm going to go to the Member from Inuvik Boot Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I move that this committee defer further consideration on the capital estimates for Housing Northwest Territories at this time. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you. The motion is in order. To the motion.

Question.

Question has been called. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried. Consideration of the Housing Northwest Territories, 2025-2026 Capital Estimates is deferred.

---Carried

Thank you, committee. And thank you, Minister. Sergeant-at-arms, please escort the witnesses from the chambers. Thank you. I'll go to the Member from Inuvik Boot Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I move that the chair rise and report progress.

There is a motion to report progress. The motion is in order and non-debatable. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried.

---Carried