Debates of November 3, 2009 (day 13)

Date
November
3
2009
Session
16th Assembly, 4th Session
Day
13
Speaker
Members Present
Mr. Beaulieu, Ms. Bisaro, Mr. Bromley, Hon. Paul Delorey, Mrs. Groenewegen, Mr. Hawkins, Mr. Jacobson, Mr. Krutko, Hon. Jackson Lafferty, Hon. Sandy Lee, Hon. Bob McLeod, Hon. Michael McLeod, Hon. Robert McLeod, Mr. Menicoche, Hon. Michael Miltenberger, Mr. Ramsay, Hon. Floyd Roland, Mr. Yakeleya
Topics
Statements

QUESTION 152-16(4): OUTFITTERS’ LICENCES HELD IN SETTLED LAND CLAIM AREAS

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In regard to the Arctic Red River Outfitters and, more importantly, the Mackenzie River Outfitters who through the land claims process there were lands negotiated in those areas, there were agreements signed in regard to access agreements with the outfitters who were present at the time of the claims being settled. There were agreements made and also in the land claim agreements, in the Gwich’in agreement in regard to 12.7.4 which talks about commercial natural activities and commercial guiding outfitting activities respecting hunting and sport fishing which gives the Gwich’in exclusive rights to get into that business, but also to be able to obtain those licences once they, basically, come up for sale. Yet, Mr. Speaker, this process has happened three times in the Gwich’in settlement region and every time the economics were just not there in regard to the price that was being requested. But yet, Mr. Speaker, in the land claim agreements it also talks about the right for employment and opportunities with those outfitter businesses, and yet very few aboriginal people and Gwich’in individuals have been hired by the Arctic Red Outfitters to work in this field and also take advantage of those opportunities.

So, Mr. Speaker, in regard to the land claim obligations, the access and benefit agreements that give them access to the Gwich’in lands in their area of operations, with these licences changing it does not transfer those access agreements to those licensed holders. In regard to the existing Wildlife Act and the land claim agreements, there’s conflict in responsibilities in which you have an outdated Wildlife Act, you have a modern treaty. So I’d like to ask the Minister, what is this government doing to ensure that those legislated, protected rights and the land claim agreements are upheld regardless if we have a new Wildlife Act or not, and what is this government doing to ensure that those rights are being implemented? Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Krutko. The honourable Minister of Environment and Natural Resources, Mr. Miltenberger.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In regard to this particular issue referred to by the Member, due process was followed and the Gwich’in exercised their rights and declined to exercise their right of first refusal. But it has pointed out some other issues and, as the Member indicated, we have an outdated piece of legislation -- the Wildlife Act -- that needs to be remedied, which we are doing, and we intend to have a new Wildlife Act before this House, hopefully passed in the life of this Assembly.

We also recognize the circumstance between the Gwich’in and the Sahtu. There’s an overlap issue in that you can only have right of first refusal, by definition, once, and it’s pointed to an area that I’ve committed to the Member for the Sahtu that we are going to sort out over the coming months of fall and winter and hopefully have it resolved by spring. Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, again, these land claim agreements are constitutionally protected, they clearly describe what rights the First Nations groups have. Again, as part of those negotiations there were access and benefit agreements negotiated with the operators at the time to have certain rights to access, cross-use and also that there were also obligations from the outfitters to the land claim groups that they would provide certain opportunities to the land claim organizations. So where does this government stand on those access and benefit agreements that were negotiated with the outfitters and if the outfitter changes hands they have an obligation to negotiate a new access and benefit agreement?

It’s our intention as a government to honour all our obligations. Thank you.

Mr. Speaker, again, I think that the information that’s now coming to the surface in regard to the sale of the Arctic Red River licence to a new operator, which we find out that the majority of the directors of that business are Americans and live in Utah, and they are seen as the proponent of the purchasers of this licence because they have deep pockets. So I’d just like to ask the Minister, will you look at the whole area of eligibility and ensure that these licences are held either by Canadians or people in the Northwest Territories or First Nations to ensure that whenever you issue a licence that you scrutinize exactly who the directors are and ensure that those people are either Canadian citizens or look at exactly how these licences are being purchased and who is purchasing these licences during the review period? Thank you.

As I indicated, we are intent upon honouring all our obligations, recognizing that there are other considerations when it comes to who can own licences, the need to recognize the trade between different jurisdictions and such. But I take the Member’s point and we are working it. On this particular issue there have been a number of things that have been brought to light that we’ve committed to clearing up in the coming months. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. Your final supplementary, Mr. Krutko.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to ask the Minister, in light of his directing to change the Wildlife Act, can some of these changes be done to date in regard to changing the regulations that a lot of these obligations fall under? They don’t follow under the Wildlife Act, they follow in regard to the obligations under the outfitter licensing act. So I’d like to ask the Minister, can he consider looking at the obligations under the existing legislation and change those without having to have a thorough change of the Wildlife Act or do a combination of both? Thank you.

The process we’ve embarked on when this issue came to light is to consult with, of course, other departments, the aboriginal governments, the stakeholders, the management boards, to come up, over the coming months, with, hopefully, some resolution, advice and recommendations of how to remedy this issue in its entirety. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Mr. Miltenberger. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.