Debates of February 29, 2024 (day 13)

Date
February
29
2024
Session
20th Assembly, 1st Session
Day
13
Speaker
Members Present
Hon. Caitlin Cleveland, Mr. Edjericon, Mr. Hawkins, Hon. Lucy Kuptana, Hon. Jay MacDonald, Hon. Vince McKay, Mr. McNeely, Ms. Morgan, Mr. Morse, Mr. Nerysoo, Ms. Reid, Mr. Rodgers, Hon. Lesa Semmler, Hon. R.J. Simpson, Mr. Testart, Mr. Thompson, Mrs. Weyallon Armstrong, Hon. Caroline Wawzonek, Mrs. Yakeleya
Topics
Statements

Motion to Amend Motion 23-20(1): Call to Uphold Human Rights in Gaza, Carried

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I MOVE, seconded by the Member for Mackenzie Delta to amend Motion 2320(1), Call to Uphold Human Rights in Gaza, by inserting the words, and I quote, "in an accountable method that demonstrates transparency which ensures Canadian aid, given by the Canadian Government, goes directly to support the humanitarian need" to the third bullet point in the second clause, after the word "Gaza", as the bullet reads now: Advocates for and provide funds for unhindered access for humanitarian aid for all those in need in Gaza, in an accountable method that demonstrates transparency which ensures Canadian aid given by the Canadian government goes direct to support humanitarian need.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Members. To the motion as amended.

Speaker: SOME HON. MEMBERS

Question.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Question has been called. All those in favour? To the amendment. The motion as amended. Opposed? Abstentions? Motion has carried.

Carried

To the motion as amended. Member from Yellowknife Centre.

Motion to Amend Motion 23-20(1): Call to Uphold Human Rights in Gaza, Carried

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I MOVE, second by the honourable Member for Mackenzie Delta, to amend Motion 2320(1), Call to Uphold Human Rights in Gaza, by inserting the following clause after the second whereas clause:

AND WHEREAS this Assembly recognizes through the Government of Canada's designation that Canada has listed Hamas as a terrorist entity under the Criminal Code since November 2022.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

To the question. Member from Great Slave.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to say that I appreciate my colleagues having feedback on this motion. Previously, it was nearly direct directly mirroring the language that you can find in the petition. As I've said earlier, I respect the Members for or sorry, as I've said earlier to my colleagues, I respect that Members taking a stand on this motion aligns with what they need to do personally. Several Members have made suggestions on changing the motion to being something that could also stand for and support and so several changes were made.

Mr. Speaker, to my mind this particular amendment veers from the scope of the original motion. I do not want to debate whether or not Hamas is a terrorist organization. They are. I do not want to debate the decades' old conflict between Palestinians and Israelis. I simply want for the people of Gaza to be safe and not starving, Mr. Speaker. I think this amendment muddies those waters, but I also recognize that the Member moving the amendment sees it differently.

I have spoken with the ceasefire group, and they wish to see an opportunity for this motion to pass. So I will support this amendment to support their wishes. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Member. Member from Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. So the Member's proposed amendment is a fact, so I won't vote against it. But I do want to mention something about language that I believe is important because it impacts Palestinians everywhere, including members of our own community.

What I want to point out is that I think it's troubling that even when people condemn violence on both sides and call for the release of hostages and condemn all attacks against civilian populations, that if you focus your concern on the civilian population of Gaza, it still could be assumed that you would be supporting terrorism or Hamas unless you state otherwise.

To step back for a second. So particularly since 911, many North Americans have expected people who were Muslim or Arab to begin any political statement by renouncing terrorism because if they don't, we might assume they would naturally support terrorism. So that pattern has been called out in the past as Islamophobic assuming Muslims would support terrorism unless they specifically state otherwise. So I just don't want us to get into a similar pattern where any Palestinian or any person who expresses sympathy with the Palestinian people might be assumed to support Hamas and to support terrorism unless they specifically state otherwise. All I'm saying is that instead of approaching people with suspicion based on who they are or which group of people they are advocating to protect and support, I hope that we would listen to the stories and experiences and concerns of our fellow community members with compassion and open minds and open hearts. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Member from Yellowknife North. To the motion as amended. Member from Yellowknife Centre the motion as amended. Yes.

You're doing perfect, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I'm just only rising to thank the mover and the seconder for their considerations, and I wish to acknowledge that, and I wish to publicly note that I shall follow through on my pledge to vote for the broader motion once this amendment passes. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Yellowknife Centre. To the motion as amended.

Speaker: SOME HON. MEMBERS

Question.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Question has been called. All those in favour? Opposed? Abstentions? Motion has passed as amended.

Carried

To the motion as amended. Member from Range Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, our world is increasingly becoming volatile as geopolitical tensions and nationalistic ambitions shatter the once stable international order that has prevailed since the end of the last world war. The wars in Ukraine and Gaza are evidence that those nations who love peace cannot be complacent in the face of these conflicts. They must act to preserve the fragile order that many have taken for granted for too long.

Mr. Speaker, we must act as well, for as leaders of this Assembly our citizens look to us to uphold peace and justice in our land. As far moved as the North can feel from wars raging across oceans on continents far away, we are all connected by a global community that watches in horror as humanitarian abuses and unrestricted violence are broadcast from our radios, screens, and social media accounts. We cannot and must not bury our head in the sand when so many people in our community are hurting.

Mr. Speaker, this motion concerns itself with the war in Gaza and the many welldocumented violations of international and humanitarian law that have occurred since this conflict began. I unequivocally condemn the attacks on Israel carried out by Hamas on October 7th that killed 1,200 Israelis, mostly civilians, and where terrorist militants seized around 250 hostages. It is believed still that over 134 hostages remain held, including two children. More than 30,000 Palestinians have been killed and more than 70,000 wounded since the war began five months ago according to officials from the Gaza health ministry. The UN says that 2.3 million Palestinians face starvations with 80 percent having displaced being displaced from their homes. Violence has surged across the region both in and out of the war zone. It is nothing short of a humanitarian catastrophe.

Mr. Speaker, this motion also speaks to South Africa's genocide case against Israel in the International Court of Justice. The court said, and I quote, Israel must take all possible measures to prevent acts as outlined in Article 2 of the 1948 genocide convention. This entails not killing Members of a particular group (in this case Palestinians), not causing physical or psychological harm to Members of that group, not inflicting living conditions which are calculated to bring about the end of the existence of people, and not carrying out actions designed to prevent births within that group of people, end quote.

While the International Court of Justice confirmed that it does not have jurisdiction to hear the case against Israel that is in contravention of the Genocide Convention, the court did issue Israel with six emergency orders effectively putting Israel on notice over the war and its brutal bombing campaign. The court's orders are:

Israel must ensure its military does not carry out any of the above actions;

Israel must prevent and punish the, quote, "direct and public incitement to commit genocide in relation to members of the Palestinian group in the Gaza Strip";

Israel must ensure the delivery of basic services and essential humanitarian aid to civilians in Gaza;

Israel must prevent the destruction of evidence of war crimes in Gaza and allow factfinding missions access;

Israel must submit a report on all steps it has taken to abide by the measures imposed by the court;

Within one month of the judgment, South Africa will have the chance to respond to this report.

Mr. Speaker, Canada has always respected international law. This ruling on the International Court of Justice is significant and a dire warning of the potential dangers ahead if these orders are not heeded.

Mr. Speaker, this motion also calls on the Prime Minister of Canada to act. This House should be already aware that the Prime Minister has not been silent on this matter of grave importance, publicly condemning the violence in Gaza and calling for an immediate and sustainable ceasefire. In his joint statement with the Prime Ministers of Australia and New Zealand on December 12th last year, the Prime Minister mourned every Israeli and Palestinian innocent life which has been lost in this conflict and said, quote,

We remain deeply concerned by the scale of the humanitarian crisis in Gaza and ongoing risks to all Palestinian civilians. Safe and unimpeded humanitarian access must be increased and sustained. We recommit ourselves to working with partners towards a just and enduring peace in the form of a two-state solution where Israelis and Palestinians can live securely within internationally recognized borders. We condemn rising antisemitism, Islamophobia, and antiArab sentiment in our countries and around the world and remain firmly committed to combatting prejudice, hatred, and violent extremism.

I commend the Prime Minister for his words then and his action now to comfort Jewish, Palestinian, and Arab Canadians, that Canada is a place for peace and tolerance between all peoples.

Mr. Speaker, the NWT is a diverse community, small and scattered across vast distances, but it is our compassion and empathy for one another that brings us together as one. My heart breaks for those members of our Jewish and Arab community who have been affected by this violence. I mourn the loss of all innocent life that has been lost in Gaza. And I join in all those calling for peace and an end to hatred, violence, and injustice in our world. Mr. Speaker, I will be supporting this motion. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Member from Range Lake. Member from Yellowknife Centre.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I want to acknowledge at the beginning this is a very difficult motion for some people out there. I feel very strongly in support of the current motion as now amended, and I too wish to lend my supports and the voice my voice to hopefully carry to a new phase.

Mr. Speaker, I deeply believe that one day, I wish it would be sooner than later, that we had a fully safe Palestine recognized by the world all around so the people can deserve and who have well long waited and earned their right to live happy, safe, and free.

Mr. Speaker, the conflict itself, I'm no expert in that particular thing but I can tell you this, it's got to be terrible. Whether it be recent attacks are not for me to explain but I can tell you as somebody who has watched and followed a little bit, it's difficult to imagine people living through that experience and calling this, you know, balanced, measured, and whatnot. It's just horrific after horrific that people are suffering under these types of things. I wish and I suspect my you know, people on all sides, really if you get to the core of it, you know, you ask important questions such as, you know, what is our hope? Well, we hope all people can prosper under their dreams. They're hoping their families can have prosperous futures. You want people to be able to pursue their religion and individual beliefs in a way that they can be healthy and happy. And, you know, under the current circumstances, I just can't imagine how difficult it is to live there and hence I do feel deeply sorry for the folks there, the many families. And I acknowledge the people in the gallery today. Some are friends up there. Some I know, and some I don't know, but I appreciate the enthusiasm and the stance that everyone up in the gallery has taken to ensure that this message can come through. I mean, ultimately people deserve a life, you know, and a sense of living in some type of consistent harmony, and certainly this situation is not speaking to that. I join my Member in Range Lake in the context of condemning all of these attacks and all of this violence and this you know, again whether it's antiPalestinian, whether it's antiIsraeli, whether it's antiMuslim, this is all terrible, terrible stuff, Mr. Speaker.

I won't speak much further on this particular thing, but what I will reemphasize is I too dream of a day that, you know, we look behind ourselves and ask us what took so long, what were the hurdles to finally settle a twostate solution where we can talk about joint futures and joint prosperities in the region that everyone can work somewhat in cohesive manner and share in the excitement and prosperity among all nations.

So, Mr. Speaker, again, I'll be voting in favour of the amended motion, and I thank the mover and seconder for their assistance in allowing me to carry some of my concerns for it. Thank you very much.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Member from Yellowknife Centre. To the motion amended. Member from Yellowknife North.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to focus today on the impacts of the violence in Israel and Palestine on the people of this territory. I know it feels far away to some of us and irrelevant to be discussing in this House to some of us. Certainly it's hard to see how our statements or our motions could affect anything that goes in the region. But it does affect people in this territory. We have immigrants who have made their home here in the NWT from many parts of the world, including Israel, Palestine, and surrounding countries. We have children born here and being raised here whose identity is also Palestinian or Israeli or Jewish or Lebanese or Syrian, and they want to be proud of their nationalities and cultures, and they want their family members over in the Middle East to be safe and their human rights to be recognized and protected.

Every day in the news, we see horrific violence. We see children being killed, civilians attacked, schools and hospitals being bombed, and our fellow community members with family and ties to the region may wonder why no one seems to be standing up for those peoples' human rights. Then they may wonder if anyone would stand up for their human rights since they share an identity with those people over there who are being dehumanized and killed.

And yet we in Canada are often so afraid to talk about this conflict and this region in particular. It is a minefield. We fear being accused of saying the wrong thing. There's a constant demand for balance that if we call for one side to do something, we must call for the other side to do the exact same thing; that if we condemn one side for something, we must condemn the other side for the exact same thing regardless of whether they're actually doing the same thing and regardless of the fact that the two sides are anything but balanced. Only one side, Israel, is an internationally recognized state with recognized citizens and a legitimised military force. Palestine has none of those things.

Anything that strays from this rigid idea of balance is seen as taking a side. Any criticism of Israel might spark accusations of antisemitism. Lately, even calls for a ceasefire might be seen as questioning Israel's right to exist. We are being told by the extremists and the hardliners on each side that if you defend one group's right to exist, that means wiping the other group the other group off the map. And that is a truly terrifying situation. So there's tremendous pressure for us in Canada to say nothing at all, to try to ignore the conflict, to throw up our hands and say it's way too complicated, it's too far away, the conflict has been going on for millennia, nothing can be done, nothing can even be said about it. But when we are silent, the extremists on both sides win. When we are silent, the children in our community who see themselves in the faces of those civilians and children being killed on the news, it leaves these children feeling invisible, vulnerable, worthless, and alone. When we are silent, it leaves us feeling helpless and angry and more likely to lash out and blame and scapegoat and eventually that's how we breed more extremism, both around the world and in our own communities, by letting frustration fester in silence. And yet hundreds and hundreds of people here in the NWT over the past several months have had the courage to speak up, to raise their voices in public demonstrations calling for a ceasefire, to show real support and solidarity for those amongst us who have felt invisible and vulnerable.

We can counter the extremists by speaking the language of human rights, by reminding everyone of the importance of international humanitarian laws, by reminding everyone about our obligations under the Genocide Convention as Canadians. We have a groundswell of NWT residents asking us as leaders to raise our voices too in support of human rights and international humanitarian law. It may just be words, but the simple act of speaking up when there is so much pressure to be silent can be a profound act of solidarity with our neighbours, our community members, even if the warmongering leaders never hear us. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Member from Yellowknife North. To the motion as amended. Member from Inuvik Boot Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thank you, colleagues. Thank you to the mover and seconder. Mr. Speaker, I've struggled with this motion. I've had some long conversations with my colleagues. I was at one point supportive, at point not supportive, at one point thinking I would abstain to the motion, Mr. Speaker. And, you know, and I'll kind of explain why and where I am now on this motion, Mr. Speaker.

As leaders, as Members of the Legislative Assembly, and as representatives of the people in our communities, it is incumbent upon us, Mr. Speaker, to ensure the actions that we take are principled and bring about resolution of conflict. As MLAs, we are responsible for the wellbeing of our residents, including the families and children who call the NWT home. The conflict in Gaza has brought horrors upon families, children, and countless innocent people. This violence cannot continue. In Canada, we have our own histories of violence and oppression. We have committed to reconciliation as a government, and it is in that spirit I state firmly that violence, especially violence against children and families, is entirely unacceptable, Mr. Speaker.

The longstanding nature of the Gaza conflict is, in part, the consequence of polarized and inflamed viewpoints on all sides. As leaders, we must seek to reduce polarization. We must take actions that bring people together rather than divide them further. Reconciliation, Mr. Speaker, is not just a word. Mr. Speaker, I believe the language in this motion, in my mind, does not accomplish this purpose. The language tries to simplify an incredibly complicated global reality. The language as crafted cannot be seen as a real way to bring about peace but may instead further inflame violence. Rather than reduce polarization, this motion may exacerbate it.

I understand that we all have different experiences and different views, and I respect the MLAs in this Legislative Assembly. Having said that, Mr. Speaker, I cannot vote against a motion of peace. I also choose, Mr. Speaker, not to abstain even though I do feel that the motion, the way it's worded, can in some ways be counterproductive to what we're trying to accomplish here, I will support the mover and the seconder of this motion. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Member from Inuvik Boot Lake. To the motion as amended. Member from Hay River North.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this has been quite an emotional motion right from the time conversations about it started, the conversations around the petition. We have residents in our territory who are directly impacted by the ongoing conflict. And, frankly, I can't comprehend what they must be going through and hopefully no one in this room ever has to will ever know what that is like. From everything I've seen, it looks like people are in a living hell right now. And so I appreciate that the Members have brought this forward to bring this conversation to the forefront. It is through the people speaking up that change is made in the world, and I think that Members who brought this forward, and others around Canada, have made change.

The motion calls on me as Premier to write a letter to the Prime Minister asking calling upon the Canadian government to call for an immediate ceasefire. That has happened. The Government of Canada in December of last year voted for a UN resolution that called for an immediate ceasefire. Two weeks ago, the Prime Minister again issued a release calling for an immediate ceasefire.

The motion calls upon me to write a letter calling upon the Canadian government to advocate for the immediate release of all hostages. And that has been the position of the Government of Canada since October as well.

The motion calls upon the Canadian government to advocate for and provide funds for unhindered access for humanitarian aid for all of those in need in Gaza. Canadian continues to do that. It continues to advocate for sustained and unimpeded access of essential relief to Palestinian civilians in Gaza and the West Bank. And just yesterday, the government announced that they are working to airdrop humanitarian aid in Gaza as soon as possible so those efforts are underway as well.

All of that said, Mr. Speaker, I'm sure that gives little comfort to those who are still reeling from what is going on, who still can't contact their family, and who are hurting, who go to bed every night thinking about their families. And so I do want them to know that I'm thinking about them. All of us here in this room have thought about this, have put our minds to it. I don't think anyone is anyone wants people to feel like that. We don't want our friends and neighbours to feel like that. And so we all need to be supportive, all the people in Northwest Territories need to show that support, need to show that we actually care about what people are going through.

That being said, Mr. Speaker, this is a motion that calls on the government to do something, to provide a response within 120 days, and it is the process here in this House that when there is that request that the government takes its time, crafts a motion, puts thought into it, puts research into it, and then provides that response. And so we will be responding within 120 days, and we will be abstaining on this motion so that we can craft that response.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

From Hay River North. To the motion as amended.

Speaker: SOME HON. MEMBERS

Question.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Question has been called. Does the mover wish to close debate? Member from Great Slave.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, this motion is, as folks before me have said, highly emotional, and I also believe it's a highly personal choice, and I respect every single Member in this House to take what decision they take to heart and I respect whatever choice that may be and what that looks like for them. I'm here in my role as a Member to represent my riding and also my own conscience.

I want to speak a little bit about why this motion is important to me and why I feel it's the right thing to do.

When I first met with a Palestinian member of our community in Yellowknife late last year, he asked me why I was willing to take action up to and including those that I have taken today. I told him, first, because I'm a human being. What I think I was trying to say to him was that I can't watch innocent people be harmed and not try to do something even if it's just donations to humanitarian aid or signing petitions, like folks in the gallery have done, or whatever I think may be in small some small part helpful. That is who I am. Now that I am an elected official, I will continue to be the person I have always been, which is someone who wants to help when people are in pain, struggling, or suffering.

I also told him that I grew up with key people in any life teaching me of the Jewish faith. I considered my godmother my auntie growing up, and she was someone I looked to for moral and ethical guidance. I say looked to because she passed in 2002, and may her memory be a blessing.

Like all major world religions, Judaism is rooted in the love for your neighbour, as yourself. Later in life, I was drawn to practicing Zen Buddhism. Without going into a lot of detail, it has informed my way of looking at the world insofar as I believe all human beings on this planet are deeply connected and perhaps in ways we cannot fully verbalize or understand. And so I'm passionate about the interconnectedness of our world, our common threads of humanity. So when I see what is happening in Gaza, I am heartbroken on that level.

On a very personal note, I want to say publicly that by taking these actions I expected that I might be, and all likelihood will be, shunned by my late godmother's family. This also breaks my heart. But this motion and this issue is something I feel I must stand up for and do what is in my power to help and, too, much like the Members who have spoken before, you know, I think it is the best work we can do is to do work where we live, work, and play in the Northwest Territories, and that's why I'm in this House. But it's also why I'm standing up for my community members who are in pain every day not knowing if their friends and family are still alive and watching a genocide unfold before them on their televisions and cell phones. I must follow my conscience and stand for them.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. And, Mr. Speaker, I would like to request a recorded vote.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Thank you, Member from Great Slave. Question has been called and the Member has asked for a recorded vote. All those in favour, please stand.

Speaker: Ms. Joelene Saturnino

The Member from Great Slave. The Member from Mackenzie Delta. The Member for Yellowknife North. The Member for Sahtu. The Member for Yellowknife Centre. The Member for Range Lake. The Member for Inuvik Boot Lake. And the Member for Frame Lake.