Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In my Member’s statement, I quoted some pretty astronomical numbers in regard to the alcohol abuse-related deaths, injuries, accidents and suicides. On that pendulum swing right over the next, people who want to sober up and they use Nats’ejee K’eh, can the Minister inform me that at Nats’ejee K’eh, with a budget of $2 million and an occupancy rate of 46 percent, if Nats’ejee K’eh is working with the people of the Northwest Territories?
I also understand that the Minister is seeking information from the communities and I support the Minister on the community addiction forum as to get some home-grown solutions. Is Nats’ejee K’eh working for our government?
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We recognize that Nats’ejee K’eh is not operating at full capacity. There is no question about that. Also, the people do successfully complete Nats’ejee K’eh. We don’t have an instrument that’s going to determine whether or not the Nats’ejee K’eh graduates were fully successful in achieving their battle against addictions, because at which point do we measure success? Is it one year of sobriety? Five years? Or is it a lifetime of sobriety after that? We are trying to get a feel from the communities and the people that have gone through Nats’ejee K’eh, through the community counselling, and then making a determination whether or not that is successful. But we do know that it is operating well under capacity. Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, the Government of the Northwest Territories, through the Liquor Commission, made about $46 million last year, 2011-12. That’s the money they made. They contribute about 3 percent of that to promotion of healthy style living and responsible drinking. Nats’ejee K’eh runs on a $2 million budget. The capacity rate is about 45 percent. That runs roughly about $14,800 per client to take a 28-day treatment program.
Has the Minister given some stern direction to the Department of Health and Social Services, saying that Nats’ejee K’eh needs to change its program so that people in my region and other regions can come down there that would make it successful, and that would fill that centre and not be at 45 percent?
Mr. Speaker, as per our earlier discussions in the House, I have gone to see the board, Nats’ejee K’eh. I’ve met with the board at Nats’ejee K’eh. The board and the executive at Nats’ejee K’eh are sending a proposal into our department to look at different ways that they think they can deliver the addictions program at Nats’ejee K’eh to have greater success and also open up the options.
Currently, they have only men’s programs and women’s programs only. They don’t have youth treatment and so on. They were going to propose the various types of treatment, perhaps even family treatment, youth treatment, and male and female treatment, and come back to the department. I have not seen that proposal as of yet. However, they indicated to me, when I met with them, that they are going to send me that proposal. Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, it has been reported that 85 percent of reported crimes in the Northwest Territories are alcohol and drug related. Ninety percent of inmates of Northwest Territories correction facilities have addiction issues.
With the usage of Nats’ejee K’eh and looking at the programs, is the Minister looking at a culturally relevant program? I believe that these numbers have to reflect a lot of the smaller communities, and a lot of the inmates in our centres are Aboriginal people. Is the Minister seriously looking at a drug and alcohol treatment program, not a mental health and wellness program?
Mr. Speaker, that seemed to be the problem, that they had moved away from purely alcohol counselling to more of counsellors that have degrees in mental health and that they looked at a lot of this as mental health issues. It appears as though the communities that want to use Nats’ejee K’eh would like to see that become more of an alcohol counselling type of facility as opposed to a lot of the mental health counselling requirements that are now associated at Nats’ejee K’eh. That’s the exact review that we had asked the board to come back with, an alcohol type counselling versus something that had a lot of mental health type of counselling such as only counsellors with their degrees in mental health who we doing the counselling there. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Yakeleya.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In the Sahtu we have a high population of youth, I think about 79 percent, that are 15 years and over. Can the Minister tell me where the youth go for drug and alcohol treatment programs in the Northwest Territories?
We are looking to try to develop something at Nats’ejee K’eh. As I indicated, perhaps some treatment programs that would be built in in the summertime for youth.
Right now all of our youth that end up in treatment end up in treatment in southern placements. I think that the numbers of youth going to treatment, that type of treatment where they are placed in a southern treatment facility is very low. I think I at one time used the number five youth had gone to treatment over a two-year period from the Northwest Territories. So it’s difficult to build a program around that type of number, but we figure that if we can adapt something that’s in the North and targeted to youth from the North that there may be some uptake at facilities such as Nats’ejee K’eh. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In continuing with my theme with the Beaufort-Delta Regional Leadership Council, upon returning back to Yellowknife I had some information in my mailbox regarding nursing services in a couple of the smaller communities in the Beaufort-Delta region. On two separate occasions over the Christmas holidays, there were two communities that only had essential services of nurses, and my questions are for the Minister of Health and Social Services.
My first question is: Knowing that you’re going to be low on nursing or have staff shortages for that time in those communities, was there a plan put in place to restaff those positions during that time, and even before then, how long did the Minister and his department know that they were going to need staffing in these communities? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Moses. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We’ve always known that there is a staff shortage of nurses right across the Territories. We also know that we have a separate governance system in every health and social services authority across the territory. We can’t share resources as though we have one single governing system with doctors or nurses the same. So the health authorities with their own governance system get the nurses in, they hire the nurses or they hire locums to fill in these positions. So in reality, the department is not specifically aware where and when the nurses are not going to be, although they advise us that these places would have only essential services for certain periods.
As the Member indicated, in one place for 11 days they only had essential services. So we are aware all the time that there is a shortage of nurses, but where the authorities will deploy these nurses, we are not completely aware of that. Thank you.
I have a concern, because it’s during a high time where there are a lot of incident rates, such as people going through a hard time during Christmas, depression and those types of areas where there’s a possibility of something happening.
The Minister has also said that authorities don’t share their staff, but he’s always preached about this Yellowknife doctors pool going out to the communities. That’s where I think that when the department finds out that there’s going to be a staff shortage in the community, that they make a plan and create a plan so that people in these small communities have those services should they need them, especially the emergency services.
My next question for the Minister is: What was the action plan should there have been an emergency for these two communities? Thank you.
Thank you. Other than providing information to all of the community groups in the various communities where the health centres would close, with the exception of essential services, I don’t know if the Beaufort-Delta Health and Social Services Authority actually had an action plan in place that would say that this is what we were going to do in case of emergency. I suppose that they would treat it like any other medical emergency. If there was a medical emergency at any time while there was staff at the health centre or not, they would be treated in the same type of urgency. Thank you.
Thank you. I understand that the Minister mentions that he doesn’t know if the Beaufort-Delta Health and Social Services Authority had an action plan in place, but as the Minister responsible for Health and Social Services and his department, I believe that he should have an action plan in place should any other small community in the Northwest Territories go through a nursing shortage or lose staff for a period of time, especially during a critical time of year, which is around Christmastime.
My next question for the Minister – hopefully he has these stats on hand. Was there any emergency calls in these two communities during this time and can he provide whether or not there were any emergency calls in these communities? Thank you.
Thank you. I do not have that information. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Just following up, as a responsibility to the Department of Health and Social Services working out of the department, I feel that it’s their responsibility to help create these kinds of action plans and move nurses around, should a community need a nurse or need some type of services. Would the Minister commit to looking at that as an action plan for the future so we don’t have to bring these questions up in the House again? Thank you.
Thank you. The department and I are certainly aware that these are issues. Again, the current governance system allows each of the health authorities to employ nurses right across their own authorities. So each of the authorities would have a geographical area and they would employ the nurses to the locations. They’re independent from other authorities, and also independent from Stanton Hospital and independent from the Department of Health and Social Services. That is an issue; we see that as an issue. So recognizing that we’re doing something about the governance issue starting with the doctors, and also recognize that that’s a major issue with nurses as well. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are addressed to the Minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment as the Minister responsible for our BIP policy, Business Incentive Policy.
I have been advised by a constituent about a difficulty encountered with them and the BIP policy. It had to do with a request for proposal, an RFP, that was let by the government – Yellowknife Health and Social Services Authority actually – and it’s for an RFP which has previously often been handled by an NGO. But NGOs, according to the BIP policy, are not eligible to register as a business, so I’d like to ask the Minister why not. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. The Minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment, Mr. Ramsay.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The Member brings up kind of a grey area here. An NGO could certainly apply for BIP status if it has a business arm. The reason an NGO itself cannot become BIP registered is… There are a number of reasons. First, they don’t pay taxes, or they don’t pay income tax. They usually receive significant government funding through other contribution programs. They often receive other government-based incentives ranging from free rent on a building or pay zero through tax assessments and often receive cash donations sometimes significant in nature. Also, they often receive non-cash-based donations. They have to be treated much differently than a business would be.
Thank you to the Minister for that very fulsome answer. I appreciate that NGOs are not like a business. However, NGOs provide a service which very often is an extension of our government health services or our social services. An NGO is providing a service for the government. It’s unlikely that most NGOs would have a business arm. I will just leave it at that.
I’d like to know from the Minister, in terms of an NGO providing a service versus a private business providing a service, does he consider that in comparing an NGO application for an RFP and the business application for an RFP that they are applying on a level basis? Is it a level playing field?
I wouldn’t want to hazard a guess, not knowing the particulars in the situation the Member talks about, but if the Member would like to divulge – she doesn’t have to do it here today – the situation, if it is an NGO bidding against a registered BIP business here in the Northwest Territories then the NGO not getting BIP status, there’s a reason, and I mentioned the reason why, the NGO wouldn’t receive BIP status to compete with a registered BIP business here in the Northwest Territories. I’d like to, maybe, get the Member to provide us some further details and we can look into this situation.
Thanks to the Minister. I’m happy to provide that information to the Minister so we can discuss this a little more fully. I totally agree with the Minister that it’s a grey area and I think it’s one that we need to look into.
I want to ask the Minister, my understanding of the rationale for BIP is that it is to encourage local businesses to keep business locally, I guess. For instance, an NGO that has responded to an RFP and is running a service is employing people within the community, they are keeping dollars within the community, their employees are spending dollars in the community. I see the BIP as employing local people, enhancing local employment and enhancing northern employment. Does the Minister agree with that?
As I mentioned earlier, NGOs could certainly have a commercial aspect, a commercial arm to their operation, and that is a component of their operation that could become BIP registered. Then those benefits the Member talks about are apparent.
I think, again, it is a grey area. It’s the first that I’ve heard of this situation coming up, and it’s certainly something I look forward to discussing with the Member and the Regular Members opposite, to try and find a way forward with it so that everybody knows what the rules of engagement are when it comes to tenders and NGOs and BIP registered businesses and how they would compete against one another.
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Final supplementary, Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thanks to the Minister. I will take him up on his commitment.
I would like to ask him at this point – there is at least one RFP out there that I’m aware of that an NGO is applying – if he would be able to, in looking into this situation which he said he will do, will he agree to hold off the awarding of any tenders for any RFPs that are out there where we have NGOs competing against a business until we clarify this area?
Once the Member brings forward the details of the situation, I would certainly be more than happy to talk to whichever department the award would be awarded through and have a discussion about next steps.
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’m going to use this opportunity to follow up on my Member’s statement, which was in whole about the Inuvik-Tuk highway and some of the costs and components thereof. I guess my first question is: When will a plain-language document be available for the public to see that actually specifies and drills down what the project is and what the actual costing estimates are? That way we will have something to debate and discuss publicly before an actual vote happens in the House.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The honourable Minister of Transportation, Mr. David Ramsay.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. For the public’s consumption, there’s the EIRB report that was out on the 25th of January. We’re waiting for funding approvals and project approvals through the federal government. We look forward to getting those in due course. There’s a process that has to be followed and we intend to follow the process.
I think that report hedged around a $300 million figure. Is that the actual cost that we will be working from on a construction basis, and is that the figure that the public can be referring to the Inuvik-Tuk highway as the actual cost?
We haven’t got a formal funding agreement with the federal government in place yet. At the earliest opportunity – I just signed a letter late last week – we’re going to be in front of the Member’s Standing Committee on Economic Development and Infrastructure as soon as possible to give his committee a full briefing on the project and next steps.
One of the critical components that has been referred to as part of the cost of this potential highway – and, of course, the final decision has yet to be made – is the royalty required by the regional government. Is an actual number pegged to what the royalty is, and why is the Government of the Northwest Territories paying for a royalty when we’ve made a concession on the road as being transferred for land and other options and we’re actually paying for the gravel? Will there be a royalty attached to the final figure of this highway and how much, if so?
Through the Inuvialuit settlement, the land claim agreement that the Inuvialuit have, they have provisions for granular royalties paid to the Inuvialuit. That is something that is in the land claim. That is something that we continue to look at negotiating, both the royalty rate and the land tenure for the highway itself. Those discussions continue to be ongoing.
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Final supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. From what I’ve been hearing on the ground, is an actual royalty rate has been negotiated and signed off between the territorial government and the IRC. I have yet to hear what that final number is and I think the public deserves to know. Also, why isn’t the government negotiating a zero royalty considering two things: first of all, this road is, in essence, at the request of people in that region, which I think is a reasonable request per se, but by the same token will this philosophy apply to every single new highway established here? Are we setting a dangerous precedent when we consider the Mackenzie Valley Highway, the Tlicho winter road alignment and so on?
I just want to let the Member know, and other Members know, that we haven’t signed off on the royalty rate, we haven’t signed off on land tenure. Those are discussions that continue to be ongoing with the Inuvialuit, and we hope to conclude those discussions and negotiations with them very soon.
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. The honourable Member for Hay River South, Mrs. Groenewegen.
