Madam Chair, I’m done.
Thank you. Mr. Bromley.
Madam Chair, I just want to follow up a little bit here. The Minister mentioned, I think yesterday, the $9 million being spent on the Territorial Power Subsidy Program, and in addition to that, the $34 million over four years. I think the first year was $17 million. I think the next year was $9 million, or something like that, anyway descending as electricity rates go up and the public begins to catch up with the rates, which I appreciate the gradual approach there.
Did the Minister work with his colleagues to capture the difference in annual expenditures? For example, $17 million and next year $9 million. That’s a difference of $8 million we are no longer putting in. Did the Minister attempt to capture that and direct that, with his colleagues, to energy expenditures to help us deal with this situation?
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Mr. Vician.
Madam Chair, I don’t have the details in terms of the process of that allocation over the four-year period to temper the impact of the rate change that was affected by the application to the Public Utilities Board. But fundamentally, the challenge, of course, was trying to minimize the impact across the Northwest Territories to electrical consumers as a result of the driver with regard to covering the costs of the higher fuel costs and other additional costs that were facing the Power Corporation over the five-year period that they had to look at the rate increase. Overall, that was considered carefully in terms of how to minimize that impact, and it was considered an important balance in terms of making that investment as it was shown.
I hope that answers the question, but it is difficult to have any further numbers at this time. Thank you.
Madam Chair, it doesn’t answer the question but, yes. I think we continue to see our energy dollars decrease when the need is, in fact, increasing and there is an opportunity to redirect the funds that we’re no longer using to subsidize energy to put into energy initiatives. I’m very disappointed if the Minister did not try to capture some of those dollars here.
I think the point is, hydro we know is expensive. It has serious frontend costs, but it’s also self-financing. It’s typically very long lived, 50 to 70 years. We have an opportunity, if we were to capture these dollars. The difference between $17 million and $9 million or whatever, that is significant when it comes to a modest-sized hydro operation given that we don’t need to pay it all up front. These are opportunities that continue to slide by as we spend, I would say, literally millions of dollars studying the situation rather than focusing on one and getting it done, one that is an appropriate size for our needs and communities.
On that, I think it’s not just our communities we should be looking at. Our communities are very important and it helps with the cost of living, but another perspective is that our industry requires energy and they are typically associated with one community or another, often thermal communities. There is another opportunity to help deal with some of the frontend costs. Again, I just don’t see that happening. I will leave that as a comment.
I just wanted to register those comments and welcome any response from the Minister. Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Ramsay.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate the Minister’s comments, and as industry and energy go together with communities, that is something – and I mentioned it earlier in response to another Member – we have to always be looking for opportunities when there is resource development near a community that we can get long-term, lasting benefits for the community. You look around the Northwest Territories today, hydro is here because of the mining past and history of the territory with Taltson, Snare and Bluefish. So there’s been a history of that and if we are going to get to some long-lasting improvements, especially in the area of hydro development here in the territory, there has to be a benefit to both industry and, on the social side, to communities currently on diesel. Thank you.
My last point is we are slacking off on expenditures here. We need to continue to invest in this area. I think we need to add, I think the Minister needs to add to the budget here. What’s really needed is a fund to work with our businesses and industry in a way that can be significant in helping them play a role in renewable energy development. What would the Minister do if he had some additional half million or million dollars here that’s in line with that pursuit?
There are some great opportunities and the Member has a good suggestion. We currently don’t have a half a million extra dollars here, so it’s a bit hypothetical at this point, but certainly the money would be put to good use and we will be working with the Members, through committee, to find out where the best investment would be made with that money. Thank you.
I appreciate the Minister’s comments. I would hope, if and when we do have such money, that there will be a focus to getting something done on the ground rather than just planning. Again, I appreciate the Minister’s comments. That’s all I have at this stage. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Industry, Tourism and Investment, operations expenditure summary, energy, $1.679 million.
Agreed.
Agreed. Thank you. Moving on to page 12-22, energy, grants and contributions, contributions. Agreed? Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Madam Chair. The regional hydro and renewable energy solutions with respect to the Sahtu, I know there were some efforts going on there. Can we get an update on where the Sahtu is at with regard to the interest, particularly Deline? There have been some investments over the years. Just an update on that would be appreciated. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. That question falls under page 12-23. Can we finish and deal with 12-22? Energy, grants and contributions, contributions. Agreed?
Agreed.
Agreed. Moving on to page 12-23, energy, grants and contributions, continued, $1.1 million. Mr. Bromley.
Thanks. I think the Minister has my question, Madam Chair.
Thanks very much, Mr. Bromley. Mr. Vician.
Thank you, Madam Chair. The funding that was provided in previous years, ’12-13, towards renewable energy solutions, hydro solutions in communities, was directed at a number of key initiatives, particularly the Sahtu initiative which looked at potential hydrokinetic energy, electrical energy solutions from the Bear River particularly. We continue to work with the community on those options. Feasibility work was carried out last year looking at some alternative technologies and we look at some of the feasibility of the costs associated with that. These solutions have not panned out in a feasible manner. We can provide the reporting for committee’s consideration, but it’s a matter of scale and installation that challenges us. Of course, the local load and distribution of that load to make it effective. We continue to work closely with the Tlicho Government with regard to solutions in that region and, of course, as was indicated by the Member, in the area of Lutselk’e it continues to be on the radar and work continues and dialogue continues on that solution. Nevertheless, all of these things, once you look into them, you face the challenges of the cost and the feasibility of the project. We’d be more than happy to share the results of that with committee. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Vician. Energy, grants and contributions, $1.1 million.
Agreed.
Agreed. Thank you. Energy, active positions, page 12-24.
Agreed.
Agreed. Thank you. Page 12-27, tourism and parks, operations expenditure summary, $11.962 million.
Agreed.
Mr. Bromley.
I know we’ve got a plan underway for working on some of the issues at Prelude Lake Territorial Park. I’m just wondering if this budget will deal with the implementation of the results of that plan. Also I’m wondering what the results of the public has been. I understand consultation is coming to an end fairly soon. I’m wondering if the Minister feels they have had a good response, the word got out there that this plan needed to be looked at. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Ramsay.
Thanks, Madam Chair. It’s partially included in this year’s budget, but for the detail I’ll go to Deputy Minister Vician.
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Mr. Vician.
Thank you, Madam Chair. The capital projects that were approved in the fall session identified capital investment for fiscal year 2013-14 of about $150,000 which will be used to expand some parking capacity which has been identified by residents and users as a challenge in the park. So we’re quite pleased with the support of that expansion.
With regard to the question regarding consultation, the development of the management plan for the park has been a very successful process. Good engagement happened earlier in the calendar year, in January, with a very well-attended event, public event, that brought users of the park to discuss in a workshop format the priorities that were needed in the park. We’ve had good feedback. We’re compiling the report at this point and committee will see that in short order.
In addition to that, dialogue continues with Yellowknives Dene First Nation and the residents and users that are adjacent or within the park boundary that take residence in that area. Generally speaking, there’s been very positive feedback on the park planning and some key issues have been identified particularly in capacity issues as we see across the Northwest Territories. Our parks are facing a bit of a transformation with regard to user groups. We have larger type vehicles being used in the park and we need to make accommodations for that. We have been quite successful in using renewable energy and other solutions in our park showers and facilities. So, more of that has been identified. So I believe it’s been a very successful process. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Vician. Mr. Bromley.
Certainly parking has been an issue and I appreciate the work being done to address that. Part of it seems to be related to trespassers using the facility for parking while they’re at illegal facilities on the lake. I’m wondering if we’re able to resolve that situation at all. Also, the park is a bit odd in that there are residents who own lots there as well as some that lease lots there and, obviously, have to park in the park. I think the proposal is to start charging them for parking. That seems a bit odd to me. I’m wondering if that situation has been discussed and whether we’ll hear some solutions for those concerns.
In regard to the parking challenges by unauthorized users, we hope to introduce legislation through this House, through the Minister in the House with regard to some better enforcement techniques to manage unauthorized parking. We hope to see that perhaps even in this session. That would be a key objective to managing the problem. We don’t disagree that the problem exists. It’s just a question of how do you manage and enforce that.
In terms of the use by the residents in the park proper, we continue to work out with our colleagues in MACA proper ranges with regard to using those rights and that continue, and those persons or residents should have continued use of those rights without cost. We’ve developed a good relationship and that’s part of the dialogue. During the consultations in January, a special session was held with those users to identify some of those issues. I believe the park management plan will identify that with a good solution going forward.
Thank you, Mr. Vician. Tourism and parks, operations expenditure summary, $11.962 million. Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I do have a motion here with respect to this page. I move that this committee strongly recommends that the Government of the Northwest Territories take immediate action to increase funding identified for the tourism industry contribution in the amount of $600,000 for the Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment under the tourism and parks activity.
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. We’ll just wait for the motion to be circulated to the Members. The motion is in order. To the motion. Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, colleagues. I bring this motion with the support of my colleagues here today to address and, obviously, do a thank you for the hard work that our NWT Tourism folks do to promote our territory with all their marketing initiatives. I believe that although we see a $600,000 increase in this year’s budget, the fact remains that this government promised a $1.2 million insertion and has made a decision to do so over a two-year period. We’re trying to earmark the fact that we’re looking forward to the additional $600,000 that this motion be moved in the form of a supplementation at the appropriate time. The rationale for that is quite empirical in nature. The fact that what they’re doing right now is very well-targeted marketing campaigns but they’re not able to do all the campaigns needed in the regional centres that they have a plan for. They want to do things to improve tourism information in all these regional areas. There is a lack of capacity in the current framework. We know that the NWT Tourism also has a plan for more emphasis on Aboriginal tourism, so by adding this money we know that it is going towards these very important initiatives throughout our communities and infrastructure. We know that the monies that we’re looking at earmarking will definitely help with overall marketing and training, and again, adding jobs to our communities goes hand in hand with all the initiatives that we’ve put forward as the 17th Assembly.
The other area that we’ve mentioned here, and a number of my colleagues have mentioned, is the fact that we need a better presence and better leveraging opportunities with our current film industry. The Minister has even said on record that they’re looking at initiatives but, again, to leverage these initiatives from a financial standpoint, we have a golden opportunity to use our existing success stories in many of the different features, national and international filmmakers who are here, and to exploit and be proud of all the different activities that we have in the Northwest Territories and our regional centres. We know this money will prove a great asset to move that agenda forward.
It goes without saying that tourism and arts go hand in hand, and we know that with these increased funds we are definitely contributing to the enhancement of our arts with this tourism integration program of extra monies. If we also look at the economic return of what the Department of Tourism currently does with the minimal budget that they have, it’s phenomenal. The department has provided us documentation, and numbers have been tabled in this House numerous times, that the current budget produces, on average, about $100 million to our GDP. When you do the quick math it’s almost a 20 times return on your investment. As I said in my opening address, that type of return on an RRSP portfolio would be phenomenal. We know historical background what these fine folks do is paramount to our economy and we know that this additional $600,000, should everything hold true to their performance measures, will attribute about a $12 million return in GDP. Those are incredible numbers when you look at it. Again, these are speculative numbers at best, but there are enough facts in there to support the investment, and I want to stress that.
Our counterparts to the west, and I’m referring to the territory of Yukon, we can learn a lot of things from our neighbours. They have been leaders and stewards in proper funding for tourism. Their budget is more than double our budget and, as a result, you can clearly see that the Yukon model for tourism investment and the output that they do for the people of the Yukon is phenomenal. I think we just need to look at what we can do. The $600,000 does not bring us on par with Yukon but it’s getting us and inching us closer to what we see as a very good model to which we hope, at one point in time, the government could emulate.
I’m hoping some of my colleagues here will hopefully speak towards this, and the government will heed to the wishes of this committee and look at their current budget and fiscal forecast to see if we can, through the proper channels, hold true to their word to this $1.2 million and add the additional $600,000 during this fiscal year.
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. To the motion. Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate the efforts of committee and the work that we have been doing going through the budget dialogue process and looking at putting dollars where we feel that has not been looked at or supported in quite a number of years. I think, for the past six years NWT Tourism has been operating on the same budget and doing a really great job in terms of getting out to the markets and other jurisdictions, while at the same time still operating on the second-lowest budget in all of Canada. Even with this little increase that we’re asking for, we appreciate the $600,000 that’s being allocated to marketing this upcoming fiscal year, and they do have a very concrete business plan, an expanded Marketing Program that would benefit all residents of the Northwest Territories, and in the jobs that they’ve been doing and the work that we’ve seen them do, they’ve been very diligent in getting the jobs done that they have set out and spreading their dollars as thin as they could.
With the inflation and increased costs of advertising and the increased costs of travel, doing business in the Northwest Territories, especially when they’re competing with other northern jurisdictions, we need to support this group that’s been doing a lot of really great work over the past number of years. We want to continue to support this group, and just from the NWT Days and the work that they did there, they were a great presence. I think they were a big contributing factor on the success of NWT Days. I know there were very interactive displays at the pavilion in Ottawa there and I know they will probably be a big reason why this government has been invited to many other functions in Canada to attend and show our spectacular NWT.
I would support the supplementary appropriation that’s been asked for by our colleague to increase it. This organization has shown, and proven, that they can do the job successfully with the amount of dollars that they have with the $1.2 million fully to get this expanded program on the ground and running and providing those dollars invested in marketing so that we can increase the return on investment in the Northwest Territories. They’ve been doing a great job. It shows that this is our biggest industry that we should be supporting on the lowest budget with the biggest return on investment for the Northwest Territories. I wouldn’t say we’re nickel and diming them, but they do need more support.
That said, this is something that we brought up through the beginning of this budget dialogue process. I feel that NWT Tourism has been doing a great job, excellent job, has been very successful and professional. For the last six years they’ve been operating on a very thin budget and it’s about time that we recognized the hardworking staff over there, we recognize the work that they do, we recognize the investments that they bring to the Northwest Territories and that we do agree and get them that $1.2 million so that they can continue to go out and promote the Northwest Territories to other markets globally and bring more visitors to the Northwest Territories.
I am in favour of this motion and I applaud the work that NWT Tourism does and the motion that my colleague brought before the House today.
Thank you, Mr. Moses. Next I have Mr. Bouchard. To the motion.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to thank Mr. Dolynny for bringing this motion forward and I support both my colleagues’ comments about the importance of tourism. In the South Slave we’ve seen a great deal of interest recently in tourism and we support any marketing of the Northwest Territories. I think the department has been doing a great job on the marketing side. I think these dollars will go a long ways to promoting and improving the Northwest Territories.
We started this process and this ask for additional funds in marketing some six months ago. We’ve been in the budget process, and half the funds were received or accepted in the budget, and this is the other half that we were asking for. I think we just see the commitment, we see the multiplier effect and the results that marketing does to the tourism industry in the Northwest Territories. We feel it’s important to put this into fruition for this upcoming budget. It would have to be a supplementary budget, but we see that as an important thing for the Northwest Territories in promoting this renewable resource that we have and promoting the Northwest Territories to the world and the rest of Canada. I support the motion as it reads.
Thank you, Mr. Bouchard. To the motion. Mr. Menicoche.
Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I just want to say that I will be supporting this motion and I believe that we can do definitely more. I’ve read through the NWT Tourism Marketing Plan, and even though we’ve identified an extra $600,000 in this year’s budget, I truly believe that we can capitalize and further show the world how spectacular NWT we are, once we’ve got the appropriate budget to do it.
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to say briefly, I too will be voting in favour of the motion. I think any way that we can help buttress very important if not supercritical industry to draw new money into the territory, I think we need to take every step we can, as highlighted by Mr. Dolynny. He’s quite right that this is an industry that draws good money, well-invested money into a return that is fantastic and, of course, in times of trying to compete with the world of interest and getting people in your area to spend money and invest money and be part of the opportunities, this certainly seems to be a worthy and well-worthwhile investment. If anything, I would be surprised if, next year, we start to reap what we’ve sown, we will start to ask ourselves questions: why didn’t we do this sooner? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. To the motion. Mr. Nadli.
