Mr. Chair, as you know, it is in archives. I’m not sure we have the actual cost factor here, but is on an agreement of $1 million a year. The following year says $20,000 incremental. Then based on that, storing those artifacts, plus three staff, we can certainly provide that detail to the Members. Mahsi.
Thank you. For clarity, where is it – I’m speaking to all the archival products, including ours – and what does it cost? Just to make sure that’s clear on the record, could I get the Minister to respond?
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. For that we’ll go to Mr. Devitt.
The majority of the collection is stored at the Prince of Wales Northern Heritage Centre. The actual estimate for the cost was $1 million-plus that we have for the contract. I’m not sure exactly; there is some off-site storage in the government warehouse, as well, for some of the artifacts. Thank you.
Has there ever been a discussion to have Nunavut find their own storage facility here in Yellowknife or elsewhere in the Northwest Territories? Wherever would seem feasible, that is.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. For that we’ll go to Ms. Eggenhoffer.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I think the difficulty for storing the artifacts that Nunavut and that we have is they need very special facilities in order to preserve them, so you can’t just pack them away anywhere. The Prince of Wales Northern Heritage Centre has climate control and all the kind of characteristics facilities need to have in order to preserve these very precious artifacts, until such time as Nunavut is ready to take them over.
Thank you. What’s the estimated split between our historical archives and Nunavut’s historical archives? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. For that we’ll be going to Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. I’m not sure we have the exact detail. It’s very detailed information that we may not have here, but we can provide that to Members. Mahsi.
Thank you. Can I also get the estimate – and I’m saying estimate, not exact, you don’t have to hire 25, 30 people to do this – of storage capacity as to what do we have, what are we using and where it’s located? I think I heard someone from the Minister’s side say that some of it’s stored at the Prince of Wales Northern Heritage Centre, some of it’s stored at the government warehouse, which is just a heated warehouse, so can I get that as well?
We’ll definitely provide that information.
I guess… No, that’s fine. Thank you.
Committee, 10-9, Education, Culture and Employment, information item, revenue summary. Any questions?
Agreed.
Thank you. Page 10-10, Education, Culture and Employment, information item, active position summary. Any questions?
Agreed.
Seeing none. Page 10-12, 10-13, Education, Culture and Employment, activity summary, directorate, administration, operations expenditure summary, $10.521 million. Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have a few questions here. As I read the description for this section it talks about policy, legislative initiatives, strategic business and capital planning. I wanted to ask some questions of the Minister with regard to capital planning.
I get the impression that the department doesn’t really have a capital plan. I’d like to hear from the Minister, if there is one, is there a system the department uses to determine what schools are in need of either renovations or replacement. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty. I’m sorry; we’ll go to Mr. Devitt.
Mr. Chair, yes, the department examines all of our facilities each year. We use data in terms of the condition of the buildings, the age of the buildings, and also the utilization. So that’s the start of our planning process, and we identify the needs, working very closely with our clients and the Department of Public Works. As we move forward in the process, particularly for large major projects such as schools, we will do, for schools, an educational plan which looks at the type of program use that will occur and identifies what will occur now and also in the future. Then we move into the government planning process which starts with the approval of a planning study which takes the project through to schematic design, and at that point it moves into the next stage of the government planning process which assesses our projects against other government projects in determining if they can be placed on the government’s capital plan. Thank you.
I appreciate that everything has to come through to the government capital plan process; however, within the department, what does the department use? Okay, the need to identify. So once the needs are identified, does the department have a list where they have a priority list of schools, which schools will be sent through the GNWT capital planning process first before another one, for instance? So there must be some way that the department determines that school X will be put ahead of school Y. So what exists at the department to determine the priority of schools that either need renovations or replacement? Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi. There have been numerous assessments and reviews done in education plans throughout the Northwest Territories. We can provide the detailed information on which schools have been a priority for either a retrofit and which other schools can hold off for a few more years. So we can provide that detailed information.
Thanks to the Minister for the commitment. So what I would like to see, and I don’t know about other committee members, but I would like to see a list from the department which tells me which school is number one and which school is number 47 on the list of things to be done.
I’d like to move on. The Minister mentioned in his opening remarks that there’s a fairly comprehensive review of the education system that is… I can’t remember whether it’s future or whether it’s ongoing right now. I’d like to know from the Minister whether this review has started and, if so, that’s fine. Two things I’d like to know: if it’s already in process, what expectations does the department have that this review will produce at the end of it, and what timelines are we working with here for the review from start to finish? Thank you.
Mahsi. Yes, we’ll provide the priorities of the school from first priority to all schools in the Northwest Territories.
The education renewal,’ as you know, is before us now. Our expectation is that we want to hear as much as we can from the experts, whether it be the educators and community members, the grassroots people, the front-line workers. We’ve heard in the House that we need to listen to the front-line workers. So those are my expectations as Minister responsible. I want to listen to them and hear their input. And the time frame, of course, we’re hoping for late fall, early winter. That’s the target date and we will be going back to the standing committee to present the update on that. I believe it was addressed that potentially having some sort of a draft format to speak to the standing committee. So we are committing to that as well.
Thanks to the Minister for the information. I note the Minister, in his remarks, said to improve student performance, the department has initiated a broad-based review of the NWT education system toward developing a territory-wide action plan. That was in his opening remarks. Just now the Minister mentioned talking to people on the front lines, and I absolutely agree that needs to be done. But if this is a broad-based review, if this is a review which is going to look at the total education system, I would caution that we don’t want to put too much weight on what the people on the front lines say. They certainly have experience, they certainly have opinions, I know I would, were I there, but I caution that we don’t rely only on one segment of our system, that we rely on the experience of those people that are working in our system, but that we also rely on research, that we rely on activities and systems that are operational elsewhere in the world. The Finnish one is one that was referenced last week, I think.
I think for us to get a good result from this review, if it’s going to be as broad as it sounds like it’s going to be, and if it’s going to look at every aspect of our education system, we must make sure that we look at it in a broad picture, that we look at every aspect of our system and that we don’t just concentrate on one segment of our system. That’s pretty much a comment, I don’t have any more questions, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Moving on with questions on 10-13 I have Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I guess I just have one question. If there’s anywhere that I can place it, is under the directorate. It’s in regard to e-learning and seeing how this department provides overall management planning, communication and administrative support.
I believe the staff did get a briefing and presentation from the Beaufort-Delta Education Authority representatives on how successful the e-learning program that’s been happening in a couple of communities in the Beaufort-Delta region and some of the successes that they’ve had in terms of students that are passing the advanced level for courses.
So I just wanted to ask the Minister and his staff, with the presentation that they saw and the results that were coming out of these students going well beyond what we are regularly seeing, and the stats with small communities, is the Minister looking to keep this program going after the pilot project, and would he be willing to look at creating more opportunities for the smaller communities. As I stated in the general comments from the Beaufort-Delta leadership meeting, leaders from Paulatuk and Sachs Harbour expressed interest in utilizing more education in those communities for Sachs Harbour being able to see students graduate with a Grade 12 diploma out of Sachs Harbour. So with the e-learning program, I’m just asking what our next steps are and if he’s willing to continue to support this program, and if he’s willing to expand it into more Beaufort-Delta communities. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Moses. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. I totally agree with the Member about creating more opportunities and that’s our vision, that’s our goal as a department.
Again, I must commend the Beaufort-Delta. When they presented last week, it was very exciting. We were going through a process where we can capture the small communities to deliver academic programming and so forth. So we’ve committed to the Beaufort-Delta. I just signed a letter just the other day, to continue with the fund up to 2013-2014. Part of the programming is that, of course, there will be a review after. Then we’re going through educational renewal and the Early Childhood Development Framework as well. Based on that, this will be part of the discussion as we move forward creating areas of investment, and this is one of the areas that I’d like for us to see even more investment in because it will benefit the small communities.
We’ve heard from the Members from the small communities that we need to focus on the smallest and most isolated communities because some of the programs are not compatible to larger centres. This is an area that I think will tackle the situation, the challenge. Mahsi.
Thank you. He got me excited there when he said he signed off a letter and just for the ‘13-14 year. I thought it was going to be longer years. That kind of just tells me kids going into Grade 10 this year. I mean, if we don’t continue it and we do split up those students that do need it from the three different levels that one teacher might have to teach in the classroom. If we get one student next year that’s taking advanced courses in Grade 10 and the program stops, because the Beaufort-Delta are actually utilizing this funding, then that means the teacher is going to have to go back to amalgamating all grade levels and the students aren’t going to get the specialized attention that they needed.
You and your staff saw the grade passing levels were, like, 63 percent, 70 and 77 percent. I can’t remember what they were, but when we look at the statistics in education in the small communities, the average is, like, 34, 39, 40.
We’ve got proven results here that e-learning with the advanced courses, where they’re able to work with teachers from McPherson or Inuvik teaching these courses, they’re getting some really great, high scores that are going to prepare them for education. I would really recommend that the Minister and his staff look at signing a longer term agreement.
You heard it from the staff themselves, this is more than just advanced education and giving the students the right education that they need. You can even take it further and start getting some of our language experts teaching from small communities such as Fort McPherson teaching students in Aklavik, Tsiigehtchic, or Inuvik. Same with Tuk, getting some of our Inuvialuit speaking instructors in Tuk teaching others in Inuvik. It goes far beyond and it’s also about revitalizing our Aboriginal languages in that area. That’s where it’s suffering the most and the stats show that.
I’m happy that you signed for 2013-2014 but I think that seeing the results, seeing the potential for this innovative and unique opportunity to continue these real time teachings is something that this government needs to commit to mainly because of the cost of travel in the Beaufort-Delta. It is so high that if we can continue to do that e-learning, we would cut down on costs.
There’s the tutoring program that was also mentioned that would really benefit the teachers, and students mainly, and really cut down costs and increase our grade levels. I don’t know what else to say to sell you on this, but it would be nice to see a long-term deal with the Beaufort-Delta Education Authority to continue getting these high grades and increasing the education levels in our small communities. I’d like the Minister, I won’t ask him to commit, but if he would really take a look at it and look at long-term funding for this program so that we can get somebody graduating out of Sachs Harbour and possibly someone out of Tsiigehtchic with a Grade 12 education.
It’s sold. This is an area that I’m very interested, as the Minister responsible, especially in the small communities. Even though it’s only 2013-2014 now, it is part of our long-term commitment that we want to continue with other regions as well. I was very excited when I saw that presentation and thank you to the Beaufort-Delta for allowing that to happen. As the Member indicated, I won’t be able to make a commitment today, but that is part of the long-term goal and commitment that I want to strive for that in other regions as well.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Just in order here we have Mr. Hawkins, Mr. Bromley, followed by Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Under this particular section under strategic and business services division we have the section noted for Aurora College. I’m wondering if the Minister can talk to this particular issue. I’d like to find out what planning and development, in the context of capital planning, is being looked at for Aurora College. I’d like to hear some specifics.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. Mr. Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chairman. As you know, we’re not here to talk about capital, but the Member alluded to planning stages. This is an area that I’m very interested in having discussion with various partners that I introduced in this House before. Part of the discussion I want my department to have is to reintroduce those option papers that we initiated in I believe it was 2010. The existing facilities in Yellowknife, I’m sure we can utilize one of the facilities, as we indicated before. That’s just an option that we want to work with.
Another option was to work with potential partners building a place for us and leasing it back, but that goes against our borrowing limit. That option may not work for us.
We are doing what we can to make it a reality. As you know, $60 million to $80 million it may cost us, which we don’t have today, but we are exploring another venue with the federal government. There are areas we have just identified that we can work with through the Finance department as well.
The Minister knows I’m well aware this isn’t the capital budget and that’s why I’m asking about the planning. What type of capital planning can the Minister actually describe that actually provides a detail? All I heard was we’re planning an options paper. I’m not sure what an option paper is referring to. Maybe he could speak more specific to what that actually means. He also said there were partners and I’m not sure what the options had meant. The answers lacked all or any detail that made any sense. This is an important issue and he knows that, he knows I raise this repeatedly. I’m trying to get a sense of what’s actually happening here.
I probably have to refer to Mr. Devitt. He’s been involved heavily in the discussion. All I can say at this point is that we extended our NUP lease agreement to three years, knowing that we need to have a plan in place. My department’s working diligently to develop a plan to deal with the college. I realize that, obviously, they want a stand-alone campus. Another option again is that, developing plans, we need to come up with some options as well. When we presented to standing committee, this was a while back, a couple years back, and there was some fruitful discussion and we were going to move forward on that. I want my department to dig up the file and re-present that maybe in a different fashion. Those are just some of the options we are working with. I will refer to Mr. Devitt for more detail on the process itself.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Before we go to Mr. Devitt, I will allow Mr. Devitt to respond to Mr. Hawkins’s inquiry on the capital, but I remind Members that we are talking about the operations and operations expenditure summary. Mr. Devitt.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The options were outlined in the 10-year Yellowknife Educational Plan that we developed in consultation with the school districts and college. On the college project we also worked with the college to develop planning guidelines that we use to determine the space requirements for the Yellowknife Campus. We’ve also been working to look at those options and to compare them, in terms of planning, so that we can move through the government planning process that I described earlier.
Thank you, Mr. Devitt. Mr. Hawkins.
When is this development plan going to see committee’s desks or Members’ desks? That’s exactly what I’m talking about. Who is actually developing it?
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. You are referring to the development plan of this capital project?
Yeas that’s part of this division, is to develop plans. It’s not actually to submit a plan for capital dollars to build, it’s all about building a plan.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. If you kept it in that context, sure, we’ll go to Mr. Devitt.
The 10-year Yellowknife Educational Plan, with options that I referred to, is a public document. It was, for some years, on our website and we can certainly provide a copy of that.
Thank you for that. I would be happy to receive that. Specific to developing a plan for Aurora College, is that an independent plan or is that part of the broad overall scheme of all the school systems?
If I understand the question correctly, in terms of developing an actual approved plan for the college, that would have to move through the government planning process.
No, what I mean more so is when you do capital planning you do almost like a business case, business plan, strategy, you sort of look at… You guys know what that is. Where is the development of the college into actually… Where is the business case model and who is developing the business case model that moves the planning for a new Aurora College independent campus into the capital plan? Because you need a business plan of sorts before this, and that falls under the operations.
