I was going to allow you extra to make up for yesterday. I will allow one more question for Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I appreciate your leniency on me. I think the Minister will be happy when I'm done with the questioning on this page. With the heavier caseload, and I notice there's a reduction in staffing, was that part of the reduction process? I've heard that some of the caseload staff could be potentially affected by our reductions and maybe I've been misinformed, but I notice that with the heavier caseload you have a reduction of three staff at headquarters, so does that have an impact on what we're doing and was that part of the reduction-planning process? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Thompson. Mr. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. We did have two positions that I believe went through decentralization and then there was one reduction at headquarters.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Questions. I see none. Education, Culture and Employment, income security, operations expenditure summary, and detail on 63 and additional verbiage on 61, activity total, $47,578,000. Agreed?
Agreed.
Page 64, Education, Culture and Employment, income security, active positions, information item. Any questions. I see none. Agreed?
Agreed.
Page 66, Education, Culture and Employment, labour development and standards, operations expenditures summary, total activity, $49,718,000. This is another summary with detail on pages 67. Questions. Mr. O'Reilly?
Thanks Mr. Chair. I just want to indulge the Minister. I think I may have asked this question yesterday, but I see that the contributions in particular, there's a line item here, literacy funding and there's a rather large amount of $2.3 million. Presumably this is some funding that the NWT Literacy Council would be able to access or maybe is accessing. Can the Minister confirm for me that the GNWT's not looking at making any reductions in funding to the NWT Literacy Council? Thanks, Mr. Chair. This might be project-based, but if there's core funding being provided to the organization, is the GNWT actually looking at making any changes to its core funding? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. Minister.
Yes, we're not making any reductions to the Literacy Council. We do fund them up over $900,000, as stated yesterday. That does reflect a lot of programs throughout the Northwest Territories, but at this moment, no.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for that because the council does great work and I'm pleased to hear that we're going to continue to support them in that work, so thanks again to the Minister.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. Minister.
Thank you. I appreciate the comments and that's definitely a priority to increase our literacy rates throughout the Northwest Territories in working with the great work that the NWT Literacy Council does as well.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I note on the detail page we've got the $33 million in college contributions. Does the department have a breakdown of what the cost per graduate is based on that level of funding? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
Yes, we could get the costs. We don’t have that exact detail with us today, but we could look at our enrolment rates for all of our graduates within all the institutions that we fund and get that back to the Member.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just noted the Minister said, “all the institutions we fund.” Is the $33 million here on the description line says, “base funding for Aurora College, includes funding for Aurora Research Institute.” Does this funding include other post-secondary institutions? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
Yes, that's correct. It's all the Aurora College Institute’s, but I was also referring to our learning centres as well.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
I thank the Minister for that clarification. The inclusion of the ARI, or aurora research institution, this funding line is somewhat confusing to me. What's the exact number out of this funding that goes to ARI? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. It's all included in the appropriation that we have before us. We could get the detail on what's given to ARI and provide it to the Member.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Just to confirm, that detail can't be provided today then? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
Not at this time. During the review of the main estimates, but we can get that within the next couple days for sure, if not tomorrow.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The other post-secondary institutions that have been mentioned here, College nordique and Dechinta Bush University. Do we provide funding in this section of the budget here or where can I find their funding numbers because I believe earlier yesterday that question was asked and it was deferred to later in the main, so is this where we would find those numbers and where are they located? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister, further contribution?
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I believe it's under our labour and career development allocated funding.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Can the Minister provide the totals there and is there something we need to wait for more detail? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
Roughly, it's about $250,000 to $300,000 to both College nordique and also to Dechinta. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart, is that satisfactory clarification?
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, that is satisfactory. To have the detail, I think we could be doing more to support these institutions. There's a very good business case that's been made by Dechinta in particular for increased funding. Based on their success rates, I think they're still sitting at 100 per cent success rate, granted they only take a few students, but this is a remarkably successful post-secondary education program that's tailored to the deficiencies we have in post-secondary education in the North. I know the Minister's very aware of this based on his work as chair of the standing committee in a previous Assembly, so how do we move forward on this? I know we've talked about legislation but the real issue for these institutions is giving them the funding they need to continue to do good work. I think if we take a look at the $33 million we're spending on college contributions, specifically to the post-secondary elements, the degree-granting elements of Aurora College, the numbers are not good. They've been in decline over the years and they don’t seem to be rebounding. We have some other institutions that are doing incredible work and been highly successful, so has the department given any thought to breaking this number down and actually looking at other post-secondary education institutions that are finding success and working with them rather than continuing to support programs that aren't popular for whatever reason? It's a huge amount of money. Basically, all of our post-secondary funding is going into one basket and it's not achieving the results that I think any of us are comfortable with.
That was a whole lot. I'm not sure if I've got a clear question, but I guess, can we look into providing more funding than the very small amounts were giving to these successful programs? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and we do appreciate the work that College nordique and Dechinta have been doing over the number of years. One of the unique things and great things that I'm excited about is the Skills 4 Success Action Plan. As Members are aware, we did table a labour market information and needs assessment report on April 20th. That reflected the jobs that are going to be needed throughout the Northwest Territories over the next five, 10, 15 years. We have been getting some really good feedback from both College nordique and also with Dechinta and how they're going to be reflecting a lot of their programs around what was developed out of the Skills 4 Success. We're also working with the Aurora College to ensure that as they're going through their strategic planning session this summer, that they're going to be looking at putting programs in that are also reflective of the Skills 4 Success. It is a lot of money that we do fund adult and post-secondary education. One of the things that we have done and incorporated and are going to be looking at more is developing an accountability framework with Aurora College. Hopefully those dollars are reflective of the graduates that we're getting as well as the program services that are being provided to our students. Thank you. As stated in questions yesterday in this area, we did say that we are looking at the legislation that needs to be changed so that institutions such as Dechinta, College nordique, and also look at accessing and applying for other pots of funding. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to the Minister for that. It is hopeful that the department is acknowledging that there are challenges here and that the government is moving to address them. I note as well that this section has been moved to labour and development standards rather than education. Can the department confirm that they are taking more of a vocational training approach to post-secondary education in the North with this change? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Minister.
I think we are trying to hit so many different areas by moving it into labour development and standards section. We are trying to make sure throughout the board that we are actually getting the skilled developments, being able to provide other opportunities to some of our partners and stakeholders outside of the Aurora College system. We are trying to reach all areas and having this area definitely helps with that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you Mr. Chair. I am making good use of my time if you don't mind. That is good. I appreciate that. I think that we had a lot of conversations about a university of the North. My position has always been that a polytechnic is more appropriate. I think this change is the correct one, to actually take a rural college and make it more of a vocational institution for job training, give Northerners the skills they need for the jobs that we need in the future and today. How much involvement did the department have with that strategic plan? Quite frankly, I think Aurora College needs to have that message loud and clear. They are going to need to become a polytechnic. They need to become a vocational school. That is what they were set up to do in addition to the adult education, and I think it strayed from that course. Now, it is time to get them back on track. I think by putting it into labour development, you are sending a clear message from this government that that is exactly what we are up to. Can the Minister confirm that that we are moving Aurora College towards a polytechnic and we are creating a vocational college, rather than letting Aurora College be all things for all people? Thank you.
