Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. I believe the motion is just being distributed right now. The motion is in order. To the motion. Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I’ll just speak briefly to the motion. We have had a lot of discussion about inclusive schooling, and I think one of the things that this motion tries to address is that the current Inclusive Schooling funding does not work. Providing a percentage of funding according to population to schools is not recognizing that there are certain schools and/or certain authorities who have a higher need for funding for special needs students. It’s been suggested that maybe the funding should follow the student, and I’m not so sure that that’s the exact way to go, but certainly we need to have something that’s halfway in between the funding following the student and a percentage amount going to every school and every authority.
This motion is talking to that, about redefining or reorganizing and reassessing and redefining the Inclusive Schooling funding. It’s also talking, though, about providing funding to education authorities to properly diagnose and assess students with special needs. One of the things that Members hear quite often is that it’s very difficult to get students diagnosed; it’s very difficult to get students assessed. There are two things in this motion. Those are the two, and I think that’s all I need to say.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. To the motion.
Question.
Question is being called. The motion is carried. Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I wanted to ask a question on a bit of a different topic. In his opening remarks, he talked about a statement: The department will implement and provide supports for a territorial safe schools plan along with anti-bullying legislation. The Minister has talked about safe schools. He’s talked about anti-bullying legislation and they are kind of referenced in the same breath sometimes. I would like to know from the Minister what is the difference between the safe schools plan and the anti-bullying legislation which is presumably on its way. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. Currently, there was a motion brought forward by yourself, the Members in this House to look into possibly anti-bullying legislation brought forward within an 18-month time frame. That is an area that we have been working at since the motion was introduced. We are hoping to introduce that this coming spring session. That’s the time frame that we have. It does cover a broad area of anti-bullying legislation.
When I talk about the safe schools and the comprehensive plan that we are working on, there is a plan that we are working on on anti-bullying, working closely with the school boards and agencies and doing a lot of research in this area capturing what is in existence in the schools and building on that. If we can have a policy or legislation, anti-bullying legislation in general and then have the schools… We know that a lot of schools have their own policies, as well, and building on that. Those are just the two that we have introduced, unless I have my deputy maybe elaborate a bit more, if she has more detailed information, which I believe she has. Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Ms. Eggenhofer.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think they are two separate tools to deal with bullying prevention. One is a plan that sets out measures, and tools and resources that would be available to schools to deal with bullying. The other one is really an amendment to the Education Act or a stand-alone anti-bullying legislation that sets out provisions in legislation about the government’s tolerance around bullying.
I think the two of them don’t necessarily have to go together. That’s what we are examining at this stage, whether a comprehensive plan in and of itself that has the input from the stakeholders would be a sufficient tool to address anti-bullying in school or whether legislation is required.
We have received some feedback from the NWTTA and I think there is a bit of nervousness around having provisions in the Education Act that deal with bullying because the question of enforcement always comes up. We have done a cross-jurisdictional check to see how many jurisdictions in Canada actually have legislation alone or a plan or both and it’s kind of an even split. But the only way to deal with bullying isn’t just legislation. A lot of jurisdictions have looked at the development of comprehensive plans. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Ms. Eggenhofer. Before we continue with questionings, committee, we are going to take a quick five-minute break.
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Okay, we will come back, committee. We will continue on questioning here with Ms. Bisaro. Go ahead, Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thanks to the deputy minister for her comments. I want to say that I am a little concerned that safe schools and anti-bullying are mentioned in the same breath and they seem to have the same focus. For me, safe schools or a safe schools plan or policy encompasses far more than just anti-bullying. In my mind, it should look at safe schools in terms of students, the safety of the students. It should look at the safety of the teachers and it should look at the safety of other staff within the school. Bullying is one aspect, but there certainly are other things which happen to make the workplace unsafe for teachers and which happen to make the school grounds and the environment itself unsafe for students.
I would strongly encourage the department, when they talk about safe schools, to look beyond bullying and look at all aspects of keeping a school safe. All users, all components of the whole school program should be considered in dealing with a safe schools policy.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi. We’re very excited about this fibre optic link that’s before us, and we’re hoping that 2014-2015, well, 2014 I guess, the deliverance of the optic. When we met with the Beaufort-Delta on the e-learning, there’s excitement in the air. We’re delivering programs that are not being delivered in small communities as opposed to larger centres. Not only that, but at the same time delivering language apps into the schools and language programming where we have an elder on another screen who can work closely with the students.
There’s so many ways that we can take advantage of the e-learning, the fibre optic link that’s before us. We are getting ready. We know it’s approximately a year and a half, two years from now. My department is working very closely with the school boards on what kind of programs can be delivered now, and we talk about various tools that kids and children play with, whether it be on-line programming, gaming, what kind of educational gaming and so forth.
So those are just some of the areas that my department is working closely on. I can get my deputy to maybe elaborate a bit more, just involving the school boards and potential programs that will be available. Mahsi.
Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Ms. Eggenhofer.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. As the Minister said, the e-learning orientation that we were allowed to be part of was very exciting, and we’ve had dialogue with the Beaufort-Delta Education Council already on how we can expand the project into other school boards. We’re looking at that, as the Minister said, for both the Aboriginal languages as well as for general school operations and orientations with teachers. I think the possibilities are endless, and as part of the education renewal we’re taking a look at that.
Thank you, Ms. Eggenhofer. Moving on with questions on this page I have Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I wanted to ask a question on the Aboriginal language and culture-based education. I know we have, I think, a couple of programs where we produce teachers or teacher equivalents in languages and culture such as the ALCIP program. What certificates or diplomas are available, and how many graduates do we have in this fiscal year?
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi. There is a certification diploma in Aboriginal Language Instruction and Coordinator Program. We’ve had real success in the Beaufort-Delta. Just last year we had, I can’t remember exactly the numbers, but I think up to 12, I believe. I could be wrong. But we had a good number of graduates, and we’ll want to utilize them in various fields as we possibly can or even encourage them to pursue even higher education.
I don’t have the actual number for this fiscal year. The graduates are coming through the system. So we can provide that kind of detailed information once we have that from the college to the Members. Again, it has been very positive to date, and we want to deliver that in other regions as well. The college delivers it, and we are also delivering it to the regions too.
So I just got the information from my director that in 2012-13 there’s ALCIP, Inuvik TEP, and South Slave ALCIP program. Ten students are enrolled in year two of the TEP in Inuvik, and five students are enrolled in year two of ALCIP at the K’atlodeeche First Nation. That’s just some of the highlights. I can provide more detail to the Members. Mahsi.
Thank you. At one point it took a number of years to actually complete the program. Is the ALCIP program down to a two-year program now? Thank you.
Mahsi. There have been some modules that individuals had to take in the past. It was a part of the certification program. Now we are delivering a diploma program, and if the student is enrolled full-time, then they should be able to complete the program in two years. Again, we’re working closely with the college on this.
There are certification students that are part-time students. Even the diploma program, some are part-time, some are full-time. So it does fluctuate in how long they take on the program, but we’ll provide the Members with the information from the college. Mahsi.
Thanks to the Minister for those comments. I guess I would be interested to know that we are offering the courses in a way that it is possible for those that wish it to complete the certification or the diploma programs in a fairly efficient amount of time. So I will appreciate that update.
My last question on this page has to do with controllable assets. I notice under details of other expenses there’s been a substantial change in that amount over the last couple of fiscal years. I wonder if I could have a brief explanation of what we’re talking about here and why the dramatically declining numbers on that line item. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. For that we’ll go to Mr. Devitt.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I believe, if I heard correctly, it’s controllable assets that the Member referred to. The difference is, for the reduction this year, was the Prince of Wales Northern Heritage repairs were budgeted in 2012-13 are no longer needed because it was a one-time cost.
Thank s to Mr. Devitt. Just for my own learning here, I think it might have been a couple of million or something like that a couple of years ago, half a million, and now down to $20,000. How do we define things as controllable asset versus infrastructure expenditures? Because this clearly seems like an infrastructure expenditure to me, but somehow it’s being designated a controllable asset. How do we know what’s what? Thank you.
I guess hopefully a simple explanation would be that when you’re doing repairs, if it’s not extending the life of the asset, then it’s considered O and M as opposed to capital. Thank you.
That was very concise and clear. That’s all I had, Mr. Chair. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Page 10-17, Education, Culture and Employment, activity summary, education and culture, operations expenditure summary, $198.772 million. Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just one question here. Mr. Bromley brought my eyes to the line that says other. I complained bitterly in the 16th that we had amounts in other that weren’t explained anywhere, and I just wondered. I thought we’d gotten rid of all of those. I’d like to know from the department what the $258,000 under other is for and why we don’t have an explanation for it on this page.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. For that we’ll go to Mr. Devitt.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. The other here, I think, would be probably furnishings. It could also be chargeback expenses, but I believe it’s probably furnishing for the Aboriginal Languages Secretariat. There may be other expenses in there. I don’t have all the detail.
Following up with that answer, then, are there things in the other category which couldn’t also be posted, for instance, under materials and supplies? I would think that’s where furnishings would go. If it’s TSC chargebacks, then one would think they would go there. That’s actually another question. How come there’s no chargebacks for TSC from the department? I would just ask that the department eliminate other in the next year’s budget.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Mr. Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chairman. I do remember the Member raising that issue, and we will do it for next year. I’m kind of surprised that it was still here too. We’ll make that work.
I guess I should ask why there’s no TSC chargebacks.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. For that we’ll go to Mr. Devitt.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I was naming off some of the items that might be charged other, but in this case I believe it would be furnishings. The chargeback expenses are in the directorate.
Okay. I guess I would suggest then, does that line really need to be there, because it’s very confusing. Thank you. That’s all.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. We’ll take that as a comment. Page 10-17, Education, Culture and Employment, activity summary, education and culture, operations expenditure summary, $198.772 million.
Agreed.
Pages 10-18 to 10-20, Education, Culture and Employment, activity summary, education and culture, grants and contributions; grants, total grants, $52,000, contributions, total contributions, $168.801 million, total grants and contributions, $168.853 million. Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I just have to go back to my issue with heritage and projects. Maybe it’s just the way that it’s written, but if I look on page 10-20, the NWT Arts Council gives contributions to artists and cultural groups – okay, that might include heritage – but then it goes on to say to encourage creative artistic projects in visual literary performing and new media arts in the NWT. I would think that a heritage organization is not likely to want to do a creative artistic project.
I again would have to stress to the Minister that I don’t see much opportunity in here for a heritage organization like, say, the Norman Wells Heritage Society. They get funding for their building, yes, but do they get funding for outreach, for education purposes, for other programs that they might do? I don’t really see that there’s much in here. If it’s included – there’s cultural organizations on page 10-19 for $554,000 – if it’s included in there, then okay, fine. But I really don’t see where the word heritage is relative, is specifically related to programming on these three pages.
If I could maybe get a bit more explanation as to if the wording is incorrect and the word heritage needs to be added, or if there just isn’t money for heritage programming.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Mr. Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chairman. Some of the areas that we talk about, the heritage centre, $491,000, the cultural projects, preserving, identity enhancement, traditional cultures, and contribution to administration and operations, those are just some areas that will capture it. I understand where the Member is coming from with the arts council. New Northern Arts Program does capture to some degree northern film, part of the heritage.
I do take the Member’s comments into consideration, and we can definitely, well, we do have some highlights of what kind of organizations we currently sponsor. Based on that, we can identify if it’s part of the covering of heritage aspect. Duly noted. We can provide detailed information if that is the wish of the Members as well.
Just to comment, I appreciate that the Minister understands where I’m coming from. But if he’s looking for sort of what the groups are looking for, I would reference him to the letter which came on the Mine Heritage Society letterhead, signed by seven or nine, I think, different heritage groups within the NWT. There were a couple of requests in there which, if he’s looking for inspiration, could provide some. I’m not looking for further information than what’s here. That’s all.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Moving on with questions here, I have Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I did want to follow up on top of page 10-19, the large item there, education authority contributions. I’d like to just find out where we’re at with the TSC chargeback. We have learned that we are starting to bring our health authorities into the fold with TSC. The common comment from the Auditor General is that departments aren’t necessarily providing the standards and leadership that they could be for our authorities.
This is one area I think that could be very helpful, is if we’re all using the same system. So communications, and I think we’re working on the financial end of things, could be standardized. I’m not aware of any of the authorities planning to convert to our system as some of the health authorities are, but is there a plan? Is the department thinking about this? Where are we at on that front?
