Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Good afternoon. Fellow colleagues, as we gather this month with our families and friends, let’s thank each other for the support given on a daily basis and during the National Addictions Awareness Week, November 18th to 24th.
We acknowledge this week to recognize and overcome the addictions that we face on a daily basis. It’s through community support, community leaders and community wellness workers that we can enjoy this week without addictions in our lives. Our communities in the Northwest Territories are very unique. Our very own people have proven that we can live happy and healthy. Our elders have told us time and time again that we don’t need the alcohol and drugs, the gambling, smoking, and the list goes on.
We can prove to our people and ourselves that we will take a stand against addictions. So many of us struggle in our daily lives, but we must understand that there are many resources and people that care and are willing to assist us.
Family gatherings and feasts will be taking place during National Addictions Awareness Week. Let us join them and continue to support our leaders who are stepping forward to promote wellness.
Today I want to congratulate all the people who have overcome addictions, all the people who live a healthy lifestyle, and to all of us who are continuing to fight addictions. I wish you well and, again, mahsi cho for looking after each other.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I would like to recognize Dr. Ewan Affleck, if he’s still in the House, and his wife, Susan Chatwood, and his father-in-law, Susan’s father, Andrew Chatwood, who are here to watch their daughter Anika work today as a Page.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I also would like to recognize my constituents from Weledeh, Dr. Ewan Affleck, Susan Chatwood, their daughter Anika working for us today, and welcome Andrew Chatwood, also visiting and with a history in the Legislature of Newfoundland, if I remember correctly.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The honourable Member for Range Lake, Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I, too, would like to recognize some residents from Weledeh, but a former colleague of mine here in the medical profession world, Dr. Ewan Affleck, who is an ultra-marathon runner, the pioneer of electronic medical records and one heck of a gifted practitioner. Sitting next to him is the lovely Susan Chatwood, who is our scientific director for the Institute of Circumpolar Health Research. And as we found out, we have an esteemed colleague here with us, Mr. Andrew Chatwood, who is a former Member of the Parliament for Grand Falls-White Bay-Labrador riding and grandfather to one of our Pages here, Anika Affleck, who is here today in the 17th Assembly.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions today are, obviously, for the Minister of Health and Social Services. In preamble to my questions I want to say that the Minister of Health and Social Services is not the enemy, the Members on the other side of the House are not the enemy, the issue that we are dealing with is the enemy. I’m sorry. I am sure that there is not one person on that side of the House who does not agree with and relate to almost everything that was said on this side of the House today. This is a collective problem. We have to find a collective solution.
I would like to ask the Minister of Health and Social Services how we as a government can actually get the money to put a higher priority on the issue of addressing addictions. How can we physically do that? Take us through it.
Thank you, Mrs. Groenewegen. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Probably the first step is to really determine what the actual cost would be for some of the work that we have to do. As I indicated earlier in the House in discussion about the addictions forum, that is going to be some of their work and is going to determine what needs to be done. From there I think we will be able to cost it out and return to this Assembly to get the money necessary to do the work.
Last week I said that the Minister has definitely assembled the A-Team on this Minister’s Forum on Addictions and I applaud him for that. He said that he wants the recommendations back by March 2013. Again, that is good. We are interested in seeing those recommendations, too, but those recommendations without the resources to carry out those recommendations are not worth the paper they are written on. Unfortunately, as the Members have said here today, we have had too many studies, too many frameworks. We have spent millions of dollars on stuff like this. We need to start spending money on the actual solutions. We need a champion.
I’d like to ask the Minister of Health and Social Services if he will be our champion who will be in that Cabinet room fighting for the funds needed to implement the recommendations of that forum.
As one MLA said today in the House, can we afford to do nothing about addictions? I think that was the reason I, as Health Minister, began the job. I could see that the first job that needed to be done that impacts everyone, that impacts every community, that impacts the economy as some MLAs said, we need to do this work. I will be a champion to make sure the work gets done on addictions.
I believe that. I have known this Minister and everyone on the other side of the House for a very long time and I do believe that, but it may involve necessarily setting something else that we do and spend money on aside in order to devote the resources that we need to this problem, because this is a pressing and critical problem which is absorbing so much of our resources. If we could curb it and stem it somehow, we could go back to doing those other things.
Will the Minister work with this side of the House to look at what things we now spend money on that are not as high a priority and could set aside in order to have the resources we need to address the addictions issue?
Alcohol abuse does impact most areas in health. It has a huge impact on the health of the individuals, an impact on hospital stays, individuals that are staying at the corrections facilities because of crimes they committed under addictions while they’re drinking, and so on. Really, for as far as the Department of Health goes, we’re simply looking within the communities and hospitals to recognize that if there was no drinking going on, or if the drinking was reduced immensely, then we would bring the costs down on hospital stays and even the nurses’ overtime in the communities, which a lot of it is spent on weekends dealing with alcohol issues.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mrs. Groenewegen.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We’re having a theme day. I would like to have a theme government. I would like the 16th Legislative Assembly to be remembered as the government that actually put their money where their mouth was in terms of addictions, and I would like to make that the theme of this government going forward. Will the Minister of Health and Social Services support that?
Yes, I believe that’s the direction we are going. I felt that at the very beginning of my term a year ago, that this is something we have to deal with first. Alcohol first and then the other things will fall in place.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to ask some questions, as well, of the Minister of Health and Social Services.
I heard the Minister in responding to Mrs. Groenewegen in answer to the question about money, that there needed to be support. I would suggest to the Minister that the support for additional funds in the department to deal with the problem of addictions, particularly alcohol, is already there. You’ve got 11 votes on this side of the House already.
I’d like to ask the Minister, knowing that he’s got support from the majority of the House, and I imagine he’s got support on the other side of the House as well, what is stopping the Minister from putting additional dollars into next year’s budget?
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At the outset this government had indicated that there were going to be two fiscal years where we’re going to take a look at our fiscal situation and then give us an opportunity to do some planning and where we could do some adjusting in the budget and moving some money around in health. That’s exactly what we’re intending on doing. We are holding the line on the budget without too many increases. We’re going to do some reshuffling and then put money where we think it would have the greatest positive impacts on the budget, and one of them is definitely alcohol addictions.
To the Minister, I accept that we have a fiscal policy that says that we weren’t going to do any new initiatives, but I have to also say to the Minister and to the House that we have put a huge amount of money over and above our steady fiscal policy into other initiatives. I have to say that some of our on-the-road initiatives are pretty heavy in terms of dollars. I think if there was a will, we would find the money to put into alcohol. It would save us money in the long run.
I said in my statement that I think it’s time to stop studying and it’s time to take action. I’d like to know from the Minister whether or not he could see that the $300,000 that’s intended to be spent on the Minister’s forum, whether or not there’s a better use for that right now?
No, I don’t think there is a better use for that right now. I think that this is the best use of the money, the $300,000, and that’s the reason we’re moving forward on it. I think we want to do the right thing in addictions. We don’t want to do the quick thing in addictions.
I have to disagree with the Minister. This would not be a quick fix. We’ve been studying this problem for a very long time, and I think the Minister, were he to look at the asks that the people in the communities have been making over many years, I think he would find that there were things that we could do right now. We need supports in our communities.
I’d like to ask the Minister – he was with me when we did the Child and Family Services Act review – did the Minister hear from the communities what I heard, that they need supports on the ground?
Yes, I heard that, but there’s always something new. When we put the forum together, the forum met last Friday and last Saturday, the addictions forum. It came as a surprise to me in the way they wanted to tackle the issues. There’s always something new and they’re the people on the ground. They basically know exactly what is happening at the community level, so this is why we’re reaching out to them. We think this cost is going to be more than recoverable. We want to do the proper upstream work so that we have positive impacts downstream.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My last question to the Minister has to do with the only treatment program that we have in the territory, the Nats'ejee K'eh. One of the things that was in the Mental Health and Addictions Action Plan was that there was going to be an analysis and a revamping of the programs at Nats’ejee K’eh to increase the percentage of use there. Can I ask the Minister what revamping has been done? What’s the percentage of use of that facility right now?
No revamping yet. The percentage is about 46 percent capacity right now.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The Member for Range Lake, Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My grandfather was a very wise man who came from Europe many years ago. He passed away. With his wisdom, even with very little education, he always had these very famous sayings and those resonated even today. One of his famous sayings was, talk is cheap; whiskey costs money. I think it is only befitting that I bring that forward today. Not that whiskey costs money but addictions cost money. Talk is cheap; addictions cost money.
With that, I want to find out from the Minister of Health and Social Services, he mentioned earlier the spending of $300,000 towards addictions treatment. Can the Minister tell us what exactly are we getting today for that $300,000?
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
The work of the addictions forum is laid out in their terms of reference and also a document that we’ve produced with the supports in there and everything. What we’re hoping to gain from that is a good plan on how we’re going to move forward on addressing the issue of addictions.
That’s a pretty large number for updating a plan. I think we’ve already got a mental addictions treatment plan, so now we’re going to have a plan with a plan. Again, talk is cheap; addictions cost money.
Can the Minister indicate to us what kind of plan we are going to have? I was very bold; I had a five-point plan today and brought it to the House here. We’ve only heard, really, to this date on this side of the House the Minister’s one-point plan, which I mentioned earlier.
Can the Minister allude to the House here, do we have more than just a one-point plan? Can the Minister allude to his multi-point plan that he wants to table for us in the House?
If I knew what the plan was I wouldn’t hire a bunch of people to go into the communities to check with the communities what they think the issues with addictions are, and how they think that the addiction issues should be addressed in the communities. The group, in my opinion, in a very short time period have to travel around to the communities. The plan is to come back to this government to what the communities think would be the most effective method in addressing addictions in their communities. That is what we want to move forward with.
I believe the plan is probably embedded in the archives of our Legislative library here, and I’d be more than happy to give my library card to the Minister to go and use that.
Can we get an idea here how many of our citizens are we sending down south for addictions and detox treatment?
I don’t have that information with me. I think it’s a fair amount of people. We’ve come back for supps to the Legislative Assembly on an annual basis for southern placements and so on for addictions. It does go through the Territorial Southern Placement Committee, so the committee would then determine that an individual would go down. But the exact number, I don’t have with me today, but I can provide that to the Member if he wishes. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We recently enjoyed the budget dialogues with the Minister of Finance throughout the Territories. We were told in the House and we were told in many of these meetings that people are gravely concerned about addictions and money put towards it. In fact, sometimes, when people were doing the Lego exercise with the Minister of Finance, there were Legos left over. They said, we want to put it into addictions. Again, I am holding Legos in my hand for health and social services.
How much money are we going to be putting towards next year’s budget towards addictions? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
The amount of money we put towards addressing addictions issues is going to be determined by the House. We are going to go through a process, a business planning process. We will make a business case for what we find, our findings. We will have some findings as a result of this committee. Once the forum has done their work and we have our plan in place specific to that, then it will go through the business planning process. The number will be determined by the amount of work that needs to be done at the community level. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Deh Cho, Mr. Nadli.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In communities there are very few resources in terms of trying to develop programs and at least sustain and maintain them so that we help each other. The questions I have are for the Minister. It is a known reality that detox centres are very far and few between. At the community level, when people take that very ultimate step, the big step for them is a cry for help, asking for help.
Can the Health Minister describe what typically happens when someone goes to the nursing station and says they want to quit drinking? Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Nadli. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Although within the health system we don’t actually have designated beds for people to detoxify, we do have beds so that an individual that is saying that he is ready now to quit and needs to go through detox, then the health centre should be getting in touch with the authority to advise if there are any beds available for that specific individual.
Each case is different. If this person does go into the health centre needing detoxification and is ready to go, then I think it is incumbent upon the health centre to go through their authority and try to find them a bed in one of the hospitals to be able to allow him to detox. Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, we have treatment centres, of course, in the NWT. We have very limited access to detox centres, especially at ground level. How do we track the success rate of our alcohol and drug treatment programs? Thank you.
Mr. Speaker, one of the things that we found as a bit of a gap in the one treatment centre we have, was determining whether or not we were being successful. We recognize that there are various measurements that can be used to determine the success of treatment. People will be contacted after one year and see if they still remain clean and sober. Then if they start drinking after 13 months, is that considered to be a success story or do we contact them after five years? And if they drink after six years, would that be considered a success story? It’s difficult to determine success unless we’re saying that the individual has stopped drinking or stopped using drugs and has stopped drinking and using drugs for the rest of their lives, essentially, if they felt that there was enough of an issue that they had to go through treatment. It is a very difficult thing to really determine because we don’t know at which point we’re going to make the measurement. Thank you.
