Mr. Speaker, I think my colleagues would agree with me that the measurement that we use on this side of this House is to have more success stories of people being able to arrive at a point where they enjoy sobriety. It is 85 percent of crimes committed that are related to alcohol or drugs. What is Health’s role in ensuring that treatment is available for inmates in the correctional facilities? Mahsi.
Mr. Speaker, treatment is available to individuals that are incarcerated, but the success, again, is difficult to determine. Sometimes individuals will go to treatment, go through their incarceration without any issues, any indications, and once they get out, then at what point do we measure them?
It’s difficult to determine success. You see it. There are successes. There is no question about it. There are a lot of people out there who have successfully quit drinking or have successfully quit using drugs. Again, how they affiliate with the treatment centre that is sitting on the Hay River Reserve is something that we still need to get a closer look at. We are looking at that in the idea of when we are trying to revamp programs in Nats’ejee K’eh. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Nadli.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At the outset of the 17th Assembly, something that I remember very clearly is that there was a very strong, common theme that we wanted to undertake programs and services that dealt upon preventative steps to ensure that people were leading healthy lifestyles. At the same time, we wanted to ensure that the health care system was in the position to provide information to people so that, in the long run, they would lead healthier lives. What is Health doing to make sure that young people in school understand the impacts of the dangers of alcohol abuse? Mahsi.
Mr. Speaker, that work is, again, a difficult type of work. It is not common to talk about alcohol and other addictions such as cigarette smoke and so on in the lower grades. What we need to do is we have to determine at what point that we need to go into the schools, at what age category do we need to target when we start talking about Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder and alcoholism, smoking and so on. Sometimes there are some issues with approaching children that are too young in the school with these types of programs. We have to determine at what point we go into the schools.
As far as school programs that go directly into addictions, we know that there are cigarette programs. Don’t be a Butthead is an example. As far as alcohol and other drugs in the school, I don’t have that information, but I don’t think there are other programs pertaining to alcohol and drugs in the schools. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I certainly hope I don’t hurt anyone’s feelings when I say this, but this government is addicted to the status quo. I am telling you, all we hear is this bunk message over and over again that they don’t want to do anything.
I want to hear today, what has the Minister of Health and Social Services done by way of submission by providing a plan for infrastructure such as a treatment or a detox centre to the FMB, that’s the Financial Management Board, and what can he tell this House today and show this House today that he is working on this particular problem? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There is nothing in the capital plan for new treatment centres, new detox centres, as most people in the House know. We have made a decision at the beginning of this government that any infrastructure needed for addictions, treatment of addictions, would be from current infrastructure, existing infrastructure that’s owned by the government and we’re still on that task. We haven’t changed in the first year of this government to all of a sudden make a decision that we’re going to set aside other capital issues or plans that have been on the books for several years and then replace it with treatment centres and detox centres. Thank you.
When we talk about holding the budget line, that’s nothing but malarkey. Everybody in this building would support a treatment centre option submitted to the FMB.
Why isn’t the Minister of Health and Social Services demanding the Financial Management Board approve that submission to build a treatment centre in the Northwest Territories? Thank you.
Again, I’ve got to go back to the fiscal strategy of this government, that we are headed in a direction where we’re going to take a look at some fiscal responsibility, fiscal strategy within the first couple of years, and then within the last couple of years, the House knows that we’re planning on expanding our infrastructure budget. At that point, if this is what we determine is the best use of our dollars, that the best way to address this issue is to put people inside a treatment centre or put six people inside a detox centre and that is the best strategy for alcohol and drugs, then I’ll go down that path. Thank you.
I’m tired of the Health Minister defending the Finance Minister’s job. I’m sorry. When will the Minister stop this bunkum message and finally say he’s going to fight at the Financial Management Board table and demand a treatment centre gets built here in the Northwest Territories, whether it’s in Inuvik, whether it’s in Yellowknife or Norman Wells that we get this job done? Thank you.
Thank you. First, it’s existing infrastructure. If we’re going to build a treatment centre, if we’re going to develop a treatment centre, rather, we’re going to use existing infrastructure. There is no plan at this point to put a treatment centre anywhere. Number two, the treatment centre we do have is not used to full capacity. We’re going to try to use that treatment centre to its maximum capacity before we add more treatment centres. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. This Minister is defending his little committees to run around. We’ve studied this problem to death.
What does the Minister of Health and Social Services think that this committee is going to tell him that we don’t have binders, cases and truckloads of paper that is going to be new? So what does he think that’s going to be new delivered by this committee on the need of a treatment centre in the Northwest Territories, as I said, whether it’s in Inuvik, Yellowknife, Hay River or even Norman Wells?
Thank you. It may not be a tremendous departure from what we already know, but we are going to have buy-in, and in order to get buy-in, it’s a way to move forward on this issue. If the communities come up with a solution themselves, they’re going to be committed to making sure that the solutions that they’re recommending to this forum will work. That’s what we’re trying to do. We’re trying to consult with the people, get the people to tell us what they think the issues are. Yes, we may have done a bunch of reports, I don’t know of a bunch of reports being done sitting on the shelves and things like that, I know there’s been some health reports done, but the thing is, I don’t think individuals have gone to the communities and documented what the communities want to do in order to address this issue. That’s what I’m trying to do. I’m trying to get the communities to tell us. It’s been long enough that this government and other governments have always told the communities this is the way we’re going to address your issue. So it’s time for them to tell us how they want their issue addressed. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Menicoche.
Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. I just want to follow up on the need for a professional treatment centre here in the Northwest Territories, and I’m with my colleagues, I think that’s one of the things that we have been hearing from our constituents as well. I don’t know why the Minister has to hear it again.
So I’d like to ask the Minister what kind of strategy or plan does he have for giving us a modern addictions treatment facility that includes detoxification. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. No plan at this time to do that, because we think the communities may say something different. Initially, although I haven’t visited all 33 communities – I have visited 12 communities in my role as Health and Social Services Minister – initially that’s not what they’re saying. Initially what the people are saying, the elders want to go on the land with the people, with the youth and they think that’s going to address their issue. The communities where the greatest impact exists, communities where there’s low employment, tremendous social impacts in the communities from alcohol, a high percentage of issues in the community is a result of addictions. They’re the ones that are saying we don’t necessarily want to travel somewhere else for treatment. We want to heal on the land with our own people.
So there may be no plan to build a treatment centre, no plans of building an addictions centre, we don’t know. There may be a plan that comes out of Yellowknife that says that is what is needed to address the issues here, but that may not be something that the small communities want. Thank you.
Thank you. He spoke for about five minutes, but I think he said no.
I’d like to ask the Minister, is a treatment centre for the Northwest Territories even on the 20-year capital plan, the capital needs assessment. Thank you very much.
Thank you. We have one not only on the books, it actually exists. But is there a plan for another treatment facility on the books? There isn’t. There is no plan at this time within the 20-year assessment of our capital needs for a treatment centre. Thank you.
Thank you very much. I think that it doesn’t commit us to just put it on the capital plan. Is the Minister willing to do that? Because it is a need, it’s going to be a future need because we need a good modern treatment facility that includes detoxification. Making people wait 30 days, as one of the Members spoke about earlier, it’s just not doing it, because the need is immediate when you want treatment from addictions and someone that is suffering cannot wait 30 days.
With a modern facility, I’d like to ask the Minister, is he willing to at least discuss it with his Cabinet colleagues and put it on the 20-year needs assessment. Thank you.
Yes, I am willing to discuss the possibility of a treatment centre with my Cabinet colleagues. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Menicoche.
Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Now is the Minister willing to move the capital plan up? Thank you.
---Laughter
Again, it’s not my decision whether or not that thing goes into the capital plan. It’s a joint decision by this side of the House and that side of the House. If I get it into a 20-year assessment, then the next step is up to this House.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Inuvik Boot Lake, Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I really don’t know where to begin with this. Obviously, you know where my questions are going. The Minister stated earlier that he doesn’t feel that there’s no better use for the $300,000 for these discussion forums that are going on. I beg to differ, and I’m very concerned, and I do disagree, and I’m sure there are a lot of people in the medical field and justice system that would also be concerned with this attitude, as the Minister of Health and Social Services, that he feels that money cannot be better spent other than talking about what we already know is a problem.
My question for the Minister of Health and Social Services is in terms of detox, because we do need it in the Northwest Territories. Can the Minister of Health and Social Services confirm how many hospital beds are specifically designated for medical detox in the Northwest Territories?
Thank you, Mr. Moses. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I can confirm that no beds are specifically designated for detox at any hospital in the Northwest Territories.
As I said, he stated earlier that he didn’t feel the money could not be better spent other than talking about what we already know is a concern. With $300,000 we could hire a couple more nurses and designate some beds in the hospitals in Yellowknife and Inuvik or Norman Wells or Hay River for the people who need it. That’s where I’m trying to get the question. It’s very disheartening to sit on this side and listen to the Minister of Health make those comments and let us know that there are no detox beds in the Northwest Territories that he can confirm.
My second question is in terms of the policy for the amount of days that a person needs to be sober to access treatment either here in the Northwest Territories or when we have to send them down south, which I totally disagree with as well. What is the policy for the GNWT for the amount of days somebody needs to be sober to access treatment that they need that we’re making it difficult for them to access?
The policy on the length of time individuals wait is client specific. So it would depend on the counsellor availability, the number of clients waiting, the client’s need, and when the next bed in the treatment facility is available. There are a few factors. Any resident that has a crisis, that is in immediate risk, can actually get in to see a counsellor and the counsellor may be able to get that individual out to a treatment centre or detox centre or designate a bed in a hospital for an individual in an emergency type of situation where we felt there was some immediate risk.
I really enjoy when the Minister speaks about addictions and gives us his point of view on things. He said immediate risk. We’re not always dealing with people who have immediate risk and, actually, as we know, in mental health workers, we are short on that and there’s a big waiting list in that sense as well.
The coroner’s report specifies that 49 percent of alcohol-related deaths are suicides. So there is a great correlation here. Until they have to be in immediate risk, then will we help them? No. That doesn’t make sense.
What is the Minister doing to ensure that we do have the medical health counsellors in place in the communities where there is a big backlog right now? What is his plan to get that addressed?
We are in constant communication with the health authorities across the health and social services. We recognize that we have vacancies across the board in every area. We have 27 percent vacancy in social workers, 16 percent vacancy for nurses. Those are two of the numbers that I know off the top of my head. There are vacant positions recognizing mental health counsellors and wellness counsellors and so on.
We wish there were no vacancies, but we go out and try to fill the vacancies working with the authorities. We do put pressure on the authorities to be able to fill the positions. There are always other factors. Housing is generally a factor. Sometimes there’s nothing available on the market for individuals when they need to relocate a social worker. We sometimes use locums to address the issues from nearby regional centres, but aside from that, I guess we’re just doing the regular thing and trying to fill positions, put out advertisements, and going through that process.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final supplementary, Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I just want to make reference to what the Minister said earlier, as well, that we need to get communities committed. Does the Minister not think these communities are committed after listening to the coroner’s report that alcohol-related deaths are at 49 percent, suicides are at 50 percent, accidental deaths are at 76 percent, or homicides? Those stats would make my community committed to getting detox and treatment centres in the communities even more.
Specifically to treatment programs, I would like to ask the Minister of Health what specific programs are not offered in the Northwest Territories that we do have to send our residents to southern treatment centres where they actually have to come back with a supp to top up the dollars. What specific programs are we not offering in the Northwest Territories that we should be addressing right now?
It’s nothing specific. In the cases where individuals are going to treatment and apply for treatment down south, or there’s a recommendation from the authority through the community counselling for an individual to go for treatment down south is usually because of the complex nature of the individual’s addictions. Sometimes addictions and mental health are very, very closely associated. I think 40, I hate to mention the percentage, but I think over half of the individuals that go for counselling for addictions also had mental health issues.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think there are many important questions being raised today, and I think we would all benefit from further discussion, certainly, on a new treatment centre versus programs being put in place and, of course, why a 30-day period of sobriety is required before treatment.
My statement today dealt with the impact of substance abuse on early childhood development. As I pointed out, community-based early childhood development programs, pre- and postnatal programs, parenting workshops, mother and tot programs also provide a contact point for parents who may need to seek help with their addiction problems.
Can the Minister tell me whether, as we work towards completing the Early Childhood Development Framework, the opportunity for parents to raise their issues of addictions and seek help will be given a place in design of that programming?
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The honourable Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
One of the key pieces of the early childhood development work that we’re doing is supporting healthy families in the communities. We consider that to be a very successful program. There are large groups in the communities for healthy families where there are mothers in there at a prenatal stage, right to children under one. There are those types of programs and there are other programs that are in these healthy families for two, three, and four-year-old children with their mothers in a program. A lot of that is our work in the early childhood development, is that we are looking at healthy families as a way to help combat this issue of Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder.
Thanks to the Minister for those comments. The Minister’s department is now embarking on the consultations and fact-finding of the new addictions forum. This forum should examine not just individuals’ needs but families’ needs, as well, I assume.
Can the Minister tell me whether the terms of reference for the new addictions forum include an examination of how better to use the health and social services system as a whole to make contact with those in need of treatment and programming in the area of addictions?
The terms of reference for the addictions forum will be to get the information, gather the information and the recommendations. Their recommendations are going to be to ourselves and will consist of this is what the issue is and the community thinks this is the way it should be addressed. Our responsibility at Health and Social Services would then be to apply our authorities’ and our department’s work to what the recommendations are. It’s going to be at that point where those health programs and what the recommendations from the addictions forum will meet. It’s not specifically in the mandate of the addictions forum.
Again, I’m pointing out opportunities here and I just hope the Minister and his staff will take advantage of them.
The Minister of Health has announced that the community family resource centres will begin to be introduced as the local seat of early childhood development programming. Because healthy families are essential to healthy children and their development, will the Minister say how the development of this delivery model will facilitate the intake of parents into addictions treatment where needed?
The healthy families is not really linked into the addictions treatment. We could talk about Fetal Alcohol Spectrum Disorder within these groups where we’re trying to build awareness of the issue and the cost of the issue, as the Member indicated, many of those factors. For the mothers to segue from healthy families into treatment centres, I don’t think is something that is part of that mandate of the healthy families or the community children resource centres.
