Thank you, Mr. Speaker. In follow-up to my Member’s statement today, and actually I just want to make a little reference to the Minister of Justice, the Minister that’s responsible for the Anti-Poverty Strategy. He mentions every one of the Ministers on Cabinet and what they’re doing to help address the Anti-Poverty Strategy. That is great because, really, we all have a part to play in this very serious issue when it comes to the high rates of our Aboriginal people in the corrections and jail systems. I do believe that this government is taking a very proactive step, and taking the right steps moving forward here over the last 16 months that we’ve been working together.
First of all, I have my first question for the Minister of Justice. When an individual becomes incarcerated and he goes to a correction facility, what types of treatment programs, mental health and addiction treatment programs, do the inmates have access to in all of our corrections that we have in the Northwest Territories? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you, Mr. Moses. The honourable Minister of Justice, Mr. Abernethy.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As every inmate comes into the facility, whether they are Aboriginal or not, they have their own case manager who will help develop a tailored plan to specifically meet their needs and identify what programs are appropriate based on their sentence and direction given by the courts. We do have psychologists on staff. We do have drug and alcohol programs and we have access to AA and other programs that are available that would suit the specific needs of individual inmates. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you. All these very great programs that are allowed into the jail systems, we almost have better services in the jails than we do in our communities, which is very unfortunate.
With these treatment programs, are they mandatory to take these programs or are they on a voluntary basis for the inmates? Thank you
Interesting question. It depends in some cases on the sentence that’s been passed down by the judge whether an inmate takes a specific program or not. But regardless, we have a large number of programs that are available to individuals as they so choose. Our case managers will work with the individual inmates to identify, as I’ve indicated previously, what might be appropriate for that particular inmate. We have a significant number of programs. I mentioned a few earlier, but within our facilities we also facilitate visits with elders and elders programming, traditional arts and crafts, pre-treatment healing programs, Dene laws, land programming, sharing in healing circles, sweat lodges, smudges, the Healing Drum Society does a number of things for us, we have alcohol counselling, Narcotics and Alcoholics Anonymous, we have reintegration programs that we deal with individuals on as they go through into probation or release into communities. So there’s a large number of things. Some of it’s directed, some of it’s up to the inmates and we work with our case managers to direct them. Thank you.
Thank you. I want to ask the Minister, does he see trends in terms of high incarcerations during the season or over the year. Is there any specific time where we see a higher increase of individuals being incarcerated in our northern jails any time of the year? Thank you.
Thank you. Anecdotally, I’ve heard that there is, and in my previous career that’s been suggested. It was usually suggested that we’d see higher incarceration numbers over the winter months, but we’re not actually finding that to be the case. We are at some of our lowest incarceration rates in our correctional facilities than we’ve been at in years. Over Christmas we were down to 121 adults where our capacity is 248. We’re less than half. Today we’re at 177 adults in our facilities with a capacity of 248. So right now we are at some of the lowest numbers we’ve seen in many, many years. So those anecdotal trends do not seem to be playing out as they have in the past. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. Final, short supplementary, Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. With a lot of the crimes that we see in the Northwest Territories related to alcohol and drug offenses, would the Minister be looking at possibly developing a policy for our correctional facilities, that anyone that goes in on an alcohol or drug-related offense, that they have to take mandatory alcohol and drug treatment programs during their incarceration to help them heal and to help them get the rehabilitation that they need? Would he look at creating a policy and is there any policy in any other jurisdictions in the correctional facilities? Thank you.
Thank you. I’ll have the department look to see if there’s any mandatory programming in other jurisdictions, but at the end of the day, making a program mandatory does not mean it will be successful. As individuals are suffering with addictions and other issues, they have to be ready for the healing journey, and if you force them to take it, you’re not going to get positive results. We make the programming available, we have really high calibre, high quality case managers who can work with the inmates when they come into the facilities to help them prepare for a healing journey and make the programming available to them. We’ve got the programming available.
In the last budget round, Members of the Legislative Assembly worked with us to put more money into programming in the Hay River facility. So we’ve got a lot of really good programming. Yes, of course, we can always try to enhance the programming and make it more effective, but I’m not convinced that making it mandatory is going to give us results if the people aren’t ready to utilize the program and if they’re not ready to take the healing journey, forcing them into a program that they’re not interested in being will not prove results. People have to take some personal responsibility. We’re there to help them. We’re there to help them into the programming and get the healing that they need. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Abernethy. The Member for Frame Lake, Ms. Bisaro.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My questions are addressed to the Minister of Health and Social Services today and I want to follow up on my statement. I asked some questions in my statement with regard to the Medical Travel Policy and I specifically noted two ministerial statements previously made in this House during oral questions, I believe. Both Ministers categorically stated that patients 65 years and over do get a medical escort when they have to travel outside of their home community. So I’d like to know from the Minister of Health and Social Services whether or not that is a policy currently and, if it is not, when did this change? Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. The Minister of Health and Social Services, Mr. Beaulieu.
Mahsi cho, Mr. Speaker. That is not the policy and, from what I understand, it was never the policy. We have been looking at medical travel, we’ve completed a report on medical travel. We see some issues in medical travel, we’re pulling medical travel from Stanton back into the department, but from what I can see, that has never been the policy. Thank you.
Thanks. I think I thank the Minister for that clarification, I don’t necessarily agree with him, but I have to then ask the Minister when we have two previous Ministers of Health who have stated that 65 years and over patients are allowed a medical escort, what weight does the Minister’s statement made in the House carry? Why did that not translate into a policy change? Thank you.
Thank you. We confirm that two previous Health Ministers had said that anybody over 65 years old would get a medical travel escort. However, the policy does not indicate that. That was never written down. It was said in the House. It’s fairly clear in which case we allow non-medical escorts for patients, but age is not one of the factors. Thank you.
Thanks. To the Minister, these weren’t commitments that were made to individual patients or to a specific situation. These were statements and these were confirmations of a policy change that was meant to apply across the system and it was meant to apply to the policy in general. So I’d like to know from the Minister, he says no, that that policy does not currently allow for age as a factor in escorts. Again, when a Minister makes a commitment in the House, why is it not followed through and the policy amended? Thank you.
Thank you. The Medical Travel Policy is a Cabinet approved policy. So at the end of the day, the policy, when an individual is requesting an escort, the request comes from the physician or the nurse. So a physician of some sort, the patient’s clinician I should say, would make the call and ask for an escort and then medical travel would then apply that request against the current policy. So the reality is the program has just been generally following the policy as set out by Cabinet, essentially. So this is why the commitments were made generally that everybody over the age of 65 years old should get medical travel. I don’t know, but I can say that if we were to follow the policy, that’s not in the policy. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Final, short supplementary, Ms. Bisaro.
Thanks. So I guess what the Minister is telling us is that whatever Ministers say in the House really doesn’t carry any weight. If it contravenes a policy which is already in existence then, oh, don’t listen to the Minister, just make sure that you read the policy and the Minister must be making a mistake. So really, that means that any commitment by a Minister in this House doesn’t mean anything, and I have a serious problem with that. To the Minister of Health and Social Services, knowing what he knows now that there have been two previous commitments to this change in policy, will he incorporate this change into our Medical Travel Policy as it is reviewed?
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. I’ll remind the Members to show a little bit of respect in this House for other Members in regard to the positions they hold. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We think it’s important to make changes to the Medical Travel Policy. We have many issues with the policy. We actually know of cases where individuals that didn’t speak English were sent to Yellowknife or even Edmonton where they said translation could be provided. Clearly, in the Medical Travel Policy it says that a patient would require an escort if they needed translation. We have some issues with the policy on how it is being applied so we want to centralize back into the department. It is essentially done for the whole territory out of Stanton and I think out of Inuvik also. We would have to look at that again and try to develop something that made sense. I don’t think there should, actually, if you just look at it from a common sense perspective, I don’t think there should be a magic number which is 65, that once you hit 65 you all of a sudden need an escort to go about your medical business, whether it be here or down south. I think we should apply something that is reasonable and I don’t really think it should be tied to age.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The honourable Member for Nahendeh, Mr. Menicoche.
Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. Earlier this week Mr. Premier had an opportunity to meet with the new federal Minister Bernard Valcourt. I’d just like to ask the Premier a couple of questions. Firstly, I thought it was important to continue the momentum of NWT Days, especially with the new Minister of Northern Affairs and Northern Development Canada. Can I ask the Premier what topics were discussed at his meeting?
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. The honourable Premier, Mr. McLeod.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We had a very good meeting with the new Minister of Aboriginal Affairs and Northern Development, the Honourable Bernard Valcourt. We talked about quite a number of items. First and foremost, we discussed devolution. We discussed mining opportunities in the Northwest Territories. We discussed oil and gas. We talked about the negotiation of self-government and land claims agreements. We talked about trans-boundary water. We talked about the Dehcho First Nations and the bilateral process that we were both working on to advance on land issues. It was a very worthwhile meeting, and I think we’re going to have a very good working relationship with Minister Valcourt and I think he is going to be a very good Minister who will work with us to advance the priorities of the Northwest Territories.
I’m glad that he raised those issues. I’m just wondering, I think one of the particular files in the Northwest Territories, of course, is working with the Dehcho First Nations. I wonder if the Premier had the opportunity to raise that file as well.
I found Minister Valcourt to be very well briefed on all of the files and he was very knowledgeable about Dehcho First Nations. We discussed some issues that the grand chief had raised and the Minister indicated that his staff would be getting on the file right away.
I’m glad that he did raise those issues. I’m just wondering if there’s any timing for the Minister paying a visit to the Northwest Territories.
Minister Valcourt indicated that although he’d been a federal Minister in previous governments, he’s never had the opportunity to visit the Northwest Territories and that he was going to visit. At the first opportunity he’d be up here in the Northwest Territories.
Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Member for Weledeh, Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I’d like to follow up on my Member’s statement earlier today with questions to the Premier on devolution. I’m wondering, first, if the Premier could explain what process of public consultation and validation we can expect following the eventual signing of the draft final agreement on devolution.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. The honourable Premier, Mr. McLeod.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. We’ve been involved in negotiating devolution in the Northwest Territories for over 40 years. As a matter of fact, every department and program that is now with the Government of the Northwest Territories has been devolved from the Government of Canada. There have been at least 10 programs that have been devolved, that I’m aware of, and I’m pleased to report to the Member that, with this agreement, there will be an unprecedented level of public engagement and consultation.
I’m delighted to hear that and thank the Premier for that. Does the Premier plan to provide an opportunity for this Assembly to debate and vote on the Devolution Agreement and, if not, why not?
We are all elected by the people of the Northwest Territories to do a job and represent our constituents to the best of our ability. By all means we will bring it to this Assembly.
I appreciate getting the full range. I have a good series of yesses going here. How about a plebiscite? Our Elections and Plebiscites Act says that, on the recommendation of the Assembly, the Commissioner can order a plebiscite take place, but that recommendation must come from this House. Will the Premier commit to supporting a plebiscite that will allow meaningful public participation and debate, and a sense of ownership in this historic agreement before signing the final Devolution Agreement?
Perhaps I’ll try to describe what overkill means in the dictionary. We have been negotiating this devolution deal for over 12 years. We have been consulting with the public on a regular basis. I have offered to the Members across that we will be rolling out a communications strategy in the next few years and we will be sharing it with committee. If the committee provides us with feedback we will consider it.
Thank you, Mr. McLeod. Final supplementary, Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Thanks again for the Premier’s commitment there. I think it is very important, indeed, to make sure that our public, as the Premier mentioned, it’s been 40 years and the public has had very little participation. There have been some Aboriginal governments that have been at the table and so on, but I’m talking about the general public. They certainly have not had the participation that we want.
In a democracy, transparency is greatly appreciated. The ability to participate in a decision is greatly appreciated. I think even having this House participate would be great. Does the Premier agree that giving the public a chance to take some ownership in this historic decision by voting through a plebiscite would be a great thing for the public?
I’ve already indicated that the public will have unprecedented opportunities to have public engagement on this deal. I personally don’t believe in running government by referendum or by plebiscite. I would not support that.
Thank you, Mr. McLeod. The honourable Member for Yellowknife Centre, Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I rise with question period and my questions will be directed to the Minister of Justice, similarly as my colleague from Inuvik Boot Lake. In my Member’s statement, and again similar to Mr. Moses, our Member’s statements really talked about how we feel disgusted with the national rates of Aboriginal people. They’re not reflective of what’s considered fair and it certainly is a shocking or glaring reality which must stop. My first question to the Minister of Justice is: In the Northwest Territories we have a number of correctional institutions, would the Minister be able to speak to the percentages of Aboriginal versus non-Aboriginal inmate populations?
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. The honourable Minister of Justice, Mr. Abernethy.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The report that the Members are talking about today is actually a report on federal facilities only. It does not address territorial facilities. Remembering that territorial correctional facilities, as opposed to federal jails, are for Northerners who have been sentenced to two years less a day for different levels of crimes. Aboriginal programming is strong in our territorial facilities and on average, to the Member’s question, the population of Aboriginal individuals in our facilities is about 88 percent of the total count.
Because we’re not allowed to ask the Minister’s opinion if 88 percent is fair, reasonable, or just disgusting, what I will ask is: What work has the Department of Justice done to find out what the root cause of this is and, furthermore, what are they able to do to help bring what one may describe as a reasonable balance in the sense of representation? Because I would say that 88 percent of our population representing the jails being solely Aboriginal people is not reasonable.
