Thank you, Mr. Bromley. For that we’ll go to Mr. Lovely.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Last year when we loaded the budget we had not fully fleshed out how we were going to spend those dollars. This year we’ve reallocated those within the early childhood program so it is not actually a reduction in the Early Childhood Development Framework. It’s just a reallocation from grants and contributions to other expenses.
Thank you, Mr. Lovely. Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. It’s always hard to penetrate the smoke and mirrors, as I’ve said before, but I appreciate that. I’m glad to hear it’s staying within early childhood.
I’d like to follow up on my colleague’s mention of the healthy food for children and youth and just ask the Minister if he’s been aware of this excess of tens of thousands of goose eggs in the Beau-Del and the potential availability of them for consumption by residents, and the geese for that matter. A wildlife management problem where there are excess birds and eggs that we could be taking advantage of. Is he aware of this and would he work with the Minister of ENR to see if this source of food can get into our communities, into our schools? This is an income support thing. I won’t repeat it when we get there but I’ll mention it now. I see this as a real opportunity, a significant food source that happens to be local and extra nutritious.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. Any opportunity that arises, obviously, we like to take advantage of it. We’ve heard about this particular area, whether it be a traditional food that’s available. Again, it would have to be at the discretion of the schools to allow that into their facility. We are, as I stated, working very closely with BDEC, the Beaufort-Delta Education Council, if this is something that they want to explore and have that available to our students. This is just recent news to us, so it is being discussed at BDEC level with my officials. Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I appreciate that and I will look forward to what comes out of that.
My last note is I see we are not really making much adjustment to the arts investment in the grants and contributions. That is just something I really support. I think we have gradually done a better job since the early days of the 16th Assembly, but I think there is more room for achievement here and investment. It has a very well-demonstrated impact on local economies and helping people realize their full potential, obviously, their personal and community identities and cultural aspects. I just raise that as a comment. I would love to see those adjusted, as most of the items are on this page, recognizing increasing costs and so on. I will leave it at that. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. I will treat that last statement as a comment. I will continue on with grants, contributions and transfers. I have Mr. Yakeleya.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I have probably about four major items that I want to talk to the department about.
The first one has to do with the college contribution to the department and the contribution to our small communities. You know that I want to thank the Minister for two things. First, to conducting the needs assessment in the Sahtu region for our students, the number one issue of that needs assessment has to deal with the literacy issue in our region by the younger people. Listening to them on CBC Radio and reading the article in the Globe and Mail, there is a pretty good indication as to how we can overcome our literacy issue in our small communities. The First Nations in Ontario have done some good work, and it also needs to be looked at through our Aurora College contribution.
The other one is to deal with the Sahtu technical institute and the study that has been happening. I look forward to the end of this month. We are on deadline with time frames that should be coming out and going forward into the planning process. Thanks to the Minister for moving that through the various stages of the planning of the Sahtu feasibility study and looking to see if that is something that we could implement in the Sahtu region in the future, because this will help with our Aurora College facilities in our small communities.
The second point I would like to ask the Minister is in regards to the Healthy Children Initiative, healthy food for children and youth. A lot of communities rely on that, especially for the morning breakfast programs. There are kids that take advantage of that and they have very good people working in those programs. I want to ask the Minister, are we the sole providers of that program, the healthy breakfast program in our small communities? I know there was some cause to see how much money these programs are valued at and then we have extra dollars from industry or other organizations to support our programs in the school. I want to ask who our funding partners are, or is this solely a GNWT initiative? If we are, is that enough in regards to healthy foods for our children in our schools?
I want to talk about the school in Colville Lake. I know the Minister is looking at the school and its programming, the programs that are being taught in Colville Lake. There is a school there that is a log building that was constructed in 1991 and there was a modular classroom added in 2006. These buildings are from the days of Little House on the Prairie where you have one classroom and four or five different grades. Teachers are doing their best to educate the children. There are 50-some-odd students, maybe more, in these classrooms.
I have visited Colville Lake several times. I have noted the school atmosphere and the challenge that the teachers have in the buildings. There are several deficiencies noted in these school buildings, such as lacking storage space or there is lots of noise. With kindergarten to grade 4 or 5, there is just… How do you keep the little kindergarten or Grade 1 students quiet? So, there is lots of noise. There are partitions that are separating a Grade 3 and Grade 4 and kindergarten/Grade 1, so it’s not a very conducive learning environment in Colville Lake.
I want to ask the Minister, due to this typical learning environment that Colville Lake has had ever since they had schooling in Colville Lake, the community is really appreciative of the work that has been done; however, they are now asking if the department is willing to consider an idea to have the community be partners in building the new school for them. They have the means; they have the companies; they have the resources. Looking at the department they say, we know you don’t have the money. They always say…[English translation not provided.] They are saying that we have partners, we have companies. Can we build a school for you? According to GNWT specs, can we do this for you? Are you willing to look and sit down with us? Look at a new concept, a new idea. Otherwise we are just putting a bandage on an old issue.
As much as I appreciate the Minister going to battle with us and the department trying to fix the school up, fix it so that it is conducive to an educational environment. It is not doing what we want to do. So the leadership, through an e-mail, is asking if the department will look at a meeting where we can get together and say, is this possible, can we do this, what are our challenges, what are we up against? Can we build it and can the government lease it off us? Build it to their specs. The people in Colville Lake are asking for that and they want to provide the proper place to learn.
I know the department has made trips into the Sahtu. Can the department and staff come to Colville Lake and look at the school environment? Take a visit and say, yes, maybe we should talk. I am asking for that. They want to know if they can do that. They also see that there are other schools that are getting the attention of…other communities are getting the attention of new schools, so I want to ask the Minister these questions. I know this is an O and M budget because this section deals with programs. School programs are very difficult to have in a community like Colville Lake where recently they have been graduating Grade 12 students there, so I want to raise this concern with the Minister. Mahsi, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Mr. Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. When I speak to the college, obviously we work closely with that community’s learning centre so we have them in the communities, most of the communities. Yes, the Member is quite correct about…and we’ve been supportive along the way on the needs assessment in the Sahtu region and it’s going really well. We have all the stakeholders involved, all the parties from the Sahtu region and various industry members. So, there is a lot of discussion and opportunity for us to move forward on this, and obviously this will possibly lead to a Sahtu institutional discussion that the Member is referring to. There is a current feasibility study and there’s a lot of work that needs to be done in this area. We’re interested in how that’s going to pan out. My department is going to be working very closely with the Sahtu region on this particular matter.
Another area, obviously, is literacy. I totally agree with the Member that literacy should be a prime focus in the small, isolated communities, and we are doing that right now. Obviously, we need to do more in this area. So, that will be my push from my department’s perspective.
The Healthy Food Initiative, there are various parties involved in this, various departments. There’s MACA, there’s Health and Social Services. But primarily for schools, we contribute $650,000 towards the schools and they manage the funding. The funding should be going directly to the students for their programming, for their breakfast program. We’ve heard over and over that this is a need, so we are pursuing this now. We’re getting a lot of positive feedback from the community schools that they very much appreciate the money that’s been identified for this, because a lot of our students are going to school on an empty stomach and we don’t want that. So we are doing the best we can to support those students.
The Colville Lake programming that the Member is referring to, we’ve looked at the building, as well, and obviously my department will be very interested in what the community has to offer. It’s not only Colville but there are other communities that also showed interest potentially looking at these opportunities of possibly building and then leasing back. But it is an area that our government has to look at where we’re going against a borrowing limit but how can we best approach it, because we don’t have the capital infrastructure to date to deal with all those communities that want to build, whether it be the college or the schools or health centres in our communities. I’ll be interested in what the community has to offer and bring it back to my Cabinet colleagues and have some discussion on what’s the best approach. So we’re quite open to those ideas as well. Mahsi.
Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Committee, again, we’re on page 66, education and culture, grants, contributions and transfers, total grants and contributions, $209.153 million. Is committee agreed?
Agreed.
Thank you, committee. Committee, page 69, education and culture, active positions, information item. Any questions? Ms. Bisaro.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I have questions here with regards to the increase in positions in the regional offices. I see that it increases from nine to 12 positions. Could I hear what those three positions are, please, and what communities they’re in? Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. Those three positions are two linguists within the Aboriginal Languages Secretariat and one registrar, teacher certification is from headquarters to the Beaufort-Delta and also the South Slave region.
Thank you, Minister Lafferty. Ms. Bisaro.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. That’s good.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Committee, again, page 69, education and culture, active positions, information item. Any questions?
Agreed.
Committee, page 71, income security, operations expenditure summary, $43.424 million. Does committee agree? Ms. Bisaro.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I have a couple of questions here. I’ve been asking the Minister questions about income assistance and trying to highlight some of the inconsistencies that exist with the income assistance/income security division. In his response, as the Minister has talked about possibly making some changes, it’s not been clear to me what sort of changes the Minister is talking about.
I’m advocating for a comprehensive review of all of our income support or income security programs. The Minister has advised that there have been some changes in 2015 already, and I’m not clear on what those changes are. We have an Anti-Poverty Action Plan which is progressing. I know that the Department of Education, Culture and Employment is working with Health and Social Services and other departments on that plan.
I’ve got a number of questions in here, but the changes that have been made, are they tied to the Anti-Poverty Action Plan, and in terms of a comprehensive review of all of income security programs, is that something that the Minister would see to happen in the 2015-16 year?
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. For that we’ll go to Mr. Heide.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I’d like to respond to the Member in saying that the number of changes within the Income Security Program are meant to exactly address the ability of clients and recipients to purchase a healthy, nutritious food basket based on a market basket rate. If I can just explain that, that’s about the true cost of buying a healthy, nutritious, full basket of goods and food for a family in any community. What you see in this budget here is a proposal to increase the food allowance, the clothing allowance and the incidental allowance across the NWT to bring that rate up to the true cost of those goods and services.
Thanks to Mr. Heide. I agree, there have been some good changes, and an increase in allowances and evaluation of the old one and increasing it to make it a reasonably useful amount in the allowance has been a good thing. The other good change that I’ve noted is that some income assistance clients are being evaluated less often, and that’s a very positive step as well. I appreciate that I’ve got a handle on the changes that have been made, but in terms of the programs in general, and in terms of the contradictory nature of some of the policies and programs that exist in income support relative to other departments, is there an appetite on the part of the department or the Minister to look at doing a comprehensive review of income security any time in the near future?
To answer your question very directly, yes, there is an appetite to look at policy conflicts across the government. That work is currently underway under the social envelope deputies and Social Envelope Committee of Cabinet to identify and attempt to resolve some of the conflicts between various departments.
Thanks to Mr. Heide. I appreciate that there’s an appetite. I appreciate that some stuff is being looked at. But apart from conflicting policies, there still needs, in my mind, to be a review of how we provide our income security programs, all of them, whether they are in step with the rest of the country, whether they are serving our clients to the best that we can do. I think there are certainly areas where they are not. Some of them are contradictory polices, but some of them are policies which don’t conflict with anybody else but they’re just probably not up to date, and they’re probably not fair, although the Minister seems to think that everything needs to be fair.
To the question of a comprehensive review of income security programs, yes or no?
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Lafferty first.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. We did a comprehensive review in 2007, and since then we’ve been making changes to our Income Security Program. It’s been eight years now. Obviously, this is an area that we need to seriously look at. As I stated in this House, in 2015 we’re making changes when it comes to subsidy. We’re increasing our overall subsidy programs. It may not be comprehensive to date but this is an area that we need to discuss as a department to move forward. It could be part of the transitional document to have very comprehensive security programming. That should likely take place within the next few months, like, within the transition document.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Ms. Bisaro.
Thanks, Mr. Chair, and thanks to the Minister. It gives me some comfort that at least the department is going to look at it. I have to again say that eight years is a long time and things, particularly these days, change very rapidly. I would encourage the Minister to not wait for the 18th but to start planning now, put the money aside now for a comprehensive review of income security programs. Thank you. That’s a comment not a question.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Encouragement noted. Continuing on with income security, I have Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I know the Minister has heard me speaking in a similar vein by suggesting examination of an alternative model that has not been well used but has a record of success where it was tested and that’s the guaranteed basic income. I appreciate the Minister’s agreement to look at that and perhaps consider something like that for a regional model if the economics worked out. I think right now we are doing not too bad a job of holding people where they’re at, but I don’t think that’s the goal of our government. We want to help them out of poverty and into employment and better health. I appreciate the review and I hope the review really does take a close look at the guaranteed basic income.
I did have a couple of questions. The Minister’s opening comments sounded like there’s 1.7 million new dollars to look at increasing benefits for food, clothing and other incidental expenses, $150,000 for the cost of delivering the Income Assistance program. I mentioned it’s about 20 percent. Yet when I look at the numbers on the page, I don’t see that reflected. I see an increase of $1.3 million, which is substantially less than the $2.25 million of increases that the Minister mentioned. I wonder if I could get some explanation to show me where I’m going wrong with these numbers.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. For that we’ll go to Mr. Lovely.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The amounts that were mentioned in the opening comments are found under fees and payments, and that includes $2.9 million for the increases associated with bringing our market basket measure up and for an increase resulting from inflation, but that’s also offset by a $1.6 million transfer to the Housing Corporation as part of that initiative.
Thank you, Mr. Lovely. Mr. Bromley.
Thank you. That explains it right there. I appreciate that. I support both of those initiatives. Updating our food basket, I know the Minister is aware of my support for that and also this transfer to the Housing Corporation. I understand that the food basket and so on is part of an increase over four years, $6.6 million planned increase, so I appreciate that very much.
Just on the income assistance housing clients being transferred to Housing, this hardly touches the need as far as I can detect from my constituents. Is this sort of a test case and is the department contemplating expanding this programming? I don’t know the degree in other communities, but I know the Minister is aware that our affordability issues have gone up 60 percent over the last five years in Yellowknife and over 1,000 families now with affordability issues in housing. Many of those are income assistance clients that are not being well served through the IA program. Is the department looking at expanding this transfer to Housing which is a specialist in that field?
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. For that we’ll go to Mr. Heide.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. As you have rightly pointed out, we are transferring and doing 75 units across the NWT. The large percentage is in Yellowknife. We hope to move clients over the next few months, with soft hands, hopefully, but at the end of the day we will see if this is a good model, and if it works well, we will continue to work with the Housing Corp to identify new opportunities.
Thank you, Mr. Heide. Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. That is basically all I had. I think I will leave it at that with one last question, Mr. Chair.
Would the Minister commit to telling us, or getting back to us through committee, what the standards are that will dictate whether it was a success or not, whether it is working and how we can expand it if it is? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. I will certainly commit to that. Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Continuing on with income security questions, I have the Member for Sahtu, Mr. Yakeleya.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I would like to ask the Minister, in regards to the Income Security Program for my region, can the Minister provide a breakdown for the last year or two years as to this program? Due to the lack of oil and gas activity this year, we have seen the numbers increase and I would like to get a breakdown. When activity was happening there, oil and gas was booming, people where working, businesses were in operation and people were taking advantage of that, to now where we have a minimum, very little activity and the government is now being the main supporter, funder to our income support programs. What is the government doing at the same time to the recipients of the income support so that they are being a contributor to the North’s economy and society? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Yakeleya. Minister Lafferty.
Mahsi, Mr. Chair. We are seriously looking at the Sahtu region, especially with the downturn of the oil and gas operations in that region and what will be the implications on those community members. Are they going to be accessing income security programming? How many individuals are we talking about? We can definitely give you the detailed breakdown for the last two years and going onwards because we need to monitor this. This is part of our Skills for Success, as well, the needs analysis that we have done, the needs assessment, how can we integrate those individuals to be trained for future projects.
I will get Mr. Dana Heide to elaborate a little bit more. There have been some changes that we have made as well. Mahsi, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Lafferty. Mr. Heide.
