Thank you, Minister. Do we have any further comments or questions on page 302? I see none. I will call the page: informatics, operations expenditure summary, activity total, $7,118.000. Agreed.
Agreed.
We'll move onto Lands, operations. The activity total is on page 305. So we'll discuss the detail beginning on page 306. Comments or questions on page 306, grants, contributions, and transfers. I see none. Continue onto page 307, active positions. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Can the Minister explain that we'll have the reduction of the regional staff here and in his conversations with myself we're going from five to three, what's going to happen with those three positions? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister?
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. I think during business plans we had said that the three positions we were hoping to turn them into training positions in Yellowknife and give those out in the region an opportunity to move here for a couple years, take the training and then go back to their home community. I'm not sure what the uptake is on that right now, but if we have to put it out for competition, our goal is to put it out to competition as part of the requirement, the hiring requirement. It would be understood that they move out to the region after they've completed a couple years here in the capital and then we'll utilize their knowledge out in the region. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for his answer. It actually helps, but again it really hurts if we're losing a position in the region which I struggle with. I understand what you're trying to do. I guess my other big issue though is we have five, we're going to reduce it to three, how are we going to be able to pick which region gets these positions or is the department looking after a time to phase into the other two regions? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. We actually had two of the positions were vacant and we had three that were filled, so we determined that we would use those three positions that were filled, move them here. I think, at the end of the day, our goal would be to have all five regions staffed and with folks that we'll have them trained up to do a lot of the work that's required. Because my understanding is that a lot of the work now is just being forwarded to headquarters. So, if we can get them trained up and then build up their capacity, that they can go back to the region and possibly build up the capacity in the region. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I think the Minister for the answer. I'm hoping at some point in time all five positions will be out there and filled in the regions. Has the department looked at I know they have done a really good job with RO1s, the resource officers ones, and they've done a really good job with that.
Has the department looked at the potential of doing land officer one, where we can start with the local people to train, on the job training and stuff like that, and use MACA courses out there to be part of the dealing with this huge demands on lands issues? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, the RMO1s were wellreceived, and we have them all filled. They're all filled with local people. I think three of the five or four of the five are female. We've had very good interest in that, actually. If there are, as part of the HR plan, you know, if there's further opportunities to offer training positions in the regions, then that's something that we'll take into consideration. We want to be able to build up the capacity in the region because who knows the region better than the folks that live there, right. We would like to try to build the capacity there. It's probably an initiative that we have to look at, going forward, and see if we can fit it into our fiscal situation. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for the wellthoughtout answer. I'm looking forward to, with fiscal restraints and the challenges we face out there, that we can work with you or your department in getting these positions filled. Because I know two of those young ladies and, yes, they're very capable individuals, that do the job. So I'm hoping that will be something that we look at in the future business plans.
I don't know if this is the area, but a lot of the issues in regards to land leases and that, is this the area where I need to ask those questions? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister.
Land leases would be the call of the Chair. If he allows the Member to ask the questions on any particular page, then I will attempt to answer them. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. I'd like to solicit the Minister's advice on what would be the appropriate section.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. My apologies. This would be the right area, if the Member wishes to ask his questions here.
Thank you, Minister. Since we're on page 307, active positions, this might be more appropriate to discuss once we get to the operations expenditure summary. So do I have any further comments or questions on active positions, page 307? Seeing none, we'll move back to operations expenditure summary on page 305 and allow Mr. Thompson to continue his line of questioning.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for his indulgence with me in this. In regards to land, commissioner's land and that, in the smaller communities, there seems to be some real struggles about who owns what or what the process is. Is the Minister and the department willing to work with the smaller communities and come up with a plan that will allow elders' lots and that to be paid by the band instead of having individual? Because, right now, the struggle is, what I'm hearing in the smaller communities is, elders cannot afford to pay for the leases and that, and the bands have asked me to ask the question. Is it something that they can work out that the band actually pays for seven people's lots through this process? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I'm trying to understand the question. I mean, if the band wants to pay for the leases, then that would be the call of the bands. So I'm not sure I mean, we can work with them, as long as somebody's paying the lease. I mean, they have a lease. Right? As long as somebody's paying it. If it's the band, then it will be them. If it's a question of the ownership of the land, then that's something we need to have a discussion about with the communities. Because, in some of the communities, there's some band land there that we don't have much jurisdiction over, my understanding. But, no, we can work with them, and if the Member has any specific issues, I mean, we can always have that discussion on the side and we can follow up and work with his communities to see how. At the end of the day, as long as the leases are being paid. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for the willingness to work with. I do have small communities which is not territory land, it's Commissioner's land. It's about elders, and, you know, all of a sudden, they're getting these lease things or lease agreements coming to them saying you've got to do a lease. They're going, well, we've never had to do it before. And then there's demand for payment on these lands, so, for the leases. So they're trying to be lawabiding citizens, but they can't afford it. So I've had some bands ask me: is there some way we can work out? I thank the Minister for his commitment on that. So I will work with the Minister on that later on.
The other question, the next question, I have is just in regards to the big challenges that we're facing out there in equity leases and that. I know that you've made a commitment to have your staff talk to people out there. There are more challenges after we've had our conversation in the House. More people have come forth. So is there something that the department can look at after, you know, the 10 per cent after 10 years and it's a hundred per cent that it's a dollar a year until land claims are settled or whatever? Is that a potential that the department can look at so that we don't face these challenges later on? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. I just want to remind all the Members to confine your questions to this budget as much as possible and leave policy discussions for a question period, Members' statements, et cetera. I'll allow the Minister to respond. Minister McLeod.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. The quick answer is we're looking at modernizing our policy so there will be an opportunity to have that discussion at the time. Mr. Chair, before I say thank you, Mr. Chair, I just want to recognize, up in the gallery, Mr. Willard Hagen, who will be the deputy minister of Lands. He's taking in our proceedings, and he will be sitting at the witness table with me next year, this Assembly willing.
Thank you, Minister. We look forward to that. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chair, and I apologize for going on there, but I had to get it on the floor, and, if I didn't, I would have to deal with it when I get back home, so I thank the Minister for his answers. I have no other questions for this page. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I, too, have to get some clarification in this area. I just want to ask the Minister if there is still such lots that have band lot status in the communities?
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Minister.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I'm aware of a few communities that still have band lots. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I'm wondering if the Minister could advise me as to the status of land set aside for Indian housing. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Minister.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm not sure about that. My understanding was the band land was used for a lot of housing that went up. My understanding is the Housing Corporation had some units on some band land and there was a question as to the ownership of the land, and those units were then they weren't reverted back to the band. I think they wrote most of them off because they were a lot of older units that were actually 1968 Indian housing. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I'd like to ask the Minister on lot rentals and that. Again, I recognize that this is not a line object here, on our budget, but again, same with the previous speaker, a lot of people are wondering about the change and the high cost of renting lots as opposed that will never become ownership or free title land until after the land claim is settled, from my understanding.
I'm wondering why that model is being used, the lot rental model, by this department. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Minister.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, if I could ask the Member if he's speaking of lands within the community that are selected as part of the interim land withdrawal, that the Aboriginal government negotiating the claim is eventually going to get ownership of and we're charging rent in the meantime? If I can just get the Member to clarify that, I'd appreciate it. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you. I didn't want to get too deep into these nonbudget questions. However, for clarification, what I'm discovering is that individuals that were leasing because they don't have ownership of the lots did not attain ownership through a previous process there's no more ownership process now but then ended up on a leased, piece of leased land which has now become a rental land. So individuals are actually renting the piece of land for 10 per cent of the value of the piece of land that they're renting. So it's quite an extreme high cost, and many people can't afford it, so people are just going into arrears very quickly. So that's, I guess, that's for clarification, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, that was as my response to the previous speaker's question, I talked about modernizing our policies, and I'd be more than happy to sit down with committee and get their input into some of the work that we've been doing, give an update on some of the work that we've been doing. That may answer a lot of the questions that they may have. So, I mean, I'll put that offer out there, Mr. Chair. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. I see nothing further from Mr. Beaulieu. Mr. McNeely.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Underneath the resource management unit there, on page 305, and then looking at the language on 304, is there funding within that annual budget there to have an annual review of land tenures, land administration, on an annual basis? Take the Sahtu, for example, would the Sahtu Land Claim Department and other municipalities that have an annual lands administration workshop, if you want to call it that, is there funding within this budget for those types of management systems?
Thank you, Mr. McNeely. Minister McLeod.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, that's just part of our ongoing work with all the inspections that we do after we got the Department of Lands formed in 2014. I would like to see us do a complete inventory of all the different lands that are out there. I'd like to say we're still learning the process, but we've been almost two years now. We'll put something together and make it part of my commitment to Member Beaulieu on giving the committee a briefing. Thank you. It's part of our ongoing work that we do, and we do the inspections and see what, try to catalog as much of the land that we have. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
