Debates of February 2, 2017 (day 46)

Date
February
2
2017
Session
18th Assembly, 2nd Session
Day
46
Members Present
Mr. Beaulieu, Mr. Blake, Hon. Caroline Cochrane, Hon. Jackson Lafferty, Hon. Bob McLeod, Hon. Robert McLeod, Hon. Alfred Moses, Mr. Nadli, Mr. Nakimayak, Mr. McNeely, Mr. O'Reilly, Hon. Wally Schumann, Hon. Louis Sebert, Mr. Simpson, Mr. Testart, Mr. Thompson, Mr. Vanthuyne
Statements

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Currently within two communities, Aklavik and Fort McPherson, we have seven suplus units in Aklavik and we have two surplus units in Fort McPherson. Of those, the two in Aklavik and two in Fort McPherson will be tendered for sale and five units will be up to be demolished.

Looking to the future, what is the Housing Corporation's next steps on this issue?

So it's a really fine balance that we have to do. As the Housing Minister, we have to make some difficult decisions, so we have needs in the communities to build new housing units to replace ones that are not able to be used anymore. We have major renovations in communities that we have to address, and then we have the units that are no longer usable and it's very costly to do the remediation and the disposal of. So it's a fine balance, but we have committed because we know it's an issue. So we committed within this year and the next fiscal year that we're going to actually take out 101 surplus units throughout the Northwest Territories.

Next step, though, in all honesty, is recognizing that we're getting the surveys in. We are expecting to get a lot of really creative ideas, solutions for communities. So in preparation for that we're looking at some ideas. We're looking at perhaps training programs in the communities to help take down some of these units. With that, then, there would be some liabilities, so we're considering the liabilities for that.

We're also considering, and hoping that the surveys will back it up, that some of the units, even though they can't be used or they can't be sold, that there is still material within those homes that can be used by the communities. So we're also looking into the legal liabilities of what we would have to take as ownership as the Government of the Northwest Territories if we were to get the community to take those materials.

So in summary and conclusion, we're waiting for the ideas from the community. We are also doing some prep work to make sure that, if we can use training programs and give the materials to the communities instead of just taking them to the waste sites, that we are covered legally.

I'd like to ask the Minister: will the Minister work with each community, as every community is different? A good example is, in the past in Aklavik, for example, they did take some units apart and gave that material out in the community; but as you know, in Aklavik we have floods and we did get a flood that year and also high winds, so a lot of that material was left around the community, which the hamlet had to clean up.

So would the Minister ensure that each community is consulted with before a decision is made?

The whole purpose of the housing survey is to actually define what the residents of the Northwest Territories want to define within that compilation of results; individual community plans. So it would be disrespectful of myself as a Minister to go forward and try to receive the results from each separate community, working with them to find out their issues and their solutions and then not continue to work with them.

So the short answer is, yes, I am committed to working with each individual community to define what their issues are, what their solutions are and how best to implement their solutions. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Oral questions. Member for Kam Lake.

Question 493-18(2): Territorial Agreement on Federal Health Care Transfers

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have questions for the Premier about the new healthcare funding from Canada. The Premier was very public about his opposition to the deal as was presented by the federal government and a number of weeks later has signed on to the deal and spoke to the great benefits of it. So how did the deal change from when he initially opposed it to when he ultimately accepted it? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Honourable Premier.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The deal that was originally presented was on a take-it-or-leave-it basis; it was significantly less than what we we're getting now. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Could the Honourable Premier give a few more details than just that? The deal that we accepted is still less money than we have enjoyed previously on -- even with the additional mental health funding and homecare funding, it's still less than we would have received under the old agreement, so can the Premier be specific about how we're winning on this deal?

I should ask the Member if he could tell me how much money we're receiving so that -- how he came to that conclusion.

Maybe I'll just tell him, so he'll know that we are spending $445 million on healthcare. We are receiving, on a per capita basis, funding through the Canadian Health Act. Per capita, we are receiving about $40 million, and the federal government offered targeted funding. Over 10 years the percentage increase on the per capita Canadian healthcare funding was 6 per cent, and it was going to drop to 3 per cent. We had a program called THIF which helped with medical travel. It provided for innovation and also for some other benefits which was going to disappear completely.

I am aware that the escalator was decreasing from 6 to 3 per cent, and that was the source of the frustration initially. It does sound like there's some other funding available, and I thank the Premier for making that more clear.

The last thing he mentioned was the THIF, I think, or the acronym for the innovation program that helps with medical travel. The Premier mentioned that it may have been disappearing. I assume that it is not and it is part of this deal. Can the Premier elaborate on that funding? How much is there? Has it increased from its previous level of funding and will it be there to benefit Northerners?

I'm not at liberty to disclose that information; obviously, the Government of Canada is still negotiating with many provinces. The three territories felt that what was offered in a very short period of time for which to respond was sufficient to allow us to accept the deal going forward and felt that as a government, as the three northern territories, we were very diligent in finding ways to become more efficient and effective in delivering our healthcare and consequently we were penalized because we were told, well, you're only spending this much money. I'm not at liberty to disclose the details because the Government of Canada is still under negotiations, and at the appropriate time we'll be able to release that information.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Oral questions. Member for Kam Lake.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker, and thank you to the Premier for that answer. My last question, Mr. Speaker, is the Premier also made public statements to the effect that, if this deal remained at its current levels, there would have to be cuts made to continue to support the healthcare system. The new sources of funding that he has previously addressed in this line of questioning, is that enough to avoid the need for cuts to pay for decreases in the health system? Do we have enough money flowing in that we don't need to make any cuts or adjustments in order to maintain a quality healthcare system in the Northwest Territories? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I think the fact that the majority of our healthcare funding is provided for through a formula financing arrangement will allow us to have enough money so we don't have to resort to program funding.

On the money from the Healthcare Act, which is on a per capita basis, because of the fact that it's reduced, it went from 6 per cent to 3 per cent. Obviously, that will have some implications but, on a per capita basis, the difference is a little over a million dollars. The targeted funding for home care and for mental health is on a per capita basis, and it's close to offsetting the reductions from the Canadian Healthcare Act, but, obviously, depending how much we want to provide for home care and mental health, we may have to supplement that funding. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife North.

Question 49418(2): Construction of the Whati AllSeason Road

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Minister of Transportation. Earlier today I spoke about support for roads within our mandate, and we know that recently we made a joint announcement between the territorial government and the federal government with regard to the allseason road, the Tlicho allseason road. My question to the Minister is: can the Minister provide us, for public record, an update on what the allin cost is going to be for that road, and maybe what the government's responsibility will be for their portion and how we'll finance that portion? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Minister of Transportation.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. The announcement on January 11th from the federal government was a conditional funding for this project from P3 Canada. As this project moves forward, the proposed or the estimated cost is $175 million for this road. However, the procurement for this project is undertaken through a competitive process, and the overall anticipated cost is not being released until the closing of that tender. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Thank you to the Minister for his reply. That leads me, I suppose, into the next question of asking, then: what are the next steps and when can we expect, knowing what's expected for the tender process and the RFQ and RFP process? If the Minister could elaborate on that and, in particular, as it relates to potential schedule or timelines that affect that.

First of all, the project is currently undergoing an environmental assessment by the Mackenzie Valley Environmental Impact Review Board. That was submitted or it was referred to an assessment in, if I remember correctly, end of July of 2016.

As we move forward and it works through that process, the next part of it was that we actually release the request for proposal to get assistance in developing the procurement documents for this project. Moving on from there, the next step will be going out to an RFQ process to see to get qualified bidders who can handle this project, the building of it and the financing of it. From there, we'll move to an RFP process and, from there, hopefully into construction. So I hope that answers the Member's question.

Again, thank you to the Minister for his reply. Mr. Speaker, often when we have to build projects which such technical expertise, we end up having to rely on southern contractors to do this work. Can the Minister tell us what we can expect in terms of assurance for Northern companies' involvement and, maybe even more particularly, the Tlicho companies' involvement in this project?

When we get to the RFQ and the RFP processes, we will be sure we do our due diligence to incorporate as much northern content as possible. It would be my best understanding, I think, that whoever the proponent would be moving forward on this project is going to have some Tlicho involvement. I can't see that not happening. Who knows what's going to happen in the tendering process, but we will do our due diligence to make sure that all Northerners get to benefit from this procurement on this project.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Oral questions. Member for Frame Lake.

Question 49518(2): Environmental Liabilities Associated with the Acquisition of Northern Transportation Company Limited Assets

Merci, Mr. Speaker. Earlier today, over the noon hour, we had the pleasure to hear from the Minister of Industry, Tourism and Investment about the purchase of the NTCL assets in Hay River and elsewhere on the Mackenzie River system. There were lots of issues raised about environmental liabilities, and I'm just wondering if the Minister of Lands could give us a few highlights of what the department is doing with regard to these environmental liabilities with the NTCL assets that we've now acquired? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Minister of Lands.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As we did hear at lunch, of course, these assets have been turned over through the process, the bankruptcy process, from NTCL to our government. Detailed questions might be better addressed to the Minister of Public Works and Services.

The Department of Lands, of course, is regulator of these properties, and there has been a very preliminary inspection of the vessels and certain parcels of land, but there was no environmental testing of soil or land. I understand also that it was noted that there were some untended barges moored off the dock in Tuktoyaktuk which would be the responsibility of the federal government. That has been reported to the federal government, as it is their responsibility.

So there has been some very preliminary examination of these properties. We are, the Department of Lands, of course, the regulator. The operator is the DPW. As to historic responsibility for any environmental liabilities, that is a complex issue which I think my department, perhaps with Justice and Lands, will have to look into. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I'd like to thank the Minister for his response there. Maybe he's going to be wearing a different hat for this one. Can he tell the House whether GNWT has actually contacted the federal government with regard to liabilities on any of these properties?

I don't believe the federal government has been contacted about the specific lands that have been turned over to us from NTCL. As I did mention, there was a report made to the federal government about some barges moored off the dock in Tuktoyaktuk because that is their responsibility. We're still going through the paperwork of the acquisition of these properties, and I don't think we have been in contact with the federal government to discuss any potential longterm liability. Their position is likely to be that they have none in view of the time that has gone by, since NTCL was a federal Crown corporation.

I appreciate the answer from the Minister. Look, I recognize there's a lot of work that's being done on this issue by a number of departments, but if we haven't even actually started to contact the federal government  earlier today at noon we heard that it was the position of our government that there was some federal responsibility here, so what is going on? Is there some federal liability for these lands or not? If there is, can the Minister share with this side of the House, in a legal opinion or whatever, what basis do they believe that there is some federal responsibility?

As we heard in the presentation at lunch, the government is going through a great number of documents that they did receive as part of the bankruptcy proceedings. We'll have to examine those documents to determine whether any responsibility still remains with the federal government.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Oral questions. Member for Frame Lake.

Merci, Mr. Speaker, and I appreciate the response from the Minister. Perhaps while he's looking through those documents, he might think about the devolution agreement, as well. Can the Minister tell the House whether the devolution agreement and the provisions in there pertain to these lands. Would they cover these lands? Because, I guess, through the agreement, we have the ability to go back to the federal government and work out some remediation details. Does the devolution agreement cover any of the NTCL lands? If the Minister can't answer us now, can he get back to us and let us know? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker, this is a complex question. I think we will have to go through the documentation. These lands are not only in Hay River. Those are the ones we often think about when we think about this bankruptcy, but there are Inuvialuit lands and there are lands in Norman Wells. I think we need to go through the documentation before we can give the Member an informed response. Thank you.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Oral questions. Member for Nahendeh.

Question 496-18(2): Junior Kindergarten Implementation Funding

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, today I was asking the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment about junior kindergarten. With the Finance Minister talking about the program being fully funded, can the Minister please clarify in this House, because I have received numerous phone calls from teachers -- this is for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment -- when are we getting the full funding for junior kindergarten? Is it this fiscal year for the budget or is it going to be next year, fiscal budget, or by the end of this term? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Minister of Education, Culture and Employment.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. After the announcement yesterday, staff at the department is going to be contacting all the superintendents of all the boards. Once we get those initial discussions completed, I myself will have a meeting with all the board chairs to look at how we are going to be allocating this additional funding throughout the schools in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.

I appreciate the Minister's answer. I guess my question, though, is: is it going to be funded by the end of this fiscal term or this fiscal year, next fiscal year, or by the end of our term? In the Finance Minister's statement there was $2.7 million by the end of this term. I am just trying to get it clarified because I have had a number of parents and teachers phone going, "Great, we are fully funding junior kindergarten." I am going, "Have to confirm."

Yes, it is great news, and I am glad the Member is getting calls because it has been quite the announcement that we made yesterday. As I mentioned, our department is working with all the superintendents and the education authorities to look at how we are going to be allocating this additional funding. I can't give him a timeline until we have those discussions with the superintendents and then the board chairs.

I thank the Minister for his answer. I understand he has to work with the school boards and the superintendents in that area. My big concern is: are we implementing junior kindergarten next fiscal year for all the schools in the Northwest Territories?

Speaker: SOME HON. MEMBERS

Good question.

As I have said many times in this House, it is going to be implemented in all the schools in the Northwest Territories in the 2017-18 school year, not next fiscal year.

Speaker: MR. SPEAKER

Masi. Oral questions. Member for Nahendeh.

Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I thank the Minister for that clarification. I guess my concern is that, if we are funding this completely, where is this money going to be coming from to implement junior kindergarten? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.