Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I wish to table the following three documents entitled "Government of the Northwest Territories Response to Committee Report 418(2): Report on the Review of the 201415 Public Accounts," "FollowUp Letter for Oral Question 50518(2): PeopleSoft Public Service Human Resource Reports," and "FollowUp Letter for Oral Question 60618(2): Status of Transboundary Water Management Agreements." Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Tabling of documents. Member for Nunakput.
Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to table the Report of the Standing Senate Committee on Aboriginal Peoples entitled "We Can Do Better: Housing in Inuit Nunagut." Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I will now call Committee of the Whole to order. What is the wish of committee? Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, committee wishes to consider Tabled Document 26118(2), Northwest Territories Main Estimates 20172018 with the Department of Environment and Natural Resources. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Does committee agree?
Agreed.
Thank you, committee. We will consider the document after a short break.
SHORT RECESS
I will call the Committee of the Whole back to order. Committee, we agreed to consider Tabled Document 26118(2), Main Estimates 20172018, the Department of Environment and Natural Resources. I will turn to the Minister responsible for any opening comments. Minister McLeod, do you have opening comments?
Yes, I do. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am pleased to present the 20172018 Main Estimates for the Department of Environment and Natural Resources. Overall, the department's estimates propose an increase of $1.2 million over the 20162017 Main Estimates, which is a 1.3 per cent increase.
These estimates continue to support the GNWT's objective of ensuring a strong and sustainable future for the government and its programs while managing expenditures.
The 20172018 Main Estimates include an amortization increase of $2.3 million from the 201718 business plan reviewed by standing committee in September. At the time business plans are reviewed, the 201718 amortization plan had not been calculated. The majority of ENR's increase is a result of the Air Tractor 802A FireBoss Amphibious Water Bomber Fleet coming into service in April.
The 20172018 Main Estimates reflect the department's commitment to fiscally responsible management of its programs. These estimates include:
$2 million to continue implementation of the water stewardship strategy towards the implementation of transboundary water agreements with British Columbia and Alberta, the negotiation of similar agreements with Yukon and Saskatchewan, and the expansion of the hydrometric network.
$1.6 million in operational reductions.
The department’s proposed spending in 201718 continues to support the priorities of the 18th Legislative Assembly. Specific activities in support of these priorities include the following, which are in the base budget:
$5.6 million for wildlife research and management which includes activities related to the barren-ground caribou and management strategies for wood bison, muskox, and moose;
$5.7 million for ENR regional field operations, which includes the development and implementation of a culturally appropriate hunter education program;
$6.3 million to ensure to meet our obligations to support environmental monitoring, research related to cumulative impacts on our ecosystems in settled and unsettled land claims area, and support for Aboriginal communities to participate in the land and resource management processes;
$2.3 million to support the traditional economy and knowledge program that will enhance existing programs and build new partnerships to support healthy and sustainable traditional lifestyles;
$1 million to support conservation planning which includes our commitment to completing Thaidene Nene;
$1 million for climate change initiatives, including finalization of the Northwest Territories Climate Change Framework, which will identify key themes and gaps in mitigation, adaptation, monitoring, research, and public engagement; and
$2 million for the operation of the environmental laboratory.
Environment and Natural Resources will continue to work towards updating and modernizing four acts, the Environmental Protection Act, Environmental Rights Act, Forest Management and Protection Act, Waters Act, and developing new protected areas legislation.
That concludes my opening remarks. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Do you have witnesses you would like to bring to the Chamber?
Yes, I do, Mr. Chair. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. SergeantatArms, please escort the witnesses into the Chamber. Minister, would you please introduce your witnesses to committee.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, with me today to my immediate right I have Dr. Erin Kelly, the assistant deputy minister of Environment and Natural Resources. To my left I have Susan Craig, who is the director of Corporate Services. To my far right, first day on the job, started at 5 a.m. this morning, is Dr. Joe Dragon, who will be our new deputy minister of Environment and Natural Resources, so we'll be having him answer all the questions today.
Thank you, Minister. Welcome to all the witnesses. We will begin with general comments from committee. Just so everyone knows, this department starts on page 55 of the main estimates. Do we have general comments? First, I see Mr. Blake.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. As the Minister and the department may know, I've done a number of statements over the while on the need for funding for a couple of my communities that I represent, Fort McPherson and Tsiigehtchic, with the firebreaks. It's very crucial that we keep these clear of debris and new vegetation that keeps growing. We are fairly lucky that we haven't had a major fire in these areas in the last while here, but it's just a matter of time. It's very important to be prepared, as we learned here in the south. We have been fortunate, no communities have had challenges anyway in the past. As we plan ahead, it's very important that we work with these communities to ensure that we update the firebreaks and ensure that we have funding available.
As I mentioned, Fort McPherson was so close to being approved, but a major fire near Yellowknife took a lot of those resources away that were available at the time. So, hopefully, within the next few months here we could plan to ensure that those communities receive the small amount of funding that's required. I know there is new funding available under other departments, but it is the responsibility of Environment and Natural Resources as well and good to work together. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Blake. Mr. Vanthuyne.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you to my previous colleague's comments; I'll just add a little more to that. Certainly, the committee respects that ENR has a number of major commitments during the life of the 18th Assembly's mandate. It has an ambitious legislative agenda as the government goes forward and implements new responsibilities for land and water management after devolution. Of course, with important initiatives like the Land Use Sustainability Framework and the Water Stewardship Strategy, the department, of course, has led the way in demonstrating collaborative and cooperative policy development process with Aboriginal governments and key stakeholders, and that is well appreciated.
The department is currently also in the midst, as we heard earlier today in a presentation, of preparing a Climate Change Strategic Framework that will help the territory meet its emission targets and, of course, ultimately help Canada meet its commitments with the Paris Agreement. These are no small matters and, of course, require time, expertise, and commiserate resources as we move forward.
We all are aware after many of the Members' statements today in the House that climate change is placing significant pressures on our land, our plants, animals, people, and, of course, as well the infrastructure of varying kinds throughout the North. The technical expertise, monitoring, and research within ENR is an asset to this government and will be an asset going forward with the decision-making that we have to make.
We need to continue to support these efforts, not just in principle but in allocating appropriate resources required to implement effective programs, and, of course, this is going to have dire effects going forward on our budget that's already arguably stressed.
Those are some general comments, Mr. Chair, but I think it is incumbent upon me to also indicate some of the aspects that the committee has shared with the Minister in the past with regard to areas within the department that we have either proposed or shown to the Minister that we are in opposition of a particular reduction or would like to see a certain investment instead. So as we move through today, we're going to hear folks as we get to key activity 2 under corporation management, the committee has shared in the past that we're opposed to the reduction to implement a corporate services model. We have shared our opinion on being opposed to eliminating the communications position. ENR is advancing a suite of environmental legislation that needs policy and communications and we see that that position will be critical in moving forward with that legislation.
Key activity 3, which is the environment; we've expressed opposition to eliminating the environmental protection officer position. This is a position in a small community and instead of removing it completely we would like to look at ways to modify the job description to better fit the immediate needs of the region.
Then, Mr. Chair, in key activity 5 under water resources, the committee has been in opposition to the source water protection. We understand the argument that the program originally funded by this line item has run its course, but water monitoring, baseline information gathering, implementing transboundary agreements are all the things that remain very important, and with climate change putting pressure on our resources we think it's crucial to continue to fund water protection and monitoring initiatives.
Those are just some of the general comments, Mr. Chair, that I wanted to share and just a repeat for the Minister and his staff, in particular new staff, as to some of the positions that we've been maintaining. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Vanthuyne. Next, I have Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to elaborate a little further from my colleague from Yellowknife North and my colleague from Mackenzie Delta. My first concern I would have to say is the reduction of the environmental protection officer in the Deh Cho. This has an impact with our mandate in the development of our work within our smaller communities. This position, from what I understand in talking from the community's standpoint, is important for them to continue to grow, and this is one of the areas that I will have to steadfast ask questions about why it's being reduced.
The second comment is I would have to agree with my colleague from Mackenzie Delta about firebreaks and the importance of them. There seems to be some confusion about who is responsible; is it MACA or is it ENR? This needs to be brought forth, who should the community be working with on that. So I'll be asking some questions in that area. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Next, Mr. McNeely.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I too look forward to going through this department. Like my previous colleagues have mentioned, we have post-devolution activities to modernize the current acts related to that chapter of taking on responsibilities, and I see we have several funding initiatives for several important areas related to my large area, for example, some new equipment there to cover fire suppression and funds for conservation initiatives such as the Thaidene Nene, and in the Good Hope area we have the initiatives under way for the Rampart Wetlands, so that is similar Thaidene Nene, and we also have wildlife management in there. Caribou is a large preservation initiative in my area, so I pretty much feel comfortable that quite a number of these areas are covered with, I think, sufficient resources. There are never enough, but considering the reduction initiatives we are going through, we have to try to manage the best with what we have. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. McNeely. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I just want to touch on the topics I would like to cover during the review of the Environment and Natural Resources budget. I am interested in seeing what type of forest development with working with some forest industry people can be realized by the department and by the Government of the Northwest Territories.
I am interested in where things go with the conservation economy. There is a lot of talk about developing some sort of conservation economy in order to develop or look at possible legislation that may exist in protecting wetlands. I think that is something that is interesting, something that we, as this department, should be pursuing.
I have mentioned, and I think some other colleagues of mine have mentioned, a national Indigenous guardianship program, which is a very good program, again, for development of a conservation economy. That is something that I would like to discuss with this department.
I think that one of the important items in this department is that I just think there isn't enough money or there isn't enough attention paid to the environmental cleanups. I know that in the riding that I represent we have many, many waste sites, contaminated sites, and I think that is something that this department works on, but I would like to see more emphasis put on that.
I like the traditional economy, support for the traditional economy. I think that is excellent.
The whole issue of wildland fires and how we fight those fires, I had asked questions a few times on whether or not we are going to use our own resources. We have enough of our own resources, I think, to fight the fires within the NWT. It is good for our own economy, and I think that is something that is important, and that, before the department deals with the agreement that they have with other jurisdictions, whether it be other jurisdiction across Canada or even the United States, I think we should utilize our resources as much as possible. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I will try to keep my comments on some of the higher levels and some of the issues that maybe some of my colleagues have not covered so far.
Earlier today in the House, there was a lot of discussion around climate change and carbon pricing. This department plays a really crucial role in moving forward on those issues, and I believe they actually have the expertise inhouse to do some work on this. I want to make sure that that stays within the department, but I just don't sense that there is any urgency on these issues with our government. I expect that ENR is going to play a critical role in these areas, particularly with regard to greenhouse gas emissions reductions and that there is some expertise there on carbon pricing, as well.
We have made some good progress on transboundary agreements, but, of late, this seems to have slipped. Earlier, I think it was last week, in the House I talked about this and asked questions of the Minister. We want to make sure that we actually continue with the implementation of those agreements and that the remaining agreements are negotiated in a timely fashion. Those are very important arrangements for people who live downstream, and that was the whole premise of the integrated resource management system that was negotiated as part of the DeneMetis land rights agreements.
One of my colleagues spoke about the cuts to source water protection. We have one department, MACA, that does a lot of work on trying to get communities up to speed and ready to make sure that their residents have safe water. We have another department that is actually cutting funding to protect source water. This is just not consistent, not good.
The one reduction here that is of the biggest concern for me is the loss of four positions at headquarters in the corporate management part of the budget. These are positions that relate to policy, legislation, and communications. Some of them may be vacant, but perhaps they should have been filled because we are already behind schedule on the legislation that this department was supposed to be bringing forward. The Minister talked about these in his opening remarks. This department has a huge amount on its plate in terms of legislative change, policy initiatives (I mentioned climate change) and ongoing programming, like the development of a Bathurst caribou range plan, fire management. Air regulations are now behind schedule. Without that capacity, I just don't see how the department is going to be able to deliver on the commitments that are part of our mandate, part of priorities, and part of the departmental business plan. With those four positions being lost in corporate management here, in Yellowknife, I just don't understand how the department is going to be able to stay on schedule.
I will also have some questions around the status of the Wildlife Act and Regulations this is sort of the second phase of those regulations the expansion of the water quality monitoring network that we partially funded last year, and a few other matters as we go through, but that is it for now. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. Nadli.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just wanted to provide some general comments affecting this department, and I just wanted to highlight some points that I have just noted.
One of them, of course, is my interest in terms of the move from the protected areas initiative towards, kind of, morphing the initiative into another, called conservation area networks. My understanding is that there are some key advances that have been made at the community level in terms of identifying and designating conservation area networks. Communities remain interested in terms of how that will play a part in terms of setting aside some lands throughout the NWT, so I just wanted to make a comment on that.
As colleagues have raised, too, in terms of the legislative initiative, one thing that I was reminded of was the Forest Management Act in terms of it being necessary to be updated, particularly with respect to the nontimber forest products. As we move down the road of looking at forest timber products and alternative energy initiatives in terms of trying to look at more sustainable uses of energy that we have in the NWT, my understanding is that there are legislative initiatives that will be coming forth at some point, so we wait in anticipation for those initiatives.
There are some other points that I wanted to highlight, too. Where I live, close to the Deh Cho, we realize that there are fewer caribou for people to hunt. We have a free herd of bison that live in the Mackenzie Sanctuary. This puts the population, especially the moose we have a special interest in ensuring that the population remains sustainable. There have been pressures, of course, stress on the moose population, as well, so we remain interested in ensuring that there are good management plans in place to ensure there is survivability.
The other note that I wanted to point out is just the land use sustainability framework, the ongoing initiative, and ensuring that it’s based on traditional knowledge that is properly reflective of the Indigenous philosophy in terms of land management and conservation in the NWT. Some other points that I wanted to highlight, too. Again, my colleague raised the idea that the guardianship program which has been very successful across Canada. We need to look at ways of making it work here in the NWT. Those are just some general comments. Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Nadli. I see nothing further from committee. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Just briefly, I think climate change is a crucial issue, not just for us here in the Northwest Territories but for Canada and the world. In fact, perhaps more so for Northerners, we’ve been combatting or struggling with low water levels; increased forest fires; we’ve seen new species entering the Northwest Territories; rising sea levels and coastal erosion; and, of course, our economy is dependent on ice roads which are increasingly seeing degrees of fluctuation, unprecedented degrees of fluctuation.
Thankfully, this department and the government as a whole have placed a high degree of emphasis on gathering the scientific knowledge necessary to make a difference on combating the worst effects of climate change. I think they should be commended for that. The North is and should continue to be a leader on informing Canada’s response to climate change and our government has a very important leadership role to play in that.
That being said, I share my colleague’s, the honourable Member from Frame Lake’s concerns about cutting capacity to address these problems accurately. In a post-devolution context, we now have the tools available to us to be masters of our own domain, to quote a historic phrase, and start to be more proactive in creating our own unique northern solutions.
I hope the department continues to work on these issues and continues to be a leader in climate change and certainly does not underestimate this very important priority for both our residents and people across the country and the world. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Nakimayak.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I don’t have much to say, but I know from the presentation today, and then looking at the estimates, I’m a believer that scientific research and traditional and Indigenous local knowledge should work closely together in tandem to ensure that we get a good map of the condition of the people, the marine mammals, the land-bearing animals, and the fur-bearing animals as well, too, across the territory.
As well, I noticed that the mapping in one of my regions has become quite important to the way that we will start planning for the relocation of some communities. My region, Tuktoyaktuk, is a good example. I think that this year is a good start. I’m going to mention the drone one more time, and I think that’s good, 3D mapping and using different types of cameras. That is a huge step forward for the government to take. I think it’s important to utilize that in places that are sensitive to shoreline erosion as well as permafrost degradation. I just wanted to commend the department for bringing in new ways and also different focuses and approaches to research and how conservation is done in the territory. Thank you, Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Nakimayak. I see nothing further. I will give the Minister ten minutes to respond if he wishes. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I won’t take up too much time here. We’ve heard the concerns of committee and they did mention that they were going to raise these concerns as we go page by page. We’ll look forward to the exchanges we have on each individual page. I will hold my comments until then. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. As always, we will defer consideration of the departmental total until we go through each activity. The first activity we will consider is conservation, assessment, and monitoring, found on pages 62 to 65. This is the first of six activities. Conservation, assessment, and monitoring, pages 62 to 65. I will give committee a moment. When you’re ready, raise your hand indicating that you have comments or questions. Mr. O’ Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I’m looking at page 63, and there’s a reduction in conservation planning from 2016-17 to 2017-18. It’s around $105,000. Can the Minister explain the reduction here? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O’ Reilly. Dr. Kelly.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. What appears to be a reduction is that in 2015-16, we did the engagement for Thaidene Nene, which was included in the costs that you see there in the actuals and there’s been a reduction in the position. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Dr. Kelly. Mr. O’ Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Yes, I can see the reduction as we go down to page 65. There are actually two people being cut, or two positions, I should say, being cut from this function within ENR. Can someone explain what these two positions are and why it’s necessary to cut them? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O’ Reilly. Dr. Kelly.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The conservation areas advisor, there are several in the department, and we feel we can do the work. Others can take on the duties that this position was doing and it was vacant at the time. The second position is an environmental assessment analyst, and the same is true. There are other environmental assessment analysts in the department. With devolution, Lands has become the lead for coordinating environmental assessment, so we feel we can make do without these positions. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Dr. Kelly. Mr. O’ Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I think it’s probably fair for me to say that the Protected Areas Strategy, or what was known as the Protected Areas Strategy, has languished somewhat over the last couple of years. I understood that there was a renewed push to try to complete this network of protected areas. It’s in the mandate for the 18th Assembly and I know that the Minister -- it might have been the previous Minister -- made announcements about renewed effort to try to get this moving again and so on. I know the position was vacant, but how can we, you know, say on one hand we’re interested in trying to reinvigorate this effort while we’re cutting a position? It just doesn’t make any sense. So I probably need to hear from the Minister on this one rather than the staff people. I would appreciate a response. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O’ Reilly. Minister.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. I appreciate the Member’s desire to hear from the Minister directly himself. We have a five-year action plan that we’re working on right now. As we go forward and we find that some of the work that we have to do in future years or within the next budget cycle, I mean, there’s an opportunity to expand on that work, then I suppose we would have to go back and look at bringing the necessary expertise on board. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. O’ Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I just would like to ask a few more questions about the staffing levels within ENR then when it comes to this conservation network initiative. How many other people are working on this initiative within the department? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
