Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions today are for the Minister of Finance, and they are with regard to the Stanton Renewal Project and the partners in the Boreal Health Partnership. Mr. Speaker, the Minister of Finance has stated that the service contract with Carillion Canada is business as usual. However, we know now that subsequently Carillion Canada has sought creditor protection, and this is in effect for 30 days, and its leadership is currently assessing the situation and working with stakeholders to ensure continuity of operations. I want to ask the Minister: is the Minister, since his original statement, still confident that it is business as usual? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Minister of Finance.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as the Member noted, Carillion Canada's financial situation has changed dramatically, and it required CCA protection so that it could stabilize its operation and secure financing to ensure the company remained operational over the long term. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Thank you to the Minister for the reply. I think what I'll do is, because I respect that there are probably other questions coming down later today, I'll then jump to my second question instead of asking for more detail there. What action is the GNWT taking to mitigate the impacts of the potential sale of Carillion Canada and the potential loss of Carillion's considerable expertise both in project and in operations experience? Can the Minister give us the reply to that?
First of all, they are partners in the construction, and the hospital is for the long term. It's the Department of Health that would provide health services, health care in the new Stanton Hospital, so they are partner in the consortium that's building the hospital and the service provider in the long-term care.
We have not entered into any contractual arrangements with Carillion Canada to provide service for the Stanton Hospital. BHP, the Boreal Health Partnership, it is their job to find a replacement service provider in the event Carillion Canada is not able to stabilize its operations.
Thank you to the Minister. Okay, well, I guess then if there's the opportunity that the structure of the partnership might change because of the possible sale of Carillion Canada, which almost seems imminent, I just would like to get clarification from the Minister: does he expect that there would be any delay in planning implementation of the 30-year project agreement?
No. As I previously noted, this was the Boreal Health Partnership's issue to resolve in a timely manner. There are financial incentives for them to do this.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife North.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, given that we know that there might be, and likely will be, a change of one of the players within the partnership, there's still an underlying concern out there as to whether the GNWT will get the opportunity to have any oversight or any input into the possible replacement of this partner. Can the Minister explain? Will we have any input into the possible replacement for the partner of Carillion? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
BHP ultimately remains responsible for the performance of the services, or it will face significant financial penalties. Further, the project agreement requires any replacement service provider entering a service agreement with BHP on same or similar terms as was agreed to by the existing service provider. There are also a number of restrictions on which entities can be selected as a replacement. For example, the GNWT can refuse or accept or replace an entity whose standing or activities are inconsistent with or likely to compromise the reputation or integrity of the GNWT or the delivery of public services in the Northwest Territories.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife Centre.
Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, my questions are on the same topic. There are restrictions on the replacement. I'd like the Minister to elaborate please on what kinds of restrictions would be in place on a replacement partner. Mahsi.
Masi. Minister of Finance.
Well, again, it is BHP's responsibility. However, as I said before, we can refuse or accept and replace an entity. They would have to be able to be in a position to provide the same types of services that we had set out in the original project agreement with the partnership as it stands today. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
So what I understand is that the evaluation of the replacement entity involves their capacity to deliver the service. There is no other criteria. Is that correct?
Well, they would have to be to provide the services. If there is other criteria that's available which I don't have with me at the moment, and I apologize for that, I will endeavour to get it to the Members, but they would have to be able to provide the service and they would also have to meet any existing criteria that's there.
Thank you to the Minister for that commitment. There is a worst-case situation, here. The Department of Finance itself has acknowledged that in its briefing note. So how is the department preparing and planning for the possibility of that worst-case scenario?
Yes, the worst-case scenario, and this is the benefit of a P3 project that all the responsibility is on the partnership. However, in a worst-case scenario, I mean, we would have to ensure that we're able to meet all the conditions and get the hospital completed. I can actually point out that we're having a conference call this afternoon, maybe as we speak, with a potential purchaser for Carillion Canada, and once we find out the details of that, I would be more than happy to share that in a briefing note to Members.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife Centre.
Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the Finance Minister following through with an additional public briefing note. That would be very helpful. I think that we've seen that P3s are inherently risky. In fact, while they are supposed to alleviate the risk on the public purse, they often involve a risk on the public purse. We're paying handsomely to have them absorb that risk, and yet we find ourselves in this position where the 50 per cent partner has gone bankrupt. Is there a lesson in this contract relating to the due diligence of looking at potential partners? It's my understanding that Carillion PLC has been in trouble for at least 18 months. Thank you.
My commitment was to provide a briefing note or an update to committee, and I will do that. As far as the lesson to be learned, I think the lesson to be learned here, as the lesson that we've learned in the past, is that a P3 partnership is a better way to go than having all the responsibility on the Government of the Northwest Territories, as we've seen in some projects in the past. So that would be the lesson. Construction is continuing on, and my understanding is that they're still looking to open in November. A certificate of commencement, I believe, is in November with patient occupation six months after. I think that's how it will work.
We'll continue to provide Members with an update as we move forward. However, we like the P3 approach. I think it does protect the public purse and a lot of the risk is on the proponents, and there are financial incentives for them as well to have the project completed on time. The analysis was done when the original RFP came out. With the information that was provided at the time, they fit well into the criteria, so they were chosen. That was some time ago, but they ran into situations since then. Our challenge now is just to try to mitigate and ensure that our project is completed on time and on budget. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I have questions for the Minister of Health and Social Services on my Member's statement. I would like to ask the Minister if he's willing to work with the Department of Education. I'm understanding that there is a foundational review going on with Aurora, and if he's willing to work with that Minister to create a long-term care nursing school at the current Stanton once the new hospital is online. Thank you.
Masi. Minister of Health and Social Services.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, as we know, moving forward with the 258 beds by 2026, there is going to significant demand for long-term care staff, which does include RNs, but will include more things like residential care aides and other individuals who will be providing support in that hospital. Currently, Aurora College does provide that training. They have delivered that course up in Inuvik, and it was well-attended and the results were fantastic.
I am happy to be working with the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment to explore opportunities to train for what could amount to hundreds of jobs and hundreds of positions and hundreds of people to fill those long-term care positions in the Northwest Territories. I have previously said to the Member for Hay River that long-term care in Hay River could result in as many as 60 new jobs; jobs that don't exist today. It could result in as many as 60 jobs in Inuvik and the Beaufort Delta, easily that many here in Yellowknife, and dozens more in the Sahtu or in the Deh Cho, in Fort Simpson in particular; real jobs for people of the Northwest Territories.
We are committed to finding ways to train. I am looking forward to working with Education, Culture and Employment, as well as Aurora College and Indigenous partners to find some ways to train local people for local work.
I would like to thank the Minister for that response. Can the Minister develop a plan for turning Stanton into a long-term care school? What I am looking for, Mr. Speaker, is just a plan that lays out what is possible, that sort of plan that maybe the Regular Members could see.
The plan at this point in time is to utilize the existing Stanton building for a number of different services, including 72 long-term care beds, a number of extended care beds, some area for outpatient services in areas of OT/PT, as well as a clinic.
When it comes to training local people for local work, Aurora College has been a fantastic provider of both nursing training here in the Northwest Territories as well as training for things like resident care aides. All of those training opportunities require practical or clinical placements, and the Department of Health and Social Services and the territorial authority have been fantastic opportunities for these students to go into frontline services and practice these things. We anticipate that to be the case. There is a lot of work that needs to be done to determine where these clinical placements may occur. It may be possible that clinical placements in places like Hay River and the Beaufort Delta, as well as Norman Wells, when that facility opens, might also be apt opportunities for our local people to get local training and local experience.
I am prepared to explore all possibilities. I am happy to work with committee as we start to formalize what some of that might look like, and I am also happy to be working with Indigenous partners to find some real meaningful solutions to train local people for local work.
I would like to ask the Minister if, at some point, there would likely be a need for some capital to turn the current Stanton into a long-term care and extended care facility. There would be some need for capital. I would like to ask the Minister if they could look towards maybe looking at the capital needs of a school in that facility while they are looking at the capital needs to turn it into a long-term care and extended care facility.
Mr. Speaker, the retrofitting of the old building will be the responsibility of the property manager, bringing it up to a state that we need to meet those needs. There is not necessarily room available in Stanton for a separate school once you actually factor in all the things that we are hoping to put in there, which, as I said, includes 72 long-term care beds, a large number of extended care beds, OT/PT outpatient, as well as clinic services and a kitchen and whatnot to support those services that would be provided in that building.
Currently, when it comes to the nursing program at Aurora College, the nurses actually do spend a significant amount of time in the facilities that exist on a preceptorship or mentorship basis. That will continue and will not require additional infrastructure should long-term care support and training be offered by Aurora College. I think there is lots of room for those clinical placements and for those opportunities for Northerners to gain northern experience and opportunity so that they could go back to the jobs that will exist in the Northwest Territories once long-term care rolls outs.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I have questions to the Minister about working with Education, looking at developing a plan, and looking at the capital needs of that facility. I would like to ask the Minister if he is prepared to create a working group headed by a senior official of his department to work with other departments to turn that facility into a school, if that is as possible, and to ensure that that project is kept on the front burner. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
We are going to be utilizing that building for long-term care, extended care, as well as outpatient services, as I have previously indicated. There is no plan at this point to turn it into a university or a college, but we do accept, and I agree with the Member that there is a great opportunity to do some on-site training for individuals in partnership with something like Aurora College or some of our Indigenous partners who might want to pursue training.
The training will likely occur there, but it should also occur in places like the Beaufort Delta and in Hay River and Simpson, and places where we will need some of our individuals. Clinical placements will happen where the beds exist, which includes Yellowknife.
I am prepared to work with Education, Culture and Employment. We need to. We need work with our Indigenous partners. We have a little bit of time to figure out how we are going to do this. We know that we are going to have to train significant numbers of people in this territory, and we are prepared to work with whoever we need to to get this done, to get it done right, to train local people for local work. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Kam Lake.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, one of the pillars of reconciliation is the drawdown of powers from governments in Canada to Indigenous self-governments, and that is, of course, a component of the work of reconciliation here in the Northwest Territories. Yet it seems that there is some resistance from this government to a true nation-to-nation relationship as it relates to GNWT funding authority and programs and services.
I would like to ask the Premier: what specific programs, services, and authorities is this government planning on negotiating in self-government drawdowns? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. The Honourable Premier.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I am not sure where the federal MLA is getting his information from, but most of it seems to be manufactured by the media, and I don't see any areas where we have a problem with reconciliation. If anything, we are the leading edge of negotiations of self-government in Canada.
We have 15 negotiating tables, and we have negotiated self-government agreements with the Tlicho and the Deline, and those have been negotiated with the involvement of the federal Government of Canada, the Government of the Northwest Territories, and the Aboriginal government. I think what the Member is referring to is the 10 principles that were released by the working group of federal ministers, which included one principle which said they were going to revisit the fiscal relationships for the delivery of programs and services to Aboriginal people.
We had intergovernmental council. We had a very fulsome discussion. The chair of the Standing Committee of Priorities and Planning was there. I was privy to all of the discussions, and we are all working together to provide for incremental funding, working with the federal government to try to advance that, so that it works in the best interests of Aboriginal governments. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Perhaps I will clarify my sources. They come from the Indigenous governments themselves who responded to the Premier's claims in the red alert; so it is not largely words from Ottawa. It is words from the people of the Northwest Territories. The Dene Nation, for example, passed a resolution calling on direct funding for programs and services to Indigenous governments in the Northwest Territories. Does the Premier support that resolution?
We work with the Aboriginal governments that have Aboriginal land claims and are negotiating land claims at the land claims table. The Dene Nation, I guess, have been operating at a different level, and we still don't know if the federal government's intentions are to take all the money for delivery of programs and services and deliver to AFN, who will then deliver to the Dene Nation for delivery of programs and services. We have been trying to get that response from the federal government, and we have not been able to get a clear answer.
I didn't get a clear answer from the Premier, there. I'm looking to see, you know, if the future of the Northwest Territories is going to be a complex one with many different levels of government and many different responsibilities. How is this government ensuring that we have an equity of service provision across the territory with the negotiation of these self-government agreements? It's important that Northerners can expect the same high-quality service from every level of government regardless of whether it's federal, territorial, or Indigenous. So what are we doing to ensure that our Indigenous partners have this support and the funding they need to deliver this?
We work with every government, national government, especially ones that sign on to devolution. We have memoranda of understanding. We meet on a regular, formal government-to-government basis on a negotiation of self-government, on the delivery of programs and services. We have negotiated core operating principles. Not all Aboriginal governments want to sit at the table, but for the ones that are prepared to negotiate tri-laterally, we ensure that we have a consistency of service and we recognize through modelling that one of the problems with self-government or land claims is they're not fully funded. That was one of the basic tenets of reconciliation, that the federal government has said that they will work to fulfill those areas where they should be fully funded.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Kam Lake.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate the Premier providing clarity on this. It seems like this current federal government is taking a very proactive approach in reconciling with Indigenous governments in Canada and Indigenous nations in Canada. Would the Premier agree with that assessment? Because it sounds like all the funding for self-government in the Northwest Territories is coming from Ottawa regardless of all the top-ups of funding that we need to ensure equity of service. Would he agree that the federal government is fulfilling its mandate towards reconciliation? Thank you.
Reconciliation, we fully support it, but talk is just talk. I guess the proof will be when the money starts flowing. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Sahtu.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. My question today is for the Minister of DOI to better understand the MTS 2017 sailing season. My first question is: how many tugboats did MTS deploy and what were the volumes of fuel and cargo hauled? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Minister of Infrastructure.
