Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. For clarity, this is page 51, the contribution to Aurora College, $32,421,000, and the reason I asked the question on the detail of how we are spending that money is this essentially accounts for the vast majority of our postsecondary education money. It is a significant investment, and we need to make sure it is being spent right. I appreciate that, many of these comments, the Minister will say have to wait until the completion of the foundational review, but, again, we are seeing the same appropriation being proposed for Aurora College for this budget.
It does not appear to me that we are making any changes again this year, and this is after three years where this has been raised as a concern. I know the foundational review is happening, but, you know, as to my colleague's point, my honourable friend from Yellowknife Centre, decisions are being made about how this money is being spent by the government. Programs have been shuttered, the two important programs to be shuttered, and the Minister has been reluctant to consider alternative approaches to how the department delivers on this appropriation. I think that is a concern to the public, and it is certainly a concern to me.
I will just ask: if the foundational review sets the college on a new course that requires additional appropriation or an adjustment to this appropriation, how does the department plan to address that? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. In answer to that question, we will probably go through the business planning process. I think we are all eager, as you can hear today, to get that foundational review completed, look at that report, and then have the management response completed. For that, if there are any appropriations that are needed, we have to go through the business planning process that we do on a yearly basis. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Testart.
I know that the appropriation line for Aurora College is reduced this year. What is the cause for that reduction? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am trying to find where the reduction is, what number the Member is referring to.
Mr. Testart, can I request your restatement of the question? Thank you.
Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am not sure what the issue is. I am talking about the Aurora College line item, $32,421,000, and there is a difference between the 20172018 revised estimates and what is currently being proposed in the 20182019 estimates. Can the Minister or the department answer why there is a decrease from $32,655,000 to the current appropriation that is being proposed, of $32,421,000? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Lovely.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. So, last year, if you recall, during the budget session the department put forward a number of reductions for Aurora College. Those were added back in through a supplementary appropriation, and, as you can see, the 20172018 Main Estimates goes from $31,986,000 to the 20172018 revised estimates of $32,655,000. The full amount of the reduction over the twoyear period that that was to take place was added back in in the 20172018 supplementary appropriation, and, when you move to the 20182019 Main Estimates, there is another offset of the second year of reduction. It is certainly a bit confusing to understand how this budget has been adjusted. It was largely a result of the process for reinstating the funding. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Lovely. Mr. Testart, one more question in the spirit of time.
Thank you for allowing me one more question, Mr. Chair. So, I understand that there is a confusing process around the reinstatements, but there is still less being proposed now, so what does that represent? What are the reductions in this year's proposal? I note it is around $300,000 that is being reduced, so what is that $300,000? Where is that coming from? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Lovely.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. So, in 20172018, we had year one of the social work and the Teacher Education Program reduction. In 20182019, we had year two. The funding for the entire amount of that appropriation was reinstated in 20172018, so you are going to see a natural decrease in that, as well. We also have a sunset for a position resulting from the Sahtu Norman Wells oil and gas, a sunset associated with that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Lovely. Any further questions? Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. My questions are in regards to Aurora College. We talked about the foundational review and program review. Can the Minister advise, if the two reports have different directions, which report will trump the other report? If the foundational review says we are going this way and the program review says we are going this way, which report will trump the other one? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. They are two different things. The Aurora College decided to do a review of the Social Work Program. They went ahead and are doing that right now. Our foundational review is looking at so many other different things; accountability, governance, structure, operations. They are two different reviews, Mr. Chair. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. When I was interviewed, part of the interview process was about the Social Work Program and the Teacher Education Program. Through the foundational review, one of the questions was in regards to that.
I guess I am a little concerned. The foundational review has this broad picture, and then the program review has a narrow picture. Is the Minister saying that the foundational review is the one that we are going to move forward with, or is it just saying that the foundational review will not be used when it comes to the social work and the TEP program? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I think we are getting a little ahead of the game here. The foundational review, as I mentioned, is coming near to completion. There are going to be recommendations that come out of that foundational review. We are going to develop a management response and move on from there in terms of looking at those recommendations, but cannot make any commitments or decisions at this time until we see the results of that review. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for that answer. In regard to program reviews, when was the last time the Social Work Program was reviewed? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. That level of detail I will have to get from the Aurora College. They do review their own programs, so I will have to get that information, and I will get it back to the Member. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I guess it concerns me that we are voting on the appropriation today and we are not going to get it until later on.
I guess the next question is: if the Minister is going to be talking to the college, can he get us what other programs the college has reviewed in regard to their programs and when they have done those reviews? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I do have a meeting coming up with the president of the Aurora College, and I will be bringing some of these concerns forward. I am not sure if the Member is asking for all the programs, a list of when they were reviewed and last reviewed. Maybe he can be a little bit clearer. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I thank the Minister for asking that question. Yes, I want all of the programs that are running at Aurora College at the campuses in Inuvik, Yellowknife, and in Fort Smith. For those programs there, what programs do they have, and which ones have they done reviews on? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, as I said, we are having a meeting with the president and the administrator coming up later this month, and we will have those discussions. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair, and I appreciate the Minister for that commitment. I guess my concern is that I am looking at the college and the things that the college is doing right now. Don't get me wrong; they are doing a good job in a number of areas there. However, if we remove the Teachers Education Program and we remove the Social Work Program, we are only going to have the Nursing Program left, if it offers a degree or a diploma in that. Can the Minister verify that I am mistaken, or is that the direction that the college is going? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Early on in the session here, I had made a couple of statements in this House. We do have an ambitious postsecondary agenda moving forward. That includes legislation, looking at possibly the degree-granting programs, and also, with this foundational review that is going on, we are going to continue on that path and see how we can best make the Aurora College provide the best programs and services to our residents of the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
I thank the Minister for that answer. Thank you, Mr. Chair. I guess my concern is that I am listening to the direction that we are going with Skills 4 Success, and it sounds like we are going back to the old program of an adult vocational training centre. We are going back to the old model, and that is what is scaring me, that the college has developed to where we are and it seems to me that we are coming back to making it a vocational training centre.
Can the Minister clarify: is this the direction the department is looking at doing, or is Skills 4 Success part of that picture, or am I mistaken in looking at it this way? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. As I mentioned, we are on an ambitious agenda with postsecondary here in the Northwest Territories. I think that the Member is trying to have me make a response saying that we are making the decisions even before this foundational review is completed.
As I mentioned earlier, I think we are all excited and eager to see that report and the recommendations coming forward and working with Aurora College, looking at the future of Aurora College and the programs and services that it will provide, and the work that we are doing right across the whole gamut of postsecondary here in the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Mr. Thompson.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. My personal opinion is that is the direction that I feel it is going. Postsecondary is accreditation to develop a university. Aurora College is actually by itself, so they are not going to interlink. Maybe I am mistaken about that, but I do have one other question on here.
In regard to the budget, labour market agreement for persons with disabilities, there is no money in there presently. Can the Minister explain why? Is it sunsetted, or is it a federal program, or is there a reason for that? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Thompson. Minister Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. We are currently in negotiations with the government of Canada. We are near to finalizing those agreements on the Labour Market Agreements for the Northwest Territories, and once those are finalized, we will see what the numbers are. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Time has expired. Mr. Vanthuyne, then Mr. O'Reilly.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Just a couple of questions around apprenticeship, if I can. We have got some good programs that we either undertake or support. NWT Skills Canada is one of them, and I believe it's the SNAP program that is the work experience program that allows students to be involved in the trades while still attending high school and working towards their apprenticeships; but it seems as though, in the last year, we had budgeted $2,000,000 and almost $800,000 for apprenticeships. This year we're doing $2,300,000. We have about a $500,000 difference. Is this because we just aren't having as much uptake with apprenticeship registration? Is it a sign of the economy, that there just isn't as much construction going on? Can the department give us some commentary around apprenticeships, how many we have? Are the numbers increasing or decreasing? Why is the funding $500,000 less than it was last year? Thank you, Mr. Chair
