Thank you, Mr. Chair, and thank you for the update. It is well appreciated. I know that reaching out to licence holders will be well appreciated. I am sure they will comment heavily on that.
We know that cannabis legislation is coming forward, and the government has indicated that the liquor commission will be the one heading up the aspects around cannabis revenues. I am just wondering: can the Minister give us a little update on are we developing a full on cannabis act? Will there be a new cannabis revolving fund? How do we intend to manage this? Will it have a lot of similarities to the liquor revolving fund? I think the public would like to know what the intentions are with managing the resources that we generate from cannabis sales. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, we are working with Justice on their development of the legislation, and my understanding is that something is supposed to coming forward soon. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. Vanthuyne.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Again, with all due respect as it relates to finance and the actual development, we have indicated in the past that it is the liquor commission that is going to be overseeing this in the meantime. How are we going to account for the revenues generated by cannabis? Do we intend to develop a cannabis revolving fund, or is it just going to get lumped in with the liquor revolving fund? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Stewart.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. As the Member well knows, this has been a file that is moving pretty rapidly, so we are working on that now. The intention is that it would be distributed through the liquor commission. It will become another product of the liquor commission, similar to any other product, and so it would be part of that revolving fund.
Then, in terms of the taxation side, we will record the taxation that is outside of just the markups and those sorts of things as part of the main estimates, it would be through the Department of Finance. It is not just, as the Member has alluded to, about the taxation and the distribution. We are working very closely with Justice around some of the enforcement issues as well as with Health, around some of the health and safety issues. It involves other areas of the department, like human resources in terms of workplace safety and those sorts of issues as well.
So I think it's a fairly comprehensive approach we are taking on this, but there is a lot of work left to be done. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Nothing further from Mr. Vanthuyne. Next, Ms. Green.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Vanthuyne canvassed my questions.
Thank you. Nothing further from Ms. Green. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. So I am glad my honourable friend raised this topic. One thing we've heard from the federal government in their projections of revenue and expenditure is that the cannabis revenues are going to be far less nationally, or federally I should say, than they will be to run the regulatory system that they need to enforce the new cannabis laws and regulations. So my question is: with the Liquor Commission or liquor system as the controlling agent for cannabis, what are the costs going to be? What are the current cost projections for all the new enforcement and resources we need to put in place for enforcement, regulation, and control, versus the anticipated revenues? Because I have not seen either of those figures. Do they exist? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Stewart.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. So one of the next steps we are undertaking, and I know departments have been working on that, is the detailed proposals around any forced growth or additional pressures they'll have, whether it's around some of the things that the Member mentioned, around enforcement, as well as public awareness and health programs, and those sorts of things. The actual administration side of cannabis, in terms of the costs around distribution and what the Liquor Commission would be involved in, is not a major cost driver, but I think, as the Member identified, it's the other areas around health and enforcement where we expect to see those. So departments are working on those now, and they will come forward and I am sure will be shared with standing committee as those are finalized. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, and I agree with that kind of assessment of where the costs are coming from. It's less the administration, if we do follow this model. So the cannabis revenues that come in, some jurisdictions have committed to use all of the revenues to support public health initiatives, and certainly addictions treatment is a major concern in the Northwest Territories. So the Minister or his official spoke to how we are going to see the cannabis revenues in the main estimates, and by extension the public accounts, but what is the plan for using those revenues? Is it going to be a dedicated purpose for public health purposes, or is it just going to general revenues along the line of Liquor Tax revenues and Tobacco Tax revenues? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, first of all I think the revenue from cannabis would show up under the Liquor Revolving Fund under a separate line item, I think, as cannabis. And as far as dedicated spending, we have not had that discussion yet to determine that. It's a bigger discussion than just talking about it here on the floor of the House. Obviously we have to work with committee and get some feedback from them, and then we'll make a determination as to whether we are going to make a dedicated stream of revenue or spending for the revenue from cannabis. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Testart.
Thank you, and I can speak for myself, I am very much looking forward to that work, Mr. Chair, and I appreciate the Minister has made previous statements that he's looking forward to this work with committee as well, but it's just a little troubling when we are looking at the budget for the coming year and there is very little detail on revenue and spending on this issue that we know we have to deal with. So currently the board, or the commission, handles the enforcement of liquor licensing and those sorts of issues around liquor matters. The way forward document for cannabis is silent on who is going to be doing the inspections, and as that legislation is coming forward from the Department of Health and Social Services, there seems to be this disconnect. I am wondering if, with all the cannabis products being housed under the Liquor Commission, if the intention is to bring the inspection side of it under the Liquor Board as well. So are we going to have cannabis inspectors and liquor inspectors, or cannabis/liquor inspectors, or are there going to be occupational health and safety officers? I am just looking for clarity on where the inspection side for our regulations is going to come from. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Mr. Stewart.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. In terms of enforcement, what the Liquor Enforcement group does is really around license holders. So establishments, special operating permits, those sorts of things. In the case of cannabis, that's going to be sold through our liquor stores at this point, so the liquor enforcement folks do not do inspections there. There will be other enforcement elements in terms of the public and, you know, the amount of cannabis that you may be able to have in your possession. That really will be the Department of Justice's function. Liquor enforcement is really around, again, those licence holders and bars and restaurants, and those sorts of things. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Testart.
So one of the details, if the Minister can confirm this, but one of the details the department is willing to commit to today is that liquor stores are going to be the primary agency for distributing cannabis products in the Northwest Territories. Is that correct?
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Minister.
Yes, Mr. Chair, that is correct. I mean, the idea is that it will go through the department for now, and then as we get further into it, then I guess we are going to have to make a determination at that time on which direction we should go; but for now, it will be, yes.
Thank you. Mr. Testart.
Okay. So I can understand why there aren't a great deal of forced growth costs, if the role of the Liquor Commission is going to be quite minimal. So I am just going to return to that question: is there a dollar figure for that, or a rough estimate of what those forced growth costs are going to be? Thank you.
Thank you. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. In the absence of the legislation being passed, the Member is correct, there is no dollar figure that's tied to it right now. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. Testart.
Thank you. Are we going to be dealing with these costs by way of supplementary appropriation when the legislation is passed? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Minister.
Yes, Mr. Chair, once the legislation is passed and we have an idea of a cost, if there is an opportunity to bring it forward through a supplementary appropriation, then that's a direction we are going to take. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. Testart.
Thank you. Have we prepared for that eventuality and set financial resources aside, or will we be forced to dip into borrowing to pay for these additional costs once the legislation is passed? Thank you.
Thank you. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The department has been doing a lot of work, you know, so once the legislation is passed we have a fairly good idea of what some of the costs might be. So we have done the work, so once legislation is passed, we'll have a pretty good indication of what are costs are going to be, and then we'll have that discussion with committee. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. Testart.
Is the Minister in a position to share his good idea of those costs today? Thank you.
Thank you. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, we have a fairly good idea of what those costs may be, and I will have that discussion with committee before I have it on the floor of the House, out of my respect for the process that we go through in this building and my respect for committee.
Thank you. Minister. Mr. Testart, 30 seconds.
I will just conclude with my remarks. I respect that we need to do work on this. Again, I acknowledge the Minister has made that commitment. In considering the budget, which is the work that we have put ourselves to, I just want to make sure that, if we have known costs coming at a future date, that we are accounting for them in this budget. That is my number one concern, but if the Minister is going to do it by way of supplemental appropriation, we will deal with that at a later date, and I accept that. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Testart. Anything further? Seeing none, I will call this activity. Liquor revolving fund, operations expenditure summary, activity total, $63,000. Does committee agree?
Agreed.
Thank you, committee. Moving on to page 152, management board secretariat, $64 million item. Comments or questions from committee? Mr. O'Reilly.
Sorry, just making sure I have got the right section. The NWT Heritage Fund, can someone tell me what the actual balance is in the Heritage Fund, because I cannot find it in the main estimates, and it is not in the business plans. I will make a comment about that in a minute, but I would like to know what the balance is. Thanks.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, as of Valentine's Day 2018, the balance in the Heritage Fund was $17,110,798.32. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. O'Reilly.
