Debates of February 28, 2018 (day 18)

Thank you, Minister Abernethy. Ms. Green.

Julie Green

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Chair. So what I hear is that this is a discussion point. I guess what I want to say is I appreciate that your priority is the formula, but I want to say that my priority is the safety of the women who live in the 11 communities that don't have police and they don't have shelters. Like, they are really in a stuck place when it comes to protecting themselves from a violent partner. So I really encourage him to keep talking with the Housing Minister and with the standing committee about a pilot program to see whether there is some possibility here for us to provide safety to women in communities where they don't have it, either through the police or through a family violence shelter. Thank you.

Thank you, Ms. Green. Minister Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I hear the Member. I guess, to be clear, the formula we are working on together with the existing shelters isn't just a monetary thing. It is a service-level discussion, as well. Recognizing that right now, where shelters don't exist, there is money to bring people in. We need to make sure that those mechanisms exist. That doesn't mean we shouldn't explore what the Member is talking about.

We need to make sure we have these service levels understood so that we are getting as much for the money that we have. Then I think we will be in a better position once we have some service levels determined to reach out and figure out how we can pilot some of these things, because it still needs to be based on something. It still needs to be based on a structure. Ideas are great, but they have to be fleshed out. I hear the Member. I am just a little nervous about running out and doing a pilot until we have a service-level agreement in place that we can build upon, if that makes sense. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister Abernethy. Ms. Green.

Julie Green

Yellowknife Centre

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you to the Minister for his responses. Nothing further.

Thank you, Ms. Green. Any further questions, committee? Mr. Simpson

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I had to step out, so I apologize if this has been asked. The Minister and Ms. Green had an exchange about a funding formula. There has been discussion of this since I was elected. There has been talk of the guidelines. Guidelines have been in draft form for over two decades, I believe. I was wondering when we can expect this funding formula to be completed. We will start with that. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Simpson. Minister Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. I haven't been around for 20 years. I have been around for a little while. I guess I have been around for longer than 20 years, but I haven't been around in this building for 20 years. I made a commitment to the different family violence organizations early in the life of this Assembly that, a year after we went live with the territorial authority, we would be in a better position to sit down and have a discussion, work together to develop a formula. That work has actually be initiated after August of last year, when we met our one-year deadline. I think we have come a long way.

As I said to the Member, it is not just a money thing. It is also about a service-level determination, what kind of service levels are going to be required. We are having some discussions back and forth with the providers on service levels which will help them form what the formula will look like. My expectation and intention is to have that formula ready and available for our business planning process so, together, we can make informed decisions on how to resource family violence shelters appropriately. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister Abernethy. Mr. Simpson.

Thank you. I assume that is the 2019-2020 business plan. It is good to hear that, going forward, we will be ready for that. What has the level of engagement with the family violence shelters been? I have heard anecdotally that there is a phone call here and there basically asking about numbers. There has been nothing really substantive. Can the Minister briefly provide some details on the level of consultation that has occurred, not in general but with the individual shelters? I don't need details on each one, but as opposed to just talking to a representative of all the shelters. How much information have they gotten from all the shelters? Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Simpson. Minister Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I am not sitting at that table, so I can't tell you the nitty-gritty of every conversation that has been had. There is a network group that has been established. Staff from the department have been reaching out to that network group and all the individuals who are associated with that network. It is more than just asking for little pieces of information. We have been trying to get a sense from them about what level of staffing they require to provide the core services that they are mandated to provide. We are having discussion about those numbers.

Some of the networks have different numbers than other networks. We are trying to understand what that means so that we can actually have an informed formula. We have been reaching out to individuals. We have been reaching out to groups. We have been reaching out to them as we are trying to get some clarity on the data that has been provided. We are going to keep working together until we develop the formula that I think will hopefully work for our shelters, for our families who are struggling, families who are in crisis. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister Abernethy. Mr. Simpson.

Thank you. Going back to the draft guidelines, what is the work on these guidelines? Will that also be completed for business planning 2019-2020? Where are we with those? Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Simpson. Minister Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I can't say specifically. I know that we have been working on the guidelines with our partners for a long time. I will get the department to give me a heads-up and I will share that information with committee. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister Abernethy. Mr. Simpson.

Thank you. It has been an epic process. I always found it a little odd. I would consider this an essential service. I don't know about anyone else, but I find it odd that it is sort of contracted out. Have there been discussions about bringing this into the authority because it is so essential? It is definitely needed, yet it is passed off to third parties. Have there been discussions of bringing this into the territorial authority? Thank you.

Thank you, Mr. Simpson. Minister Abernethy.

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I haven't had anybody discuss that with me. It is not a discussion we have had. There are a number of essential services that are delivered by third parties. Avens is a prime example. There is a lot of value in engaging communities and people who live in the smaller communities who aren't necessarily associated with government, which sometimes makes people nervous. Independents can be valuable. At this time, no, there has been no plan to bring them into the public service. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Minister Abernethy. Mr. Simpson.

Thank you. I agree there is value in accessing third parties, especially when it comes to issues like this where the rigid approach of government often doesn't work. My concern is more the wages that are paid currently don't match government wages. I know, at least in Hay River, there are issues with that, with getting qualified personnel. I am not advocating the government take this over; I was just wondering if those discussions had been had at all. Nothing further on this right now. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

Thank you, Mr. Simpson. That was a comment. Any further questions, committee? Seeing none, I will call the page. Community social programs, operations expenditure summary, $28,765,000. Does committee agree?

Speaker: SOME HON. MEMBERS

Agreed.

Agreed. Thank you, committee. Mr. Beaulieu.

Tom Beaulieu

Tu Nedhe-Wiilideh

Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I move that the chairman rise and report progress.

Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. A motion is on the floor to report progress. The motion is in order and is non-debatable. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried.

---Carried.

I will now rise and report progress. Thank you.

Report of Committee of the Whole