Merci, Monsieur le President. I'd like to thank the Minister for that response. Again, my questions are really focused on the funding announcement that he made in the Great Hall here earlier this week. I know there are other funding pots out there, but I want to know about the $570 million that was announced earlier this week. Can the Minister tell us whether there is a full plan to spend this money and if that plan can be made public? Mahsi, Mr. Speaker.
The projects that we have lined up for 2018-2019, the Department of Infrastructure expects to prepare and submit to Infrastructure Canada early in this fiscal year.
The other thing I guess other Members maybe didn't realize is that, when we signed the agreement here on Wednesday, we were the very first ones in Canada to sign our bilateral agreement, so we are the first out of the gate. With that going forward, the projects that we want to do early in this coming fiscal year, we are going to have to come back for supplementary funding in the House in the May sitting for the projects that are moving forward. We are going to be going through the regular capital plan process going forward for the next projects in the coming years coming out, but I plan to keep MLAs informed on where we are in this process going forward. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife Centre.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I am appointing myself the honorary Member for the Sahtu, and I have the following questions on the fire department in Norman Wells for the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs. First of all, could she please update this House on the status of the fire department in Norman Wells? Thank you.
Masi. Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I must state that the Member looks very good today. The fire department in Norman Wells is something that I will have to look into. I will get back to her with that answer. It is a municipal issue; it is not a territorial issue. We provide support to the community governments. They are responsible for actually developing and maintaining their fire departments. We provide training and support for fire departments, but we don't actually look after the day-to-day operations of them. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I am aware that the municipality of Norman Wells runs its own fire department, but clearly there is a problem there that has resulted in a "pause" in the operation of the fire department. My question is really: what kind of assistance can the Minister offer the municipality of Norman Wells to ensure that residents are protected from fire if one were to occur?
We try to support the community governments as best as possible. Some communities do have the funding, actually, tax income, market income, the money that we give to communities, that they can actually put it in their capital plans and have fire departments full-fledged with full-time fire chiefs. Some communities only have part-time fire chiefs. Some communities don't have any; they have volunteer fire departments.
Therefore, we provide a range of training for them. We specialize in our first responder training, actually, so we work with communities that don't have any fire departments to actually give them the skills. There is quite a bit of training that we provide regarding fire training, recognizing that there is a difference within each community on the needs for training and the abilities of the communities.
The other thing that we do is we work within their capital planning on an annual basis. We work closely with them to determine what they see their needs are in the future, again recognizing that it is not our delegation. We work with the communities for them to determine what their needs are. If they decide that they want a fire department and they don't have the resources, we will work within their capital planning on an annual basis to see how much money they would need and how many years that they would need to be able to save for that, and then we will use that to actually apply for federal funding for capital assets.
I am failing to engage the Minister in any sense of urgency on this issue. My understanding is that this community is currently without fire protection. People are obviously worried about what would happen if there was a fire. They are also worried that their insurance may be invalid because there is no operating fire department. Can the Minister assure me that, when she leaves this Chamber, she will go and call the village of Norman Wells and find out how she can assist them to get their fire department back on track?
The questions that were asked of me did not say that I wasn't working. I don't believe that I am failing at addressing the issue. I do know that the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs is actually working diligently on this issue at this time. We are supporting the community. We are assessing their needs and their situations. That I do know. Our job is to support the communities. When we hear there is an issue, we are in there to see what we can do for support.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife Centre.
Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I appreciate the Minister has now provided a more clear and forceful response on this question, but my question still remains: what would happen if there was a fire in Norman Wells? God forbid, but if there was a fire in Norman Wells, how would the community respond if they put their fire department on hold? I know that the Minister is working at arm's length on this, but I would like to hear that there is a plan for response and that it's going to take effect immediately. Thank you.
As stated in my first answer, I don't know the status today. If I had gotten notice, I would have actually looked that up to see what we are doing and where the situation is of today.
I do want to emphasize, though, that community members care about their communities. If I see my neighbour's house burning, I am not going to stand around and sit there and watch and clap. I'm going to do what I can to be able to provide that service. In communities, we have community members who care as well. They will not allow that to happen. They will do whatever the best they can. We have various services. Some communities have trained firefighters who live in communities. We have airports in some communities that will actually respond to that. We will make sure we have an emergency response plan. We will provide the best services that we can to ensure that communities don't burn down. I am not going to let communities go without any fire support services, even if they don't have a fire department.
As stated earlier, many of our communities do not have fire departments and yet those communities have community members of various abilities who come together in times and need and help their community. That's where they live. Those are their parents, their families, their elders. I have trust in our community members and the services that are provided through other resources that we will take care. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Nahendeh.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I would like to ask some follow-up questions not to the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs, but the Minister of Lands in regards to assessment. In this House, the Minister said that they do their least payments based on the assessments done by the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs. Can the Minister advise this House if this is the actual process that is being done? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Minister of Lands.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I have mentioned previously, lessees are charged assessed value of land, and on the territorial lands it's 10 per cent of appraised value. Now, I don't know the method which MACA uses to arrive at these assessments, but I think there's a scientific way in which they do arrive at the assessments of the property. Of course, on that assessment is based the lease fees. Thank you.
I thank the Minister for that answer. Can the Minister clarify: does the Department of Lands get two separate assessments, one for lands itself or one with lands and improvements on it?
Of course, our fees are based on the value of the lands, so the assessed or appraised value of the lands is the number we're interested in, and on that number, we base the lease fees.
I thank the Minister for that clarification. There seems to be a disconnect here, because my understanding from the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs that they assess the land based on the land and the improvements on it. Now I'm hearing from the Department of Lands here, it's just on the land itself. Can the Minister please clarify: is this the correct process? Is this what they do? Is it based on the lands, and if it is on land, do they have a separate assessment done?
I can't speak for MACA, but I believe the way that assessments are usually done is that there's a division between land and buildings. For example, if you receive an assessment for taxation purposes from your municipality, there's a breakdown showing how much is assessed for the land and how much is for the building. I believe that's the way that MACA does it, but the Minister may know more about that than I do.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Nahendeh.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate that answer from the Minister. Is the Minister willing to share with me the land assessments of lots in my riding, so that I can share this information with the residents? Thank you. Mr. Speaker.
Normally, Mr. Speaker, we wouldn't do that, but generally in each community, you can go to the tax rules and find out what the assessments are. In that way, you could determine what the values placed on land and buildings are. I believe every municipality has that information available. Thank you, Mr. Speaker. At least the tax-based municipalities. Thank you.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife Centre.
Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, I want to follow up those questions which I asked about the fire department in Norman Wells. My question is about whether the department is working on standards for fire departments across the Northwest Territories. I understand that that is not currently in place. Is the Minister taking steps to standardize fire department funding and operations across the Northwest Territories? Thank you.
Masi. Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. There are standards for fire provision within the Northwest Territories. Our Office of the Fire Marshal works closely with the communities to develop safety plans in that regard. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
I'm talking more about fire departments. As I think we're all aware, firefighting is a dangerous undertaking. I appreciate the Minister's response that community members are willing to pitch in. I think that having trained firefighters is a better solution.
It's my understanding there aren't trained firefighters in every Northwest Territories community, so I'm wondering whether the Minister is considering making changes to ensure that there are fire departments and trained firefighters up and running in every community?
As stated, the responsibility for fire departments is the municipalities', and we work closely with the communities to define what they see as their capital assets. Some communities are still working on water treatment plants. Some communities want recreation centres. Some communities want arenas. Some communities already want the fire department. So it would be inappropriate for me to go to every community in the Northwest Territories and say, "You need to put all your capital asset planning on hold because I'm telling you as the Minister of Municipal and Community Affairs that you're going to put in a fire department. That is your number one priority."
We work closely with them. We provide training to them. We provide assessments. The office of the fire marshal goes in to work with them to try to make them understand their safety, their needs, and then once they have done that and defined their needs, we work closely with them to support them in making sure that their community has the needs to ensure if a fire happens that they can be dealt with at the community level. Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
The other thing I want to say, though, is that, if it comes to a territorial, if it gets out of hand, we watch closely. If a house is on fire, that might be something that I don't get told of right away, but if it's in danger of spreading, I am told right away, and then the territorial government has an obligation and we will go in there and make sure -- not only us. I mean, we work with other jurisdictions. We work with Canada to make sure that fires are addressed within the Northwest Territories.
I'm working from memory here about the Office of the Auditor General report that was produced last year. It looked at things like water plant operators and training. It looked at waste disposal, and it looked at fire departments. What it found is that the fire departments are very ad hoc, that there is a need to standardize the operation of fire departments across the NWT. I have not yet heard the Minister talk about whether she is willing to undertake that work.
All of the recommendations within the Auditor General's report are being implemented. We have said that many times through standing committee, in the House, whenever the questions have come up. We are committed to addressing all of the recommendations that were identified in that. We were actually working with the community of Norman Wells, prior to the Auditor General's report, on assessing their fire needs. Our Office of the Fire Marshal is working diligently at this time, going into the communities to assess their needs, to reassess their needs, to define what is needed, to support them in doing that. Once that is done, we will bring that information to the communities. Our job is to support the communities. We will put that information in front of the community municipal governments or designated authorities and help them to define what they need. Some communities do not have the infrastructure needed or the ability to have a full fire department, but we look at how we can support them in address their needs in case of fire. We do not let our communities go without support. I really want to emphasize that Municipal and Community Affairs, the department, the staff, are totally committed to supporting communities, and we do everything in our power to provide that support. I appreciate that department.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Yellowknife Centre.
Mahsi, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Speaker, it's good news that the fire marshal is travelling the communities of the NWT to assess their needs. Could the Minister tell us when his report will be ready and whether the needs will be funded in the next business plan? Thank you.
The Office of the Fire Marshal is not doing a general report and saying, "This is what we need everywhere." He is working closely with the communities to actually bring it forward. When that is done, when he does his assessment, we, the regional staff for Municipal and Community Affairs, work with the community governments to bring that information forward on a community-by-community basis.
Safety is a priority over all other things, so we bring that forward to the community, and we work with the community to define what their needs are and how we can support them. Again, we provide training; we provide first responder training; through our school of the community government, we provide training. We have other assets in a lot of the communities, such as people that have trained. Our forest firefighters, they are spread out throughout the Northwest Territories, those members, and I do give credit to them. They have an honourable job. Anyplace where there are airports, we have people who are trained in providing that service. So it's not like our communities are left with nothing, and, if the community has nothing, we will fly in, we will help that community. Safety is number one, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Nahendeh.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. I appreciate that I get to come back and ask some questions of the Minister of Lands. He talked about tax-based, and, yes, the Village of Fort Simpson is a tax-based community. However, the community of Fort Liard is a hamlet, and then the other four are designated authorities, so how is this information made available, since he does not want to share it with us? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Masi. Minister of Lands.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. As I have mentioned previously, the appraisals or assessments are not done by my department. I know, in the tax-based communities, you can generally go to the town office to look at the assessments of the individual properties. I am not certain how MACA deals with informing the residents or the property owners as to what the assessments are.
I appreciate the Minister for providing that information. I understand the Department of Municipal and Community Affairs does the assessment, but the assessment is being used by Lands to come up with a value of how they are going to come up with lease payments, so I am asking the Minister again: how is this information shared, the information that the Lands department uses, to get that out to the residents?
The Member is quite correct that, on the value of the lands, the lease payments are based. I believe with respect to municipals, which would be under the purview of the Minister of MACA, that, when assessments are set out for tax purposes, people are obviously informed of the assessment. As I mentioned earlier, I believe, I am not certain, but I think there is likely a breakdown in the assessments, in most communities, between land and buildings. I am not 100 per cent sure of that, but I believe that is the case, from memory. However, at least in the tax-based communities, then, once you have received that assessment, you do have the option of challenging it, so there is a safeguard against unfair or unreasonable assessments.
I thank the Minister for that information about tax-based communities. I am not talking about tax-based communities. I totally understand that process. The process is: as a taxpayer, you get an assessment; it has land and facilities on there; you have the right to then go to municipal government to appeal that decision. I am talking about designated authorities and the hamlets that do not have this process as the tax-based. So they have these assessments done. Then Land uses this assessment to come up with a lease payment, so can the Minister provide us this information and how it is done so that we can help the residents in these communities?
Again, I am not certain as to the manner in which MACA comes to these assessments or appraisals. That information probably could be obtained or possibly could be obtained from the Minister of MACA. I am not certain how the appraisers come to their figures, but I do know that we rely on those figures when rents are assessed.
Masi. Oral questions. Member for Nahendeh.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker. Again, I am not asking how the Department of Lands is getting the information. I understand that. The Minister has been very clear in the process. The Minister of MACA is very clear in the process. What I am asking is: how does his department use this information and how they share this information with the residents?
Because we have gone from 10 per cent to 5 per cent, but I am hearing from the Minister of MACA that the assessment is land and improvements, and then the Minister says Lands is using the assessment on just lands. So we want to know and my residents want to know how is this information shared with the residents? All they get is a slip right now saying your lease payment is X amount of dollars, so can the Minister make a commitment to explain the process to me so I can share this information with the residents? Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
Certainly, I would always be pleased to speak with the Member opposite. I do realize this is a complex issue, and we'll attempt to meet with him at his convenience. We will meet with him at convenience, and we will attempt to explain the process. I am also told in response to perhaps an earlier question that: for general taxation areas such as Fort Liard, a copy of the assessment roll is available at the community office as well as the regional MACA office. So it's somewhat similar to the other communities that are tax-based. It's rather similar to the other tax-based communities. Certainly, I would be prepared to meet with the Member. Thank you.
