Agreed.
Thank you. Okay. That's it. Thank you, committee. Do you agree that you have concluded consideration of Tabled Document 135-18(3)?
Agreed.
Thank you, Minister, and our thanks to the witnesses for - oh. Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, I move that consideration of Supplementary Estimates (Infrastructure Expenditures), No. 4, 2017-2018, now be concluded, and that the Tabled Document 135-18(3) be reported and recommended as ready for further consideration in formal sessions through the form of an appropriation bill. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. The motion is on the floor and is being distributed. Thank you, committee. The motion is in order. All those in favour? All those opposed? The motion is carried.
---Carried
Do you have another motion? Mr. Beaulieu.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Chairman, committee would like to consider Tabled Document 136-18(3): Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures) No. 4, 2017-2018.
Thank you, Mr. Beaulieu. Committee, we have agreed to consider Tabled Document 136-18(3). Does the Minister have any opening remarks?
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I am here to present Supplementary Estimates (Operations Expenditures) No. 4, 2017-2018. This document provides for an increase of $29.2 million to the operations budget.
Major items in the supplementary estimates include:
$20.7 million for demand-driven, non-discretionary items such as out-of-territory hospitals and physicians, extended health benefits and Metis health benefits, and the Residential Southern Placement Program;
$959,000 to provide for the Hay River Health and Social Services Authorities' pension plan, and $181,000 to provide increased contribution funding to AVENS - A Community for Seniors;
$2.8 million for projected costs in the Income Assistance program;
$2 million for activities under the Early Learning and Child Care Agreement. These expenditures are fully offset by revenues from the Government of Canada;
$1.7 million for compensation increases, replacement vehicles, and new mandatory equipment for the RCMP, G Division; and
$857,000 for increased grant-in-lieu payments to Municipal Taxation Authorities under the Grants in Lieu of Property Taxation Policy.
That concludes my opening remarks, Mr. Chair. I am prepared to respond to committee's questions. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. We have agreed to begin with general comments. Does the Minister of Finance wish to bring witnesses into the House?
Yes, I do, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Sergeant-at-Arms, please escort the witnesses into the Chamber, even though they are there. It's all process. Thank you. Would the Minister please introduce his witnesses once again? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. To my right, I have Mr. David Stewart, deputy minister of Finance. To my left, I have Ms. Sandy Kalgutkar, who is the deputy secretary to the FMB. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. I will now open the floor for general comments. Ms. Green.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, my first question relates to page number 4. Under education and culture, there is a new expenditure of $2,015,000. Could the Minister please tell us exactly what this money is going to be used for? Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Green. Mr. Stewart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The GNWT recently signed an early learning and childcare agreement with the federal government that provides funding over a number of years. I believe it is a 10-year agreement. There are a variety of activities to support early childhood operators under that contribution.
The first $2 million in the first year, there are some additional positions that are being added to help support the work with the various childcare operators, as well as some other activities that are included in there as well. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Stewart. Ms. Green.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, it's my understanding that there are three new positions, and obviously they wouldn't be worth $2 million, so what is the balance of this fund being used for? Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Green. Mr. Stewart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. A couple of the items that are included under the activities that are going on: professional development and training, to support training for licensed childcare centre based early childhood development programs; cultural resource development in distribution to some of the centres; supporting some additional post-secondary training for early childhood workers; scholarships that are provided to support students who are enrolled in early childhood programs; some health and safety funding; and then some additional grabs for equipment and those sorts of things for childcare operators. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Stewart. Ms. Green.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I recognize that this is not the deputy minister's department, but it was my understanding that this money was earmarked for the availability and affordability of childcare. How does this expenditure relate to those mandate goals? Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Green. Minister McLeod.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, as the Member pointed out before, the money is for the first year of this program, so this is what the money has been expenditured for this year and the subsequent years that are coming up, and the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment has assured me that he would be able to provide a further detail and a briefing to social programs. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister McLeod. Ms. Green.
Yes, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I am highly unhappy that we are being asked to authorize an expenditure for which we do not have a plan, despite the fact that a bilateral agreement has been signed. The Minister has been holding out on us in sharing this information, and now we know why. The spending that he contemplates does not further the mandate objective, and doesn't do anything about availability or affordability of childcare. So now that we have this information in public, I will have questions for the Minister of Education, Culture and Employment tomorrow. In the meantime, I would like to ask the Minister of Finance what precedent there is for asking Members to approve a budget for which there is no plan. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Green. Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just wanted to confirm there is a plan in place with this early learning funding. I can't share the full details until announcement has been signed with the Government of Canada. We are waiting for them to make that announcement. I will be more than happy and willing to sit down with committee and go through the details of the accessibility, the high quality of programs that are going to be earmarked with this $2 million for the 2017 year. As I mentioned in the House, I would be more than willing to come before committee and share the details of that plan. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister Moses. Ms. Green.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, I am not satisfied with that response. We have asked the Minister continuously over not just weeks, but months, to share the details of this plan with us in confidence as the Standing Committee on Social Development. He has consistently refused to do that, and that's in spite of the fact that the Regular Members have received details of other federal governments' funding prior to an announcement.
This is strictly a stalling tactic by the Minister to avoid any accountability on the way that he is envisioning to spend this money. From what the deputy minister of Finance has just told us, this in no way addresses availability and affordable of childcare. I am very disappointed, and there is no reason for us to be put in this position of approving money for which we have no plan. That's not a question. That's a rant. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Green. Minister McLeod.
That was a rant well taken. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Any further questions? Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I, too, share the frustration of my colleague from Yellowknife Centre because I have sat in on some of the Standing Committee on Social Development meetings where childcare has been discussed. This agreement, the Minister has continually said, I can't share details with you, and then all of a sudden the first year funding pops up in a supplementary appropriation on the floor of the House. We are all big people in this room. You should be able to share confidential information with us. This is not a way to do business, so I don't appreciate the way that this has come up.
I do want to turn to a supplementary reserve for O and M. I would like to know what the impact of this supplementary appropriation is going to be on the overall reserve. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. Stewart.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. The items included in this appropriation will make that supplementary reserve be over by about $4.8 million for the year. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Stewart. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Presumably, this side of this reserve, now that it is in a deficit position, will be reconciled the same way as it is on the capital or infrastructure side where we wait for year-end, look at O and M spending within all the departments, and determine whether there is a surplus or a deficit. If there is a deficit, it is taken up as small, short-term debt. Is that the way that this would get reconciled? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. Stewart.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Yes, that is accurate. At the end of the year when we have both the operations and the capital spending, then we will know where our final cash position will end up and whether we need to add that onto the short-term debt. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Stewart. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I appreciate the answer from the deputy minister. What is the reserve going to be for O and M for 2018-2019, and how does that compare with the reserve for 2017-2018? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Minister McLeod.
Yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Mr. Chair, the supplementary reserve for next year will be $30 million, but we don't anticipate our ask coming forward to be as high as they this year because, with a lot of the health-related items in this supplementary, we are building them into the base so we will have that discussion during the main estimates and business plans for next year, but we do not anticipate unless there is something unforeseen. We don't anticipate the amount being as high next year. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister McLeod. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Just so I can confirm, the supplementary reserve then for 2017-2018, I believe was set at $35 million; and for 2018-2019, it is being reduced to $20 million. Can I confirm that? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. Stewart.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I don't have the main estimates document in front of me, but I believe those values that the Member quoted are correct. Thanks, Mr. Chair.
