Thank you. Mr. Nakimayak.
I am just wondering: what stage are they at right now with the airlift to the community of Paulatuk as far as petroleum products and dry goods? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. For the community of Paulatuk, our eighth plane-load just took off this afternoon to Paulatuk for commodity and goods. The fuel resupply will commence when we are done the dry goods. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Nakimayak.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I am just wondering: there are a lot of businesses that have lost out on tens of thousands of dollars in contracts and business. By the time we reach 2019, some businesses may not stay afloat. I'm just wondering. I'm looking at the newspaper right now, the Nunatsiaq News, and they are talking about looking at compensation that they mention. Mr. Vandenberg mentioned that there would be no compensation for any business or anybody who was losing out. Does the department still stand by their word of not compensating anyone for all their losses for equipment, vehicles, materials for 2018-2019? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Nakimayak. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. As maybe not all Members realize, but, when you ship your goods on MTS, when you sign your bill of lading, there is no guarantee in delivery. That is right on there when you sign it. There is an option for customers to buy insurance, which we highly encourage for damaged goods and stuff.
As Mr. Vandenberg stated, we won't be compensating businesses, That is true. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. Nakimayak.
That is actually too bad. I know it's a new department, and I don't know when the last time a barge was missed. I know it was quite a few years ago. Also, in Mr. Blake's region, I'm just wondering what other plans, you know? Like having Hay River as a marine trading centre and area, it's good for the southern NWT, but that doesn't necessarily work for the northern part of the territory. I am just wondering if the department realizes that they are two different places geographically and different types of needs for the communities and regions of the territory because the way it looks right now, it is a one size fits all and it fits the southern part of the territory and not so much the northern part of the territory. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I'm having trouble with my microphone here, too, or my hearing piece.
First of all, I want to make a couple of comments on this, I guess, because I have stated in the House that Hay River is the primary logistical point for our operation. It does have the Synchro Lift there for lifting and maintaining and being able to operate our repairs on our vessels and our barges, which is very significant to this whole operation.
Hay River is a key point and it has the most northern rail link in Canada. That is where all the fuel comes from.
One of the things, I think, that has come out of this already, that we have talked about with our staff here, is we want to have a look at doing a regional contingency plan for infrastructure to help mitigate these extreme types of events. I can make that commitment here, in the House, today, that we are going to have a look at doing that for the Beaufort region.
The Member asked me in the House about Tuktoyaktuk, if we would look at doing something there. One of the things that I think would come out of this contingency plan issue would be, you know, is there a possibility of using Tuktoyaktuk for staging and fuel because there is already some infrastructure there in place. These are the types of things that would come out of doing this. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. Nakimayak.
I think this error that just occurred with this airlift going on is I don't think we really need a survey to realize that there's, you know, what they found storage for dry goods overnight and whether it would be in Tuktoyaktuk or in Inuvik. I think those places logistically can be a good place. You know, the Minister is talking about maintenance to barges. You can bring a barge up the river to do maintenance on it, you know, every year or every two years, whatever it may be.
The bottleneck on Great Slave Lake when it's full of ice and the Mackenzie River is open is the actual bottlenecks, where, you know, we don't get our goods until, and the barge doesn't leave until July or even later. Having a barge, you know, in years past, we've had them in August and now to have them cancelled in October, I think we really need to take a hard look and see, you know, what doesn't, like I mentioned in the House, MTS needs to be run more like a business, not like a government. I think we need to differentiate between the two so they have better operations for the upcoming seasons. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Anything from the Minister? Sorry, Mr. Nakimayak.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Getting back to operations, my question to the Minister is, you know, they are looking at possibly doing that down the road. That's not going to be within the next year or two years. The next year, we are going into election mode. Would they look at having some sups for possibly doing that once the study comes out in March of 2019? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Nakimayak. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. You know, the Member keeps calling this an error and he keeps trying to blame MTS and that's not the case.
As I did in my Member's statement, there are all types of events that happened that caused this problem. It all started off, as I said in the House the other day with my Minister's statement, that's why we are sitting here, was because of the high water that knocked all the buoys out, the delivery of fuel to the Hay River terminal that didn't meet spec that delayed the scheduling to all the communities again, and this multi-year sea ice that came down.
We worked very closely with Coast Guard. We are taking lessons learned from this. One of the things, I think, that strikes me the most already, and we are making plans that already address this, is our communications within our department of the MTS. We are committed to hiring another person that works closely with the communities on a case-by-case basis of people's freight.
I'm not going to sit here and take it, that saying this was an error of our department. This was a multitude of things that's a bad sea ice, non-spec fuel, high river conditions that knocked them way out. We are looking at the best we can to service these communities. We took the unprecedented event to fly everything in that we can. Those things are taking place as we speak. We have talked to every customer in every community. Paulatuk had 33 customers. We reached out and talked to every one of them. We have put people on the ground in each community to be able to unload and deliver people's freight as we continue to move forward. We have committed to getting the fuel in there.
The one thing that we are not going to do and we are going to take the unprecedented step is we are not going to herc the vehicles in. We are going to, as a department, we are looking at rebating all the customers for their freight for their vehicles for the next coming season. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Anything further from Mr. Nakimayak?
Yes. Thank you, Mr. Chair. On the website, there were three delivery dates. You know, the first one was August 12th, I believe. That would have been an acceptable time.
The Minister mentioned to me during committee meeting that the fuel failed inspection at Norman Wells. How could the fuel get all the way from Hay River terminal to Norman Wells and only getting inspected at that point? I think that's where you need to look. Obviously, like I said, somebody was asleep at the wheel somewhere. I think we need to look at this as a learning lesson for everybody. For myself, I believe in the Minister's work. It's the calls that I get from, you know, constituents, and, you know, even from out of the territory.
I think we need to take a hard look at this and ensure that the team is not asleep anywhere at any given point. It is a very important delivery, and it is a small window of operations. I think the department needs to realize that it is a small window of operations. Once that window is lost, this is what it comes down to at the end.
It is a very expensive mistake for the GNWT and MTS, and I think we need to look at how we can improve upon that in the next coming years. I am sure that they are looking at that now, so there are a lot of lessons learned, and like I said, the department needs to be accountable for it. We can't just let this fly by. The $5 million mistake is not a cheap one.
I am just wondering: what other programs are going to be cut because of this error? Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Nakimayak. Five seconds left on the clock, but I will allow the Minister to provide a response. Minister Schumann.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I will make it very quick. First of all, on the Norman Wells, comment, I am sticking by that comment. That was a fuel delivery to a customer in Norman Wells. It wasn't our fuel; it was a different customer's fuel. It was from the same supplier that caused the issue in Hay River. I couldn't tell you the exact number of litres of fuel, but it was a significant amount that we had to transport back for that.
As for what it is going to cost other programs and services, it is not going to. I have already told this House, the revolving fund for petroleum is going to eat the delivery of fuel, and MTS's revolving fund is going to eat the delivery of goods to customers. It is not going to affect any other programs. That is one of the nice reasons why MTS is outside of the Government of the Northwest Territories. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Next, I have Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I want to ask the Minister some questions about his October 18th statement on Marine Transportation Services. In here, the Minister, and he just talked about it, that there are two revolving funds that the costs for airlift are going to be assigned to. The first is the Petroleum Products Revolving Fund, and the second is the Marine Transportation Services Revolving Fund.
Can the Minister or his staff tell me what the current balance is in both of those two funds? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. McCormick.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. At the current time, there is a balance or accumulated surplus of about $870,000 in the MTS Revolving Fund, and half a million dollars in the Petroleum Products Stabilization Fund. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. That is not a very large balance in either of those funds. Will these balances cover the additional shipping costs that are anticipated for airlifting of fuel and other goods to these communities? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. McCormick.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Those balances are where the surpluses are sitting at the moment. There are sufficient cash reserves in the revolving funds to pay for these. There are resources within either revolving fund to actually cover these payments. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Can I find out what, then, the cash reserves are for both of these funds? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Mr. McCormick.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. I don't have the cash figure for the Petroleum Products Revolving Fund right in front of me. In terms of MTS, there is approximately $22 million in cash that is still sitting in the revolving fund from the last two years of operations. Thank you.
Thank you. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I guess I am trying to understand what the difference is between the cash balance and the reserves that are in these two funds.
Can I get a commitment from the Minister to table in the House some sort of balance sheet for each of these revolving funds that indicates what the cash reserves are, what the cash balance is, and so on, so that we actually understand is available to cover off the additional shipping costs for each of these for the items that have to be airlifted? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. We can do that, but I can also bring it to our briefing next week for MTS, as well. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I am not sure; is the briefing next week going to be done in public, and is the Minister prepared to bring that information forward to the briefing? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Minister, some clarification?
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, I believe the briefing will be in public, and we can supply that at the same time. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. Yes, that's great. Can the Minister also bring forward even a rough cost estimate of what these airlifts are going to cost? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Mr. O'Reilly. Minister.
Thank you, Mr. Chair. It would be a rough cost estimate, but we can bring that forward. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
Thank you, Minister. Mr. O'Reilly.
Thanks, Mr. Chair. I look forward to getting that information.
In the Minister's statement, I think it is down on page 4 here, he talks about how there is going to be a $19.5 million investment in procuring four double-hulled barges. Those barges, is that going to come out of the Marine Transportation Services Revolving Fund as well? Thanks, Mr. Chair.
Thank you. Minister.
Yes, our portion is coming out of the MTS Revolving Fund. Thank you, Mr. Chair.
