Thank you, Madam Chair. I do have a motion here with respect to this page. I move that this committee strongly recommends that the Government of the Northwest Territories take immediate action to increase funding identified for the tourism industry contribution in the amount of $600,000 for the Department of Industry, Tourism and Investment under the tourism and parks activity.
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. We’ll just wait for the motion to be circulated to the Members. The motion is in order. To the motion. Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, colleagues. I bring this motion with the support of my colleagues here today to address and, obviously, do a thank you for the hard work that our NWT Tourism folks do to promote our territory with all their marketing initiatives. I believe that although we see a $600,000 increase in this year’s budget, the fact remains that this government promised a $1.2 million insertion and has made a decision to do so over a two-year period. We’re trying to earmark the fact that we’re looking forward to the additional $600,000 that this motion be moved in the form of a supplementation at the appropriate time. The rationale for that is quite empirical in nature. The fact that what they’re doing right now is very well-targeted marketing campaigns but they’re not able to do all the campaigns needed in the regional centres that they have a plan for. They want to do things to improve tourism information in all these regional areas. There is a lack of capacity in the current framework. We know that the NWT Tourism also has a plan for more emphasis on Aboriginal tourism, so by adding this money we know that it is going towards these very important initiatives throughout our communities and infrastructure. We know that the monies that we’re looking at earmarking will definitely help with overall marketing and training, and again, adding jobs to our communities goes hand in hand with all the initiatives that we’ve put forward as the 17th Assembly.
The other area that we’ve mentioned here, and a number of my colleagues have mentioned, is the fact that we need a better presence and better leveraging opportunities with our current film industry. The Minister has even said on record that they’re looking at initiatives but, again, to leverage these initiatives from a financial standpoint, we have a golden opportunity to use our existing success stories in many of the different features, national and international filmmakers who are here, and to exploit and be proud of all the different activities that we have in the Northwest Territories and our regional centres. We know this money will prove a great asset to move that agenda forward.
It goes without saying that tourism and arts go hand in hand, and we know that with these increased funds we are definitely contributing to the enhancement of our arts with this tourism integration program of extra monies. If we also look at the economic return of what the Department of Tourism currently does with the minimal budget that they have, it’s phenomenal. The department has provided us documentation, and numbers have been tabled in this House numerous times, that the current budget produces, on average, about $100 million to our GDP. When you do the quick math it’s almost a 20 times return on your investment. As I said in my opening address, that type of return on an RRSP portfolio would be phenomenal. We know historical background what these fine folks do is paramount to our economy and we know that this additional $600,000, should everything hold true to their performance measures, will attribute about a $12 million return in GDP. Those are incredible numbers when you look at it. Again, these are speculative numbers at best, but there are enough facts in there to support the investment, and I want to stress that.
Our counterparts to the west, and I’m referring to the territory of Yukon, we can learn a lot of things from our neighbours. They have been leaders and stewards in proper funding for tourism. Their budget is more than double our budget and, as a result, you can clearly see that the Yukon model for tourism investment and the output that they do for the people of the Yukon is phenomenal. I think we just need to look at what we can do. The $600,000 does not bring us on par with Yukon but it’s getting us and inching us closer to what we see as a very good model to which we hope, at one point in time, the government could emulate.
I’m hoping some of my colleagues here will hopefully speak towards this, and the government will heed to the wishes of this committee and look at their current budget and fiscal forecast to see if we can, through the proper channels, hold true to their word to this $1.2 million and add the additional $600,000 during this fiscal year.
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. To the motion. Mr. Moses.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I appreciate the efforts of committee and the work that we have been doing going through the budget dialogue process and looking at putting dollars where we feel that has not been looked at or supported in quite a number of years. I think, for the past six years NWT Tourism has been operating on the same budget and doing a really great job in terms of getting out to the markets and other jurisdictions, while at the same time still operating on the second-lowest budget in all of Canada. Even with this little increase that we’re asking for, we appreciate the $600,000 that’s being allocated to marketing this upcoming fiscal year, and they do have a very concrete business plan, an expanded Marketing Program that would benefit all residents of the Northwest Territories, and in the jobs that they’ve been doing and the work that we’ve seen them do, they’ve been very diligent in getting the jobs done that they have set out and spreading their dollars as thin as they could.
With the inflation and increased costs of advertising and the increased costs of travel, doing business in the Northwest Territories, especially when they’re competing with other northern jurisdictions, we need to support this group that’s been doing a lot of really great work over the past number of years. We want to continue to support this group, and just from the NWT Days and the work that they did there, they were a great presence. I think they were a big contributing factor on the success of NWT Days. I know there were very interactive displays at the pavilion in Ottawa there and I know they will probably be a big reason why this government has been invited to many other functions in Canada to attend and show our spectacular NWT.
I would support the supplementary appropriation that’s been asked for by our colleague to increase it. This organization has shown, and proven, that they can do the job successfully with the amount of dollars that they have with the $1.2 million fully to get this expanded program on the ground and running and providing those dollars invested in marketing so that we can increase the return on investment in the Northwest Territories. They’ve been doing a great job. It shows that this is our biggest industry that we should be supporting on the lowest budget with the biggest return on investment for the Northwest Territories. I wouldn’t say we’re nickel and diming them, but they do need more support.
That said, this is something that we brought up through the beginning of this budget dialogue process. I feel that NWT Tourism has been doing a great job, excellent job, has been very successful and professional. For the last six years they’ve been operating on a very thin budget and it’s about time that we recognized the hardworking staff over there, we recognize the work that they do, we recognize the investments that they bring to the Northwest Territories and that we do agree and get them that $1.2 million so that they can continue to go out and promote the Northwest Territories to other markets globally and bring more visitors to the Northwest Territories.
I am in favour of this motion and I applaud the work that NWT Tourism does and the motion that my colleague brought before the House today.
Thank you, Mr. Moses. Next I have Mr. Bouchard. To the motion.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I would like to thank Mr. Dolynny for bringing this motion forward and I support both my colleagues’ comments about the importance of tourism. In the South Slave we’ve seen a great deal of interest recently in tourism and we support any marketing of the Northwest Territories. I think the department has been doing a great job on the marketing side. I think these dollars will go a long ways to promoting and improving the Northwest Territories.
We started this process and this ask for additional funds in marketing some six months ago. We’ve been in the budget process, and half the funds were received or accepted in the budget, and this is the other half that we were asking for. I think we just see the commitment, we see the multiplier effect and the results that marketing does to the tourism industry in the Northwest Territories. We feel it’s important to put this into fruition for this upcoming budget. It would have to be a supplementary budget, but we see that as an important thing for the Northwest Territories in promoting this renewable resource that we have and promoting the Northwest Territories to the world and the rest of Canada. I support the motion as it reads.
Thank you, Mr. Bouchard. To the motion. Mr. Menicoche.
Thank you very much, Madam Chair. I just want to say that I will be supporting this motion and I believe that we can do definitely more. I’ve read through the NWT Tourism Marketing Plan, and even though we’ve identified an extra $600,000 in this year’s budget, I truly believe that we can capitalize and further show the world how spectacular NWT we are, once we’ve got the appropriate budget to do it.
Thank you, Mr. Menicoche. Mr. Hawkins.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to say briefly, I too will be voting in favour of the motion. I think any way that we can help buttress very important if not supercritical industry to draw new money into the territory, I think we need to take every step we can, as highlighted by Mr. Dolynny. He’s quite right that this is an industry that draws good money, well-invested money into a return that is fantastic and, of course, in times of trying to compete with the world of interest and getting people in your area to spend money and invest money and be part of the opportunities, this certainly seems to be a worthy and well-worthwhile investment. If anything, I would be surprised if, next year, we start to reap what we’ve sown, we will start to ask ourselves questions: why didn’t we do this sooner? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Hawkins. To the motion. Mr. Nadli.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I, too, will be in support of this motion. I think it’s been a while since we have been raising this matter for some time on this side of the House. I basically support what my colleagues have stated in terms of support for this sector of the economy. There’s great potential there. There’s been some great work done. I’d like to see the expansion of this initiative into the small communities, ensuring that we have a very good marketing strategy and we basically both worked on this initiative. Mahsi.
Thank you, Mr. Nadli. To the motion. Is there anyone else who would like to speak to the motion?
Question.
Question is being called.
---Carried
---Applause
Tourism and Parks, operations expenditure summary. You can cheer when you get the money.
---Laughter
Operations and expenditure summary, $11.962 million.
Agreed.
Industry, Tourism and Investment, tourism and parks, grants and contributions, activity summary, contributions, $4.447 million. Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Madam Chair. My question has to do with the Northern Frontier Visitors Centre. We see a continuance of contributions here of $111,000. However, recently CanNor funding in the fall produced, I believe, about $1 million or so for Northern Frontier Visitors Centre. How did that CanNor federal infusion affect our annual contributions for this year? Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Minister Ramsay.
Madam Chair, that won’t change our contributions to the Northern Frontier Visitors Association at all. We will continue to fund them to the level that you see in the budget. Thank you.
Ms. Bisaro.
Madam Chair, I have a question in regard to this sport hunt outfitter marketing support. I mentioned it in my opening remarks. In 2011-12, the actual amount was $494,000. This current fiscal year and intended for 2013-14 is $300,000. I would like to know why the amount has gone down. Thank you.
Thank you, Ms. Bisaro. Minister Ramsay.
Madam Chair, the budget has gone down. There’s much debate about whether the program itself survived. My belief is that we are fortunate to have $300,000 in this year’s budget to continue the Sport Hunt Outfitter Marketing Program. We’ve done our best to keep it in this year’s budget. It’s at the level it is at and that’s the way it is, Madam Chair. Thank you.
Madam Chair, that’s a great explanation for the outfitters: Sorry, guys; that’s the way it is. I want to reiterate my comments from previously. It is imperative that we find some way to assist these outfitters to maintain at least break-even year to year in keeping their camps from deteriorating any more than they currently are. I think I mentioned the other day that it costs them right now more to maintain a camp for a year when there’s nobody there – and they’re not getting any revenue but they still have to do the maintenance and the upkeep – it costs them more than what they’re getting out of the Sport Hunt Outfitter Marketing Support Program.
Two things I emphasized the other day that I want to re-emphasize: one is that whatever we can do to fund the outfitters to the value of what it costs them to maintain their camp and, secondly, that the department seriously look at a longer term program as opposed to year to year, that we look at a two- or a three-year program until these outfitters, if and when they get caribou tags, can actually get back to doing the business that they want to do. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Madam Chair, I have a lot of sympathy for the outfitters. I have constituents that are in that business that have camps out there north of Yellowknife. The fact of the matter remains. We’ve been funding this for the past four years. The Bathurst caribou herd are not scheduled to be surveyed again until 2015. By the time the results come in, that’s 2016. At some point in time, we are going to have to ask ourselves a question about how long do the taxpayers of the Northwest Territories continue to fund these outfitters that are up there with no caribou to hunt. I can’t put it much more bluntly than that. That’s the dilemma that we are going to be faced with.
As to the future of this program, I think that is going to be front and centre during the business plans later this year. It is a question we’re going to have to ask ourselves. Thank you.
Madam Chair, to the Minister I guess I want to say that the defeatist tone or the defeatist words, I guess, that he’s saying are a real problem for me. Outfitters have generated millions and millions of dollars. It’s in the order of 30 or 40 million dollars, I believe, and yet we are talking $300,000 a year which is peanuts when you compare it to the 30 or 40 million dollars.
I think for the Minister to say we have to let these businesses go, this department is in the business of encouraging industry and maintaining industry. We have umpteen contributions throughout this particular department to various and sundry businesses to help them out and to keep them going. I think we need to reconsider where these particular businesses are at, and we need to consider the revenue we’re going to forgo as a territory and think twice about, well, that’s going to have to be that. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Madam Chair, I’m certainly not a defeatist. I’m a real optimist, believe me. I always believe that we can get to where we need to go. But the fact of the matter remains. We put $1.8 million into supporting the outfitters. I will mention this, we also contributed $900,000 on this product diversification marketing, some of which accessed this funding to try to diversify their operations so they can get into different lines, not just caribou outfitting, but different lines of operations, whether it’s getting people out on environmental photo shoots or taking photos of wildlife. Some have looked at that. We’ve put a lot of effort into these programs.
Again, this is a question of how long do we continue to put the money in there. That’s all I’m saying. I’m not taking a defeatist attitude. If we had a defeatist attitude the money wouldn’t be in the budget this year. We need to continue to support them. I’m not saying we don’t support them. I’m just saying we have to make some decisions here soon on how long that support is going to last. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Madam Chair, thanks to the Minister. I have to say that I do appreciate that this money is here and I’m sure the outfitters do as well. To the tourism diversification efforts, there have been efforts but they haven’t panned out. I think the Minister probably knows that. It’s not replacing the outfitting business that these guys had before.
I’ve lost my thought. I want to go back to something that the Minister of Energy and Natural Resources committed to when we were doing that department, and I guess I would like to ask the Minister of ITI if he would perhaps attend the same meeting. The Minister of ENR committed to meet with the outfitters to discuss the possibility of tags. Would the Minister of ITI consider meeting with the outfitters to discuss their situation at the same time? Thank you.
Madam Chair, absolutely. We certainly will look at suggesting a joint meeting. That could happen. Thank you.
Thank you. What page are we on? Page 12-28, thank you. Tourism and parks, grants and contributions, contributions. Mr. Bromley.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to do a little follow-up there. I think this fund is very much appreciated and it is a real struggle. I know the Minister is aware of that and I know the outfitters have been working hard to try to diversify, as the Minister is well aware. I’m sure that’s been helpful, but the challenges are clear.
I agree that this government certainly encouraged these outfitters to develop in this way and this government is responsible and failed in their management of caribou. So there is some responsibility here and I’m sure that’s part of the consideration as we support these outfitters.
What we have here is an opportunity for those that actually should have a viable hunt still today. I agree that those that rely on the Bathurst caribou, we’ve failed to get the herd in recovery mode as the responsible managers here. There’s work to be done and the future is bleak. But for those who use the Bluenose-East – I think that’s primarily what we’re talking about, it seems that there are a couple of outfitters there – there is some hope for. So I hope the Minister will retain and continue this support and I appreciate his offer.
My question is, apparently without significant income and certainly no income from their facilities, there are caches of fuel that are out there. Again, this government told them there would be a hunt and there wasn’t, so they prepared for the hunt. Now they can’t afford to get that fuel back because of environmental concern as well. In those sorts of extraordinary situations, if there was a situation, are we requiring that they declare bankruptcy and walk away before we help? Or would the Minister try to figure out where to try to help address that situation. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Bromley. Minister Ramsay.
Thank you, Madam Chair. We have been very flexible on how they use the funding and we will continue to be as flexible as we can be in working with them. We want to see an industry back there eventually. If there are some prospects with the Bluenose-East and those opportunities present themselves, we should be flexible. We should be working with the outfitters to see some business come back. The dialogue just has to continue. I mentioned earlier to MLA Bisaro that we could look at a joint meeting with ITI, ENR and the outfitters. We need to chart a course forward. We have to put everything on the table.
Like I said, the funding that we’ve got, it can’t last forever. It is probably not going to last forever. That’s why we need to come up with a plan. Whether it’s through product diversification and we try to identify operators that are able to look at diversifying their product, and perhaps there’s some that aren’t, and we have to try to work with them to try to find solutions. That dialogue has to continue.
So I really do appreciate the Members bringing the issue up today. It’s a tough issue, Madam Chair. We’re going to have to make some decisions here soon. It’s by working with the industry and working with ENR that we’re going to do that. Thank you.
Thank you, Mr. Ramsay. Just before I move on to Mr. Dolynny, there’s been a few questions asked here today that are clearly posed in the hypothetical and I’m trying to think of how they could be reposed. One was if you had another $5 million, what would you do with it, and if the outfitters go broke, what would you do about it. I know there must be some way to ask about some kind of a plan, you know, in the eventuality of people having to cease operations, you know, something, but clearly asking the Minister hypothetical questions that have that kind of an “if” in it, maybe we could find some other way to pose it. Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to dovetail on some of the questions regarding the sport hunter outfitter marketing money. Really, I think we heard a genuine offer from the Minister here. Could the Minister go on record with this committee? Timing is paramount and we agree. We need to look at beyond just the $300,000. These companies, these organizations want to get back on the road to recovery. They want to get back into their business and timing is of the essence. Right now, they’ve got to deal with things this spring in order to plan marketing shows for the fall if, indeed, it’s imminent. So would the Minister commit before the end of this sitting, with his counterpart, to meet with the outfitters and meet with Regular Members to come and put a plan of action together? Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Mr. Ramsay.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I will have that discussion with my colleague Minister Miltenberger and we’ll get back to the Members on that. We’ll see what we can make happen, Madam Chair. Thank you.
Thank you, Minister Ramsay. Tourism and parks, grants and contributions, contributions, $4.447 million.
Agreed.
Agreed. Thank you. Moving on to page 12-29, Industry, Tourism and Investment, tourism and parks, active positions, information item. Mr. Dolynny.
Thank you, Madam Chair. I made a note to ask this question. Last year the department added a research analyst into the fold. At the time, Madam Chair, I did have to question the rationale with that insertion. How were the measurable outcomes to adding this research analyst to this division last year?
Thank you, Mr. Dolynny. Mr. Vician.
Thank you, Madam Chair. The specific measure in association with what the committee has seen with regard to the annual Tourism Marketing Plan. NWT Tourism relies on the department extensively for its statistical work in terms of guidance, and how various efforts made in the marketing of our tourism products worldwide reaches success. So it’s a reliance of the industry and dependence on the industry on the department for that statistical research. We’ve had a very limited capacity and appreciate the support for the additional position. That has been actioned on. That work continues and we will support the ongoing Tourism Marketing Advisory Committee’s review of the annual marketing plan and, as this House will see shortly, the proposed 2013-14 marketing plan developed by NWTT in concert with ourselves. I have to candidly say the performance measures incorporated in that plan are exactly what this researcher contributes to developing and we’ve been very pleased with that presentation. It’s probably one of the best in terms of business planning processes that we use. I think that’s exactly why we needed that extra effort. Thank you, Madam Chair.
Thank you, Mr. Vician. Industry, Tourism and Investment, tourism and parks, active positions, information item.
Agreed.
Agreed. Thank you. Page 12-31, economic diversification and business support, operations expenditure summary, $22.961 million.
